their idiocy knows no bounds. For starters – THERE WERE NO BOOTS ON THE GROUND! The people did it themselves, with Nato support.  And I keep wondering – why does Fox News hate our country so much? they’re always cheering defeat and refusing to acknowledge wins?  Oh that’s right -they’re the GOP Network – the one whose slogan should be “Proudly putting party over country since the black guy took the White House.”

Regarding Libya, it ain’t over till it’s over, and it ain’t over yet.  What surprises me is how the left-wing media is so on board with Obama tripling down in Afghanistan, droning innocents in Pakistan and starting a war in Libya (acually, considering the liberal double standard, I’m not surprised.)

Pathetic. Fox News consists of the least patriotic news commentators in the country. These Bush loving knuckleheads should be ashamed of themselves for constantly putting party over country. I swear Obama could discover the cure for cancer. Republicans at Fox would
charge it’s a socialist plot. Comparing Obama’s statement on Libya to
Bush’s premature victory speech in Iraq in 2003? Good heavens. Have we
spent trillions of dollars in Libya with combat forces on the ground
leading to several thousand killed soldiers? Only far right Republicans
who hate Obama could make such a spurious comparison comparing Bush’s
disastrous war in Iraq to Obama’s successful military operation in
Libya.

Unfortunately, the people of Libya aren’t gaining much since it appears they will be under Sharia law.  That’s not freedom.

BIG DIFFERENCE!
The result of Bush’s stupid war cost us the lives of our soldiers on Iraq soil (the phcuk?!)
In Libya — NO BOOTS on the ground under no circumstances. 

Keeping the memories of our fallen soldiers n their families in my mind, I have 2 words to say to FOX n BUSH: (F)UCK YOU!

I can smell the Frank Luntz memo floating out there.

If the shoe fits……..

Except the no boots on the ground is a flat out and admitted lie.

Bush’s mission accomplished sign was about the mission of the warriors he was speaking to, and larger contingent for major military operations.  No one that day (that I heard) thought he meant the war was over, yet that is how it was spun later on.  Whatever, the banner was a dumb idea so he’s deserving of some of the related criticism.   The comparison to Obama is absolutely valid, and if Lybia ends up in a destructive civil and proxy war like Iraq it’ll be even more comparable. 

there’s only one itsy bitsy little difference:

obama never declared “mission accomplished”

and bush not only did so, he did so in the most over-the-top, ridiculous, offensive manner

evidence?

Links please? Thanks!

but those iraqis……yeah, total freedom

i love baghdad in summer these days

just like paris after a rainstorm….

Iraq total costs: 900 Billion
Libya total costs: 1 billion

Dead Americans who fought in Iraq: 4500
Dead Americans who fought in Libya: 0

Wounded American warriors from Iraq: 32,000
Wounded American warriors from Libya: 0

Number of air-craft carriers Obama landed on with a mission accomplished sign: 0

Fox News of the World: unethical, illegitimate, and the least trusted name in news.

 

“left-wing” media?  i wasn’t aware that ‘democracy now’ was on board….

they hated clinton, too

I imagine one has to go to some school to learn how to be that repulsively convoluted. Fox should patent that stuff. it’s awesome

It’s apparently how a FOx News sausage is made. People should really take the time to be a little more informed otherwise, they’re simply allowing themselves to be led by the nose through someone else’s narrative. This is just to important a moment to have it trivialized by trying to make a Mission Accomplished comparison when there is none.

I think the public at large are a little capable and unlikely to fall for that. Its fairly clear from the broader information being released, what the situation is like in Tripoli. This is a civil war in a country and the best they can manage is President Obama said the future of the country is in the people’s hands as a misstep. 

I’m reluctant to take seriously the hyperbole of any Early Morning Pundits when they start making disingenuous claims not related to the facts of the current situation.

judging from all the footage i’ve seen, there as many libyans partying in the streets
as in cairo….

and obama’s “mission accomplished” speech was ridiculously tame in comparison
to bush’s donning a muscular flight suit, and hanging a gigantic banner aboard
an aircraft carrier….

fox & friends is easily the most mindless television ever made.

kilmeade and doocy, together, are about a notch smarter than the blonde in the 
middle…..

i disagree with your first statements.  They did think that it would stabilize a lot quicker than it did (if it has at all)  They thought with Saddam out of the way, the Iraqis would form together and work out a government quickly and peacefully.  They were dead wrong.

Even if a civil war breaks out (and its 50/50 at this point) at least in this instance there will be no US bases, ground troops, etc in harms way.  We really have no presence there unless you count drones.

No, it’s not valid at all.  We did not start the war in Libya nor are we significantly involved; the Libyan people did and it appears to have been won by them.  We started the war in Iraq.

How do you feel about Kosher Law?

As far as I can tell, the situation there is still pretty darn chaotic, so I’m not sure where you’re getting your observation.

obama never said the mission was over.  he said gaddafi’s regime had fallen.

and not only that, but i don’t see any american troops on the ground.

do you?  

kind of a huge difference.

in fact, it’s absurd that a comparison has even been made. 

where did you read that?

So, it’s only a war if there’s boots on the ground? Wrong. It’s a war when you’re killing people and breaking things.

I was told that attacking a country that doesn’t pose a threat and toppling their dictator is about the most awful thing a President can do, even if Congress approves it. Do you believe that or not?

I don’t see anything like “declaring victory” in the speech trancsript, or anything close to “Mission Accomplished.” In fact, he says some variation of “this is not over” several times. It reads more like a “keep up the great effort” kind of speech than anything.

It’s time to stop all the nonsense, get behind Ron Paul. As he said in the New Hampshire debate, as president he would essentially tell the generals to go to hell, he’s the commander-in-chief and we’re bringing all the troops from everywhere in the world. I still can’t get an answer from my Congressman, why do we still have 50,000 troops in Germany and what’s the purpose of the 30,000 troops in each Japan and South Korea. Does the Pentegon think that China will stand idly by, if we get into a war with North Korea.

I suppose that means they’re not unique in subjecting themselves Canon Law or Cult Protocol, Michelle-in-Utah, but, guess what? You don’t have a clue what Sharia Law is. It varies immensely from jurisdiction to jurisdiction and in many jurisdictions it encompasses only matters which might be deemed to be law of a religious nature. Much like our heritage of Courts of Equity. Your comment really means nothing. In fact, less than nothing.

Iran. Syria. Iraq. Pick the one you’d most want to live in.

http://tinyurl.com/4253xxl

Some credible Iraq estimates as to monetary cost exceed US $2 Trillion.

Doocey just reads what’s in front of him.  The guy is dumb as a door nail.  “I’ll say whatever you want me to say boss”

George Bush and King Obama have been treated equally by the media .

If George Bush had an illegal alien aunt living in public housing and a brother who lived in a hut , the MSM would have never brought it up at all .

How about Afghanistan? You know we’ve lost more troops there under 2.5 years of President O’Bomber than we did in 7 years under Bush, right?

Oy! Idiocy? No boots on the ground? You believe that because?????? Remember questioning everything Bush did? Good, now keep that skepticism.

How do you think those targets are being obtained?
This is what’s happening in Germany, could it be that there are “boots on the ground’?

http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/0,1518,781197,00.html

http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/commentary/la-oe-schell-war-powers-20110621,0,7112428.story

BillO talked to someone last night that said it’s unclear if there are or not, but that the CIA is there.

Why do you libs keep lying about this?  The sailors on that ship put the sign up and their mission was accomplished.  Continuing to lie about it won’t make it true. 

Yeah, who cares about the Muslims we’re killing? The important thing is whether or not we’ve left footprints in the sand.

Idiot.

Ummm….you forgot a category, how many Libyans dead?
Lemmings…. war is good only when we say so….Pathetic hypocrites.

i think he means it’s A LOT cheaper to not have boots on the ground….

“footprints” in the sand?

putting our men/women in harm’s way vs.  not putting our men/women in harm’s way?

if i had to choose, i’ll take the former.  

i’m not a neophyte when it comes to this kind of stuff….

i believe war/conflict is inevitable, and that you have to always minimize
the worst effects…..

on the other hand, iraq and afghanistan were NOT inevitable.  

iran.  iran is the most beautiful of those three….

Left wing media such as CBS, ABC, NBC, CNN, MSNBC, Daily Beast, Huffington Post, NY Times, LA Times, Daily Kos, Washington Post, and on and on and on . . .

We started the bombing. We fired the cruise missiles. We beat the living crap out of the Libyan military. We have military power that no one else can compare to and we uncorked it on Libya.

Do you remember how we got involved in Vietnam?

so if the sailors put a sign up saying “our president is not telling the truth” bush would have kept
it up?  

It’s being reported that a draft of the constitution is floating around.  Whether it’s accurate or not, I don’t know.

Since when do Democrats care about the financial cost of anything?

They showed no concern at all for costs from 2008-2011.

Now suddenly they’re all fiscal conservatives?

LOL

Spare us.

and kilmeade’s intelligence level is a notch below a bag of hammers

How about answering my question? Is it OK to attack a country that doesn’t threaten us, just to topple their leader? Is it OK to go to war for oil? Yes or no?

Do you even know what’s going on in Cairo? People are waving signs that say the gas chambers are ready outside the Israeli embassy. 

Doocey’s definitely the least sharpest knife in the Fox drawer.

Iran is a beautiful country with a beautiful, lyrical language, a vibrant culture and a warm and embracing people. It will shine again. Perhaps, sooner rather than later. It is truly Spring in the region, and we are seeing one despot after the next falling with our new, enlightened foreign policy. It was W’s dream. He just couldn’t realize it. Much like he couldn’t capture Bin Laden or build an enduring Republican majority for a generation.

Looks like the left’s bumper stickers need some updates:

NO WAR FOR OIL! (except when Democrats are in charge)

NOT IN MY NAME! (except when it’s Obama)

PEACE IS PATRIOTIC (when Democrats wage war)

WAR IS NOT THE ANSWER (except when a Democrat determines that it is)

COEXIST (unless Obama doesn’t want to coexist with you)

ENDLESS THIS WAR (well, OK. Maybe not this one)

so explain 2001-2006?

you have a point.

Then, thanks for sharing the misinformation for us.

Libya has a strong Italian influence, and that will count for much.

Obama is more an ” F-Troop Back To Normal ” kind of a ( loser ) guy.

I wasn’t born yet, but I do see your point.  I am not saying it is right or we should do it, I was destroying the parallel between Iraq.

I see. Someone was on some show on some cable network and he said something about something. Did that pretty much cut through the details?

Um, i agree with that, however…

We really have no idea about China’s military. 

liberals were not only upset about the human cost of the wars, they were
also concerned with the cost of them (especially considered that bush
CUT taxes prior to starting two wars).  

I actually agree, I can’t stand them….that being said, I’m sure Mika’s got the key to the Mensa washroom LMAO!

not really ground forces.  Not platoons.  Special Ops.  Much like the ones who got Bin Laden

it’s not ok to attack a country that doesn’t threaten us…..

in my understanding, that’s not what the united states did in libya

 

your naivete is cute

If any of you have no knowledge or experience in foreign affairs, I suggest reading the following: Foreign Policy or Foreign Affairs magazines. There are other books but those 2 come to mind. Before you follow the right wing negative propaganda, invest in some kowledge. That knowledge can lead you out of the darkness. The GOP cannot now say that President Obama is not understanding enough about foreign policy. In fact they resent his achievements in that realm. All those talking negative, throwing out accusations about Libya & the US involvement in it, cannot nor ever will give Pres. Obama any credit for is successes in foreign affairs. It is becoming more difficult for them to swallow the fact, that Bush was a failure. All those now campaigning for the office of the presidency, have not a clue!! As long the most informed Americans understand that President Obama has been and will continue to be the crusader for all Americans; not a selected few, the nation will survive.

that’s true.  and like i said, i am reluctantly supportive of the libyan people.

but drawing parallels with iraq is rather tenuous considering:

1.  it was down without a standing army

2.  at a tiny fraction of the cost

3.  without a military occupation

Does your wife know you stalk a woman young enough to be your daughter on the internet?

what about Obama paying for an abortion? what if Michelle ran over a guy?  What if Obamas brother started a savings and loan and went to prison?

so, all the major corporate media is “left wing”?!

Well, darladoon can’t actually read the signs, so naturally they must naturally say “Obama is TEH GREATEST.”

thumbs up nato, but now the tough work is ahead

Technically true. The sailors did mount the sign. But, the White House was much involved, even having had the sign itself printed. Note:

“White House spokesman Scott McClellan told CNN that in preparing for
the speech, Navy officials on the carrier told Bush aides they wanted a
“Mission Accomplished” banner, and the White House agreed to create it. We took care of the production of it,” McClellan said. “We have people to do those things. But the Navy actually put it up.”

http://articles.cnn.com/2003-10-28/politics/mission.accomplished_1_aircraft-carrier-conrad-chun-banner?_s=PM:ALLPOLITICS
See also:

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-4718462-503544.html
 

i’m not sure if you missed the 60s and 70s (looks like you did), but most
left wingers do not support military invasions.  

Well Obama now owns whatever happens in Lybia so if he wants to bask in this moment so be it. We ALL need to remember this though when the country devolves into a lawless Al Queda strong hold.

Easy: The GOP was thrown out. And then the Democrats came in and demonstrated what REAL fiscal irresponsibility looks like.

Observe:

http://tiny.cc/0ft1x

I’m sure you’re sleeping through the Obama Administration, but most of them now do.

see above.  Pilots don’t often precision bomb on their own.  There’s a significant in-country presence to support their operations, assist and coordinate with the rebels and NATO allies, as well as search and rescue operations. 

Sharia law is a constant the extant to which it is encorporated into civil law varies.  You are supposed to be a lawyer but you always get legal things wrong.

Unless Obama’s directing it.  Look up “satire” in the dictionary.

Re: sausage-making 

Obviously, Fox & Friends is at least outlined and one assumes the hosts are given some suggested talking points before taking a discussion to air. (The View does something similar with “Hot Topics”) This makes me think the lower-thirds are probably used as a director’s trick to keep the discussion progressing toward break. Though in the above clip, it does sort of look like Holly Hunter talking into William Hurt’s ear, but I’m sure they’re just trying to cue the clips and keep the time, nothing more.

so why do you want to put the same people from 2001-2006 in charge?

so why do you want to put the same people from 2001-2006 in charge?

yeah LBJ  was a far right guy in vietnam

Try getting your facts right.  The “Mission Accomplished” banner was put up by the crew of the aircraft carrier celebrating the fact that their ship had accomplished the mission that they were given.  Why do you consistently get that wrong?

And you’re saying those entities I’ve named are not left-wing?

I am not those those other two people !

Fox & Friends. Which one of these three morons has their head further up their ass? It’s a tough call.

Its basically over for the Left. Everyone NOW knows the media has NO credibility left. They can accuse, yell and scream racism all they want. NO ONE BELIEVES THEM ANY MORE.

How dare you !

JFK started Vietnam, LBJ tried to win it, his own party caused the loss in the midst of the war, and a Republican had to come in and end it.

Now, a left-wing President involves us in a war in Libya for some reason, and his base supports that war to the extent that they think they can jockey some political advantage at home for him.

How times have changed.

They sure as hell do today. What country are you living in?

He landed on the flight deck in a jet.  He probably would have died if he hadn’t worn the flight suit.  You do realize that President Bush was a jet pilot, don’t you?

Ok . I’m all three .

If Fox is the “least” trusted name in news (ratings) than MSNBC must be the most laughed at name in Comedy.

Resist, we much!

no corporate media can be left wing

it’s impossible

(note:  the democratic party is NOT “left wing”)

if the corporate media were left wing, they would have a progressive
sitting on every panel (meaning:  someone from the progressive caucus)

the corporate media almost never interviews progressives.  

I’m sure the Libyans blown to pieces by our drones will take great solace that we are not “significantly involved.

Really?

What is your soucre? Mad Michelle or the Half-Baked Alaskan?

Note:

“Dual Legal System. Many majority Muslim countries
have a dual system in which the government is secular but Muslims
can choose to bring familial and financial disputes to sharia
courts. The exact jurisdiction of these courts varies from country
to country, but usually includes marriage, divorce, inheritance,
and guardianship. Examples can be seen in Nigeria and Kenya, which
have sharia courts that rule on family law for Muslims. A
variation exists in Tanzania, where civil courts apply sharia or
secular law according to the religious backgrounds of the
defendants. Several countries, including Lebanon and Indonesia,
have mixed jurisdiction courts based on residual colonial legal
systems and supplemented with sharia.”

http://www.cfr.org/religion/islam-governing-under-sharia/p8034

“There are four main schools of Sharia law:

Hanbali: This is the most conservative school of Shari’a. It is used in
Saudi Arabia and some states in Northern Nigeria.
Hanifi: This is the most liberal school, and is relatively open to
modern ideas.
Maliki: This is based on the practices of the people of Medina during
Muhammad’s lifetime.
Shafi’i: This is a conservative school that emphasizes on the opinions
of the companions of the Prophet Muhammad.
What applies within one school of Sharia law does not necessarily apply in
the other schools.”

http://www.religioustolerance.org/islsharia.htm

Non-responsive.

Darla,
As usual you are missing the point.  The mission of those who put the sign up WAS accomplished.   Why can’t our brave men and woman pat themselves on the back for a job well done?  Stop lying!

but they always interview tea party members!

(even though the progressive caucus is larger than the tea party)

another question:  how come union members are almost never
represented, but corporations are?

Lies are all liberals have.

your naivete is cute

So, why did the W White House approve it, endorse it and print it? See above.

And yours is lower than that.

Source?

Nor do you support the military.

I would agree with you on that one.

Ah, yes. Theyr’e not REALLY ground forces, even though they’re ground forces.

Got it.

You mean on the few occasions he showed up for work.

And, this hardly qualified as a mission flight. He could have just as easily been in a Skycatcher.

Non-responsive.

It was indeed a grand and glorious Republican victory.

yes I forgot. Groups of 4-5 Navy Seals, Army Rangers, or Marine Intelligence equal 1500 grunts or national guard members.

yes I forgot. Groups of 4-5 Navy Seals, Army Rangers, or Marine Intelligence equal 1500 grunts or national guard members.

Really? Been to any DNC meetings? Even SEC meetings?

Proof?

True.

The reports I heard is the pilot landed the jet.  He would have probably died if he tried to do it himself.

Clearly ,  you are the “most sharpest ” .

It was a loss for the American military, jackass.

And the war was started, escalated and ultimately lost by Democrats.

Hey!! I was just at the Dick Morris thread talking about him as a useless uninformative opinion for hire. Now here we are hearing the same thing from three more ,opinion for hire, talking heads. These people are just the morning does of propaganda hyping one contrived piece of BS after another.

Yet, the vast majority of Americans get their news from the traditional broadcast networks and we have two (2) newspapers of record which disseminate news throughout the country. I suspect a large number of people believe the media.

Why should the White House deny those brave men and woman a chance to tout their success?

It’s called GOOGLE, use it moron!

Your stalking is getting creepy.

What is your understanding based on? Was it written in AlphaBits?

What is your understanding based on? Was it written in AlphaBits?

Prove otherwise.

Is it recess at Romper Room?

Oh, so now it’s not whether they are there, it’s how many?  Really?  I wonder how many spooks are there?
And would you know if they were killed or injured? Try looking at it objectively, if GWB was doing this, what would the left be saying?   

It has no wife or family.

It claimed to be a “lawyer?” LOL!

The far left loons think we just fly around inadvertently dropping bombs with no boots on the ground calling out co-ordinates. Funny stuff.

If I buy you a plane ticket to Iran will you promise to go?  You can take a nice long hike in one of their beautiful national parks.

“Frank Luntz!”

*drink*

2001-2006

The unemployment?

Dec 2001: 3.7%
Dec 2002: 5.4%
Dec 2003: 5.7%
Dec 2004: 5.1%
Dec 2005: 5.1%
Dec 2006: 4.6%

actually I was behind this action under GWB. Much like the Israelis have fought this war. He chose a different path.

Nice lie, POS. Many Americans have died in Libya. POS.

Source?

So you’re saying we’re not the same person ?

The only thing Obimbo “accomplished”, was bending Congress over. He told them he didn’t need no stinking Constitutional, Congressional permission. No sir, he now makes, as well as, enforces the law.
Just think folks, we no longer need a Congress, or a Constitution because, he’s going to piss on them both! And where the hell is the outrage from Congress?!! Where the hell in the Constitution does it say this SOB has the right make those decisions on his own?
Why the hell aren’t you people calling your Congress person and demanding they do their damned jobs?!!

How many troops on the ground? 0

How many times Republicans said “the war is lost”? 0

Credibility and you are strangers to each other.

Answers to all your questions.

Show us where President Bush declared “Mission Accomplished” in his speech aboard the Lincoln, here’s the speech:
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/05/01/iraq/main551946.shtml

I’ll save you some time, he never said it.  He said “major combat operations in Iraq have ended” meaning the first phase of Operation Iraqi Freedom was completed.  Our big guns got to go home because that amount of firepower has sufficiently softened the enemy,  Saddam and his troops were no longer in power, we then were able to build bases, air strips, use Iraq’s airports, etc.

War is fought in phases:

Liberation of Iraq,  March 19, 2003 to May 01, 2003  OMG, May 01 was the date of his speech!

Transition of Iraq,  May 02, 2003 to June 28, 2004  OMG the Transition started the day after the speech!

Iraqi Governance, June 29, 2004 to December 15, 2005

National Resolution,  December 16, 2005 to January 09 2007

Surge,  January 01, 2007 to December 31, 2008

There it is, but the idiots in the media and the idiots that took the mission accomplished nonsense and ran with it for…how many years?  could not figure out that even though we still had well over 100,000 troops still fighting in Iraq, all their equipment to fight, build bases and bunkers,etc. jet fighters, tanks, humvees, etc.  that because a banner was on an aircraft carrier, Bush meant the war was over.  Stooooopid people with a big hate going on.  Idiots all!

An aid to Ari Fleisher was on the Lincoln a week prior to the President’s arrival, the sailors on the ship requested the banner, the advance man contacted Fleisher and Fleisher had it made and sent it to the ship.  Neither Rumsfeld or President Bush knew of the banner until they saw it already displayed….per Ari Fleisher’s book.  Bush did take responsibility for it because it was his team that honored the request of the sailors, even though he had absolutely nothing to do with it.

In the long run it was all about nothing, except for Bush haters.

Prove there aren’t, Darla.

Hi Joel!!  =)

There is no bigger idiot on cable news than Fox News’ Steve Doocy… and that’s saying a lot!!

Pure BS revisionist history. You should be ashamed of yourself. Bush and Rove were already in full campaign mode. They were looking for a great photo op of Bush decked out in a fighter jet uniform as war hero who swiftly won the war in Iraq. I encourage you to watch the video of his triumphant speech declaring the end to major combat operations essentially the end of the war. Bush showed on that day his complete arrogance and hubris that Lincoln, Wilson, Truman, or any other previous commander in chief lacked during their times as presidents in time of war. Bush’s complete failure as commander in chief is just one of the major reasons that historians regard him as one of the worst presidents in American history.

I agree…why not .

http://home.adelphi.edu/sbloch/deficits.html

http://blogs.wsj.com/economics/2009/01/09/bush-on-jobs-the-worst-track-record-on-record/

Try to refrain from using conservative think tanks. You know, the ones who helped bankroll the presidents I was speaking of.

http://home.adelphi.edu/sbloch/deficits.html

http://blogs.wsj.com/economics/2009/01/09/bush-on-jobs-the-worst-track-record-on-record/

Try to refrain from using conservative think tanks. You know, the ones who helped bankroll the presidents I was speaking of.

You are wrong, end to major combat operations does not at all mean the end of the war.  It meant the end of the first phase of Operation Iraqi Freedom, there had been five phases of OIF through the Bush presidency.  Our troops are sporting medals pertaining to each phase.
http://www.navytimes.com/news/2010/03/military_iraq_campaignstar_031110w/

Except the Americans he considers “enemies”.

http://www.americansforprosperity.org/110110-obama-calls-fellow-americans-enemies-opposing-agenda

I wasn’t.  I thought it was stupid to fight wars on 2 fronts.  History doesn’t bode well with that scenario.

Nice cut and paste job.  Don’t you routinely put others down for cutting and pasting?

Anyway, what is my source?  I lived and worked under Sharia Law.  Haven’t you pretended to have done the same?  Doesn’t seem that you have.

The pilot did land the jet but he let Bush fly the plane for a bit before landing and the President could still do it.

I remember reading it somewhere, but I am with out source on that one.

Abortion?  It’s the law of the land.  Michelle running over a guy?  She would qualify to play in the NFL. S&L, isn’t that the Chicago way?

agreed.

I think you just made my point

I have no idea.  When I was in the Navy and we returned from a Sixth Fleet or North Atlantic deployment we flew a banner.  Did you miss the part where it was the Navy that approached the White House and not the White House that approached the Navy about the banner.  Not only do you lie about being a lawyer but you lie about being in the Navy.  Why don’t you know this?

Oh, and, more cutting and pasting I see.  Does this mean you will drop that petty litte jab from your limited retorts?

I don’t know why he choose to land the way he did just as I don’t know why you choose to lie about who you are and what you have done.  I was saying why he was wearing a flight suit.  Is your attention span so short that you lost track of that?

Oh, do you think the g-forces only act on the pilot?  Or the lack of pressurization only effects the pilot?  I think you are suffering from hyperpartisanitis.

Actually he didn’t even say the regime had fallen he said it was coming to an end.

No, I have never lived in a Muslim country. I travel a great deal in Muslim countries, notably Algeria, Morocco, Saudi (unfortunately), the Emirates, Pakistan, Indonesia. One thing one notices quickly is that the Muslim world is far from uniform. I’m sure you can agree with that.

Sorry. I just never felt that sexually molesting ponies was a man’s work.

Sorry. I just never felt that sexually molesting ponies was a man’s work.

No I don’t I have ridden in a jet, biplane, and even an Indycar (scary as hell). I would say the same thing if a democrat/libertarian/Bull Moose person did it. It was a publicity stunt that made him look worse.

well that was awfully nice of him wasn’t it/

“Obviously, Fox & Friends is at least outlined and one assumes the hosts are given some suggested talking points before taking a discussion to air.” People need to remember that Fox News is not a news network; it is the media arm of the Republican Party headed by former professional GOP operatives. 

So basically every entity that isn’t Fox or owned by Murdoch is what you’re saying.

And your shilling is just plain stupid.

Nice lies- can ya tell us some more?

Sorry, Michelle-in-Utah. You raised the issue. The burden is on you. Not that you’re personally accountable enough to assume it.

That loud popping sound you just heard was me pulling your head out of Obama’s arse!

They why do you do that and your children as well?

what did I lie about?

please inform me what I am shilling?

I didn’t miss that part. The entire banner incident had Rove’s fingerprints all over it. Just like W’s photo-op in AF1 flying high over New Orleans while people below were drowning. Ill-conceived. Botched. Tremendous damage to W and his reputation.

As are you. You started at the bottom and it has been down hill every since.

I suppose I simply object to them being so shamelessly used for a political stunt. The fact that it back-fired and became a political liability changes nothing. The motivation was was suspect.

Stone that article also pointed out that his debit was built on the back of an already blown deficit. It also showed who came
in 2,3,4. Bush, Reagan, Bush. So why do you vote republican again?

BTW nice re-edit of your post

When I cut and paste, which is rare, I use reputable, informed sources, not Wikipedia, NewsMaxiPad, News Bursters or the like.

Non-responsive.

Pablo, take the partisan blinders off for a second, because your making yourself look dumb… 1st, Ghadaffi is responsible for the Lockerbie Bombing that killed 189 Americans. Before that he killed American Servicemen by bombing a German nightclub. Ronald Reagan tried to kill him when he was president, but failed. 2nd, This dictator that killed 100′s of Americans was welcomed with open arms by the Bush Administration simply because he said he denounced the terrorist acts of 9/11. Now, did he have to give up his weapons program to be welcomed by Bush? Yes. But look whats worrying many people now. The threat of biological weapons! So, tell me again why Bush welcomed a murderer of Americans into our country??? 3rd, It was ok for the Obama Administration to back a NATO & Arab league led assult on Libya, because Ghaddafi is a terrorist to America. I don’t really care about the saving Libyian people arguement b/c he is a terrorist to America! So, yes, it is OK to attack Libya to get Ghaddafi. 4th, No, it is not OK to goto war for oil. That is 1 of the 2 main reasons that Bush went into Iraq. The other was to get rid of Sadam(which I think is a cover for the main reason of getting Iraqs oil)… Look at the 2 wars Bush started. THEY ARE STILL GOING ON AFTER ALMOST A DECADE…. Look at the 1 War Obama started. COMING TO AN END AFTER 6 MONTHS. Also, 1,000′s of Americans are dead because of the 2 wars started by Bush. ZERO, Zip, Zilch are dead because of Libya

Google isn’t a source dear. Were you reading Jihad Watch of Atlas Shrugs? We have a right to know.

Just finished a wonderful history book focusing primarily on FDR, General Marshall, Churchill and FM Brooke. Churchill wanted to drive the first tank across the Rhine and pouted like a baby when he was refused permission to do so. Same type of thing.

Just finished a wonderful history book focusing primarily on FDR, General Marshall, Churchill and FM Brooke. Churchill wanted to drive the first tank across the Rhine and pouted like a baby when he was refused permission to do so. Same type of thing.

Non-responsive.

There are a few differences that instantly pop into mind.
1) President Obama celebrated the fall of Ghadafi’s government, he did not celebrate it as Mission Accomplished. Ghadafi’s government has failed to maintain control of Tripoli, let alone the rest of the Libyan nation. That does not mean that Ghadafi and his forces cease to exist as a threat, it just means that they have ceased to function as a government. They may menace Libya, but they no longer control it.
2) To this point none of our military personnel have been maimed or killed, versus the casualty rate in Iraq.
3) The Iraq war was driven by the false assertion that we were in imminent danger posed by secretly developed Iraqi WMDs. We initiated that war as a preemptive strike. The Libyan war was something that was happening prior to our involvement. We didn’t bring a war to Libya, but we did help out the right side in a war that was already going down.
4) Nation Building vs. Limited Investment. Bush’s military strategies often involved a lot of nation building. That’s what happened in Iraq. We broke it, we bought it. Though I agree that a just response to Al Qaeda after 9/11 was in order, I think it’s fair to question whether we could have achieved our primary aims without becoming so heavily invested in Afghanistan. A lot of these policies have led to us having to make deals with people that are no better than crooks and terrorists, just to put forth the image of a stable government being built. President Obama’s policies seem to be more focused, streamlined, and efficient than those of Bush. He gets what he wants (Osama, Ghadafi) by going after his targets with laser precision rather than just blowing everything up then having to rebuild it later.
5) This is more of a bonus point. With Iraq our image took a hit as we were perceived to be going after a nation, more for the commonality of the religion of its citizens to the 9/11 hijackers, than any legitimate cause. This was underscored by our failure to find WMDs. Libya presents special circumstances, and it would be naïve to think that we would intervene the same way with any other nation where a government treated its citizenry in such a manner. With that said, if we can benefit from lending aid to a good cause, which was already in progress, then why not? A point that I don’t think gets addressed enough is that Iraq was seen as a war on Islam. Many, if not all, of the Muslims who have attempted attacks on this country, since the start of the Iraq war, have expressed feeling that Islam was under attack from The United States. With Libya we are able to counter that narrative. Terrorists organizations have painted us as supporters of oppressive regimes, and imperialists set on destroying Islam. With Libya, we intervened in a conflict the Libyan people initiated against their oppressive government, that would have ended in the loss of many Libyan lives, had we not taken a stance to help the little people in their fight against an oppressive regime. It might not make an overnight change in American/Muslim relations, but with more acts like this, and our stance on Egypt, it becomes harder for Al Qaeda and its affiliates to sell their propaganda.

FNC is just throwing more red meat at their base, giving them more ammunition for their hatred of Obama.
The sad part is that FNC viewers don’t realize how they’re being pandered to.

Neither Rove or the President were at the White House when the request came in and as Ari Fleisher explained, it was his call to allow the banner.

As far as New Orleans, it was a flyover to view the damage, they didn’t want to pull resources away from assisting/rescuing the citizens of New Orleans to land AF1 and protect the president.   That decision, of course, delighted the pathetic left.

why do you insist on being the dumbest ass on this site???just admit it Obama got the job done where you repukes failed miserably …now in order to defend yourselves you’re forced to side with Americas enemies again….you’re defending Gaddafi just like you did Mubarak and bin laden….you dipshit hobbits are a despicable bunch of anti american treasonous assholes

You are a liar and full of $hit just like the Bush White House that lied about the banner.  The first lie that the Bush administration told was that the soilders put up the banner.  It took 5 years and several shifting explinations but officials from the Bush administration finally admitted it was their idea to have the banner made and put up.  First they said the sailors had it made then they said they made it to commemorate the mission of the ship and not the war itself which were all lies.  Bush even admitted to Matt Lauer that it was a mistake and wrong to do.  The banner has been shipped to the Bush library and may be used during the opening ceremony.  Bush was quoted as saying he wasn’t proud of it but that it was part of his legacy so he can see why it would be in his library.

You are a liar and full of $hit just like the Bush White House that lied about the banner.  The first lie that the Bush administration told was that the soilders put up the banner.  It took 5 years and several shifting explinations but officials from the Bush administration finally admitted it was their idea to have the banner made and put up.  First they said the sailors had it made then they said they made it to commemorate the mission of the ship and not the war itself which were all lies.  Bush even admitted to Matt Lauer that it was a mistake and wrong to do.  The banner has been shipped to the Bush library and may be used during the opening ceremony.  Bush was quoted as saying he wasn’t proud of it but that it was part of his legacy so he can see why it would be in his library.

Reaction by the crew of the Lincoln and comments by the pilot:
http://www.seattlepi.com/news/article/Commander-in-chief-s-visit-sets-aircraft-1113821.php

You call it a stunt, they loved every minute of the President’s visit, big boost for them.

You need to get your facts right and quit lying about something the Bush white house has since admitted doing. You’re the one that’s wrong or knowingly lying.

Yeah, and they have the Loch Ness Monster stashed out in the founain on the plaza and black helicopters on the roof.

Where did Pablo defend Gaddafi?

I think they do realize it. They just don’t care.

Well you read it so it much be true.

You may have noticed they like a “black guy” if he’s a conservative. Crawl out from your home made Dutch oven and stop putting on a minstrel show without face paint.

No I didn’t, you libs are the ones screaming there are no boots on the ground. How about proving that, since you brought it up.

Should be MUST be true before I’m cited by the Royal Spelling and Grammar Czar.

A massive dose o hypocrisy. Thanks Mrs. Philby!

Of course any talking head on any channel must be given talking points and as many facts as possible before going on the air. It would not work to simply have them show up five minutes before air time and say whatever comes to mind as things progress.
As for Fox News in general, they seem to alternate between accusing Obama of going too far, not going far enough, or not mentioning him at all.
They will never be caught saying he did a reasonably good job, let alone saying he did the right thing. It is a good bet that you will never hear that from Fixed News.

It was an Al Qaeda stronghold in a way. Now that Gaddafi is out of power, the likelihood of even more Libyans joining Al Qaeda will drop dramatically.

False and idiotic!
This “left-winger” served for 22 years in combat units.
Grow up little girl.

Not one American life lost.

G-forces and lack of pressurization are not critical in that jet and that situation, but it is no big deal. It is a fact that Bush was showing off. As an Air National Guard pilot who flew Delta Daggers (obsolete by the time he was flying them), there is no way he ever did a carrier landing.

It would have been appropriate for him to arrive by helicopter. The ride he chose was just showing off. I am at least partly convinced that he got us into the Iraq war because he loved the idea of being a wartime Commander in Chief. Even he said one reason he wanted that war was because Saddam tired to have his father assassinated.

Here’s a flyover to remember, thanks for the memories Barry.

http://scaredmonkeys.com/2009/04/28/scare-force-one-or-is-it-air-force-dumb-obama-admin-scares-nyc-in-9-11-terror-type-flyover/

I can GOOGLE proof of anything you want proven. There is a conspiracy theory about everything, and hundreds of web pages that “prove” any one of them.

I’m well aware of the history, Dallas. Saddam was a nasty piece of work too. You’re not answering my questions either.

Toppling a dictator because we decide it’s time he goes. Good or bad?

War for oil? Good or bad.

I’m not even staking out a position here. I’m just remembering all of the arguments against Iraq, and I’m seeing the people who were making them then completely ignoring them now, despite the fact that they apply just as well now as they did then. And it’s got me thinking, man you people are ridiculous hypocrites who wouldn’t know a principle if one jammed itself down your throat.

Actually, I’m pretty sure Fox though it was a lost cause right up until yesterday, or was it the day before, and there are still folks like you saying Libya will now be taken over by Al Qaeda and the Muslim Brother hood. I think I heard that mentioned on Fox just today. Maybe. Let’s see what OTHER sources say on that.

Where did Pablo defend Gaddafi?

What do I look like, Jeremiah Wright? Calypso Louie?

Source?

President Obama does not need to respond to these asinine issues or pronouncements by this partisan media outlet! To be sure, this mission is not accomplished yet and FOX is attempting to label the president to incite negative rhetoric. To all the naysayers and name callers posting in this and other blogs, raise your heads out of the FOX-hole and see the real world. This TEA party is already losing membership and many Republicans have lost credit ability from the confrontational narrow-minded members. Here’s an example: Workers normally pay 6.2 percent of their wages toward a tax designated for Social Security. Their employer pays an equal amount, for a total of 12.4 percent per worker. As part of a bipartisan spending deal last December, Congress approved Obama’s request to reduce the workers’ share to 4.2 percent for one year; employers’ rate did not change. Obama wants Congress to extend the reduction for an additional year. If not, the rate will return to 6.2 percent on Jan. 1. This raises the tax rate on every tax payer nationwide! If you do or do not want this to happen, I suggest you call your Senator and Representative in Washington and locally and voice your opinion. Everyone should voice his opinion and vote in November 2012!

President Obama does not need to respond to these asinine issues or pronouncements by this partisan media outlet! To be sure, this mission is not accomplished yet and FOX is attempting to label the president to incite negative rhetoric. To all the naysayers and name callers posting in this and other blogs, raise your heads out of the FOX-hole and see the real world. This TEA party is already losing membership and many Republicans have lost credit ability from the confrontational narrow-minded members. Here’s an example: Workers normally pay 6.2 percent of their wages toward a tax designated for Social Security. Their employer pays an equal amount, for a total of 12.4 percent per worker. As part of a bipartisan spending deal last December, Congress approved Obama’s request to reduce the workers’ share to 4.2 percent for one year; employers’ rate did not change. Obama wants Congress to extend the reduction for an additional year. If not, the rate will return to 6.2 percent on Jan. 1. This raises the tax rate on every tax payer nationwide! If you do or do not want this to happen, I suggest you call your Senator and Representative in Washington and locally and voice your opinion. Everyone should voice his opinion and vote in November 2012!

Do you know where Gaddafi is? If I were you, I’d refrain from writing the Definitive History of the War in Libya for a while.

Oh, they’re cranking it up. But aircraft carriers and destroyers and stuff are kinda hard to hide. We are the undisputed leader in kick ass capability. 

So, you know that they’re gonna all get together and sing Kumbaya?

You seem to forget that the easy part of Iraq was getting rid of Saddam and his military.

Pablo, it would seem they don’t want to answer your very good questions and are trying to divert attention. 

You have a valid point. The aircraft carrier and its escorts did accomplish the assigned mission for the aircraft carrier.

Now, if Bush had only siad “Your mission is accomplished, but the US mission must continue…” Then, it would be not only reasonable, it would be good leadership.

Oops, except for the fact that he played “soldier/pilot” by flying in on a Navy reconnaissance plane. That was uncalled for showmanship, and he did let it seem like he had personally accomplished the winning of the whole war.  

Wow,  F-102 that’s showing your age.  I’m not that old but would have to agree, he would not have done any carrier landings.  Wartime CIC? He already was with Afghanistan.

Iran kills lesbians.

http://lesbianlife.about.com/od/lesbianactivism/a/IranianLesbians.htm

You really don’t have a survival instinct, do you?

Right, they’re the wrong kind of ground forces, so their boots being on the ground doesn’t count as boots on the ground.

You are spinning like a top.  Every ship has a committee that plans for their homecomings, it was in one of the meetings where the sailors decided they wanted a mission accomplished banner.  As I said earlier, an aid to Ari Fleisher was on board as part of an advance team, the sailors asked him for the banner, he contacted Fleisher and Fleisher had the banner made.  Bush wasn’t even at the White House when the request came in, Fleisher made the call.

From Comdr. Conrad Chun, a Navy spokesman:

“The banner was a Navy idea, the ships idea.  The idea popped up in one of the meetings aboard the ship preparing for it’s homecoming and thought it would be good to have the banner “Mission Accomplished.”  The sailors then asked if the White House would have the sign made….”The banner signified the successful completion of the ship’s deployment.”
http://www.historycentral.com/navy/CVN72Lincoln.html

I am totally shocked that none of our proggies have anything to say about this. Shocked, I tell ya!

and yet we heard nothing from you socalled cons-ervatives. do your damn math 2.75 years don’t stack up against 8 years of BS!

Fox & Friends are just so pathetic.The stupid panel just didn’t know what to say this morning.

I do recall libya was involved in  a plane exploding over lockerbie… wow how easily  cons have selective memories.

Al Jazeera. Via MEMRI.

http://tinyurl.com/3vflzwb

Pablo, I did answer both of your questions. Maybe you didn’t read my whole post, but I will cut and paste both answers to ur questions….

Is it OK to invade a country to topple a leader?
 It was ok for the Obama Administration to back a NATO & Arab league led assult on Libya, because Ghaddafi is a terrorist to America. I don’t really care about the saving Libyian people arguement b/c he is a terrorist to America! So, yes, it is OK to attack Libya to get Ghaddafi.

Is it OK to start a war for oil?
 No, it is not OK to goto war for oil. That is 1 of the 2 main reasons that Bush went into Iraq. The other was to get rid of Sadam(which I think is a cover for the main reason of getting Iraqs oil)… Look at the 2 wars Bush started. THEY ARE STILL GOING ON AFTER ALMOST A DECADE…. Look at the 1 War Obama started. COMING TO AN END AFTER 6 MONTHS. Also, 1,000′s of Americans are dead because of the 2 wars started by Bush. ZERO, Zip, Zilch are dead because of Libya  

Oh, there you go looking at what Bush actually said instead of what ‘the intelligentsia” has decided to tell you he said. There goes your ration.

maybe  all the networks you listed know something that FIXED-NEWS don’t know… how to report the news, not to create the news!

That you know of. Yet.

The true is that the “mission accomplished” sign was not put up for Pres Bush.  It was where it was because that ship had just returned from an extended deployment and the Command staff wanted to let the crew know how appreciated they were.  The particular place Pres. Bush was standing when he gave his speech is because all the crew wanted to see him and that was the best viewable spot on the ship.
I saw an interview with the Chief Executive Officer of that Ship.  It is quite obvious that facts mean nothing anymore.

The true is that the “mission accomplished” sign was not put up for Pres Bush.  It was where it was because that ship had just returned from an extended deployment and the Command staff wanted to let the crew know how appreciated they were.  The particular place Pres. Bush was standing when he gave his speech is because all the crew wanted to see him and that was the best viewable spot on the ship.
I saw an interview with the Chief Executive Officer of that Ship.  It is quite obvious that facts mean nothing anymore.

There is a thought I’ll bet we could get a collection going.
I love Pres. Bush.  He was at Ft. Hood before this phony commander-in-chief even got his teleprompter turned on.
He acts as support for our troops as a regular citizen.   He has been a gentleman and a great example of what leaders should act like after leaving public office.
What will the whinner-in-chief do?  it will not be the gracious things done by President George W. Bush.  You can take that to the bank.

So very typical of the “lil foxies, knocking Obama for something that was done the right way with a desired outcome.  Had Bush accomplished Afghanistan in this way we wouldn’t still be there today.

You have to understand that some people like Pablo truly believe Fixed News that is Republicans are always good and Democrats are always bad. Obama could find a cure for cancer and Fixed News followers like Pablo would believe that it was somehow a socialist plot not the real cure.

So, Dallas, it’s OK for America to depose the leader of a country as long as he’s hiding leading from behind? Bush had UN approval. Bush had a bigger coalition than went into Libya. Bush had Arab support. Bush had one more very important thing that Obama didn’t bother to get; Congressional approval.

As for Gaddafi, he was doing terrorist stuff against us a long time ago. I was in Germany when that club blew up. I was there when Reagan smacked his ass, and gave the French a little love tap as well. But Gaddafi was not a threat, as he’d learned the error of his ways from Saddam Hussein. That’s why his nuclear program was relocated to Oak Ridge, Tennessee in 2003. That’s why he was removed from the State Sponsors of Terrorism list in 2006. He got out of the business.

http://www.cfr.org/libya/libya-got-off-list/p10855#p4

This wasn’t our war. This was Europe’s war. For oil.

So, Dallas, it’s OK for America to depose the leader of a country as long as he’s hiding leading from behind? Bush had UN approval. Bush had a bigger coalition than went into Libya. Bush had Arab support. Bush had one more very important thing that Obama didn’t bother to get; Congressional approval.

As for Gaddafi, he was doing terrorist stuff against us a long time ago. I was in Germany when that club blew up. I was there when Reagan smacked his ass, and gave the French a little love tap as well. But Gaddafi was not a threat, as he’d learned the error of his ways from Saddam Hussein. That’s why his nuclear program was relocated to Oak Ridge, Tennessee in 2003. That’s why he was removed from the State Sponsors of Terrorism list in 2006. He got out of the business.

http://www.cfr.org/libya/libya-got-off-list/p10855#p4

This wasn’t our war. This was Europe’s war. For oil.

Haha, what are you gonna do about it, boy.

What you don’t realize is that the republican party is being put between a hammer and an anvil by Big Black Barry, and after the hammer falls you will really be asking what happening and looking for conservatives to pick up the pieces with. As unpopular as the dems and obama are ATM, the repubs are worse off. with their lower popularity ratings.

If you weren’t so poorly educated, you might understand why what Obama has done in Lybia is all above board in following the constitution 100% and complying with the War Powers Act of 1973, in which every admin since its inception has insisted that it is unconstitutional, while complying with said act.

Where in the hell did you get your education that you don’t know a goddamned thing about the constitution, Texas?

No, not the Muslim Brotherhood. But there are some rather disturbing al-Qaeda convoys exiting Libya with what used to be Libya’s armaments.

http://tinyurl.com/3wv67um

@4b2d2c680756434c888f6da020108b35:disqus Yup. I’m so old most folks I’m Tea Party.

As for the C in C comment, Afghanistan alone wasn’t big enough for him. Any president can handle just one little war like that and not go down in history as another Washington/Lincoln/Roosevelt/Truman type. What president wouldn’t want to be the American (equivalent to) Churchill?

WHAT WAR ?

Since when has any dictator used a gas chamber (not counting Hitler, of course)? That gas chamber talk smacks of Glenn Beck. These days, bullets are much cheaper and less hazardous to the environment than gas chambers. (US military has removed the lead cores.)

That reminds me. Time to go check on Beck’s Restoring Courage — in Israel — activities.

Why would he or anybody else stalk a Stank ho like you

 Funny im a left winger and served in the first Iraq war. Keep painting things with a broad brush and eventually you may get a crappy painting out of it.

Took em 5 years to end it but he ended it,then got his ass kicked out of office

lol yea before he got canned by the national guard and he was an air national guard pilot he doesn’t know how to land on an aircraft carrier. He flew F-106s back in the late 60s early 70s. He landed on a carrier in an A-6 he wouldn’t know the first thing on how to operate a plane like that.

I can fly the jet for a little bit as well Rio, and so can you that means nothing

In all honesty, Eisenhower put the first troops on ground as observers.. Eisenhower’s foreign policy was marked by “the brave new world of CIA-led coups and assassinations. Kennedy feared the soviets, listened to Eisenhower and the CIA and moved on it. later to know it was CIA propaganda and tried/would have pulled out if he remained alive. The rest is ummm.. History…

Obama though, did run on no more wars.. silly people belived him.

You got to be kiddign me…is this a joke?….u know whateve respect i have for fox news seriously goes out the window day by day, program by program…..its getting to the point now where i would have more respect for them if they just admitted that they tilt to the right and / or that there not fair and balanced then ….

The best part of this clip was the last words in it… “Forget about the media”

Ooo, poor Lil’ Barry having take a bit of criticism.  My, my my how his cult members take such offense.  LOL!

They have some real pieces of work at FoxNews but Doocy is the biggest little bitch ass douche bag there.

Nice try by FOX. It’s not like he dressed up in a flight suit and strutted across an aircraft carrier deck.

and you know what mission was accomplished under Obama: getting Osama. That still drives them nuts.

The GOP didn’t give a crap about debts when Bush turned the Clinton surplus into a massive deficit.

And they never once held a hearing about all the money wasted in Iraq due to fraud waste and abuse by contractors. And they never inquired about the $8.8 million that was lost off a truck in Iraq.
And let’s not forget that Reagan was the first president to send the debt sky-high.
GOP = party of fiscal responsibility

“Deficits don’t matter.”
– Republican V-P Dick Cheney

No, his sign was about filming what he thought would be great footage for a campaign commercial.

Let me be clear, one thing we can ALL agree on is, Barack Obama is the dumbest president since the Great Depression.

It is ridiculous for a throw away phrase like mission accomplished to have become such a big story. Everyone is over reacting to it just like they did with Bush.
Do you folks realize that the politicians, pundits and the entire MSM has won in their efforts to divide us if this kind of acrimony has erupted?

It is ridiculous for a throw away phrase like mission accomplished to
have become such a big story. Everyone is over reacting to it just like
they did with Bush.

Do you folks realize that the politicians, pundits and the entire MSM
has won in their efforts to divide us if this kind of acrimony has
erupted?

It is ridiculous for a throw away phrase like mission accomplished to
have become such a big story. Everyone is over reacting to it just like
they did with Bush.

Do you folks realize that the politicians, pundits and the entire MSM
has won in their efforts to divide us if this kind of acrimony has
erupted?

Nobody said this would be the death of Al Qaeda. And nobody claims that all weapons will be accounted for and handed over to NATO.
I say Gaddafi was a terrorist himself, and probably paying Al Qaeda to leave him alone as well as make trouble for the rest of the world. I expect that Al Qaeda has just lost a major source of oil income.  

No.

Not likely but we shall see…we shall, indeed, see.

I know I may look like a liberal Pollyanna doing a knee-jerk defense of Obama on this, but I have considered it carefully and I appreciate that you did not do a knee-jerk reaction attack. 

I think there is at least a 50/50 chance that Libya will settle down to be a country that uses its oil wealth for good, not evil. It doesn’t need to be a full-fledged democracy to do that, but of course it cannot replace one dictatorship with another. The fact that many Libyans, especially the smartest ones, fled that country to the West, not Iran or even Saudi Arabia, bodes well for Libya’s future.

It has been shown that a large number (how large? Not known.) of Libyans joined Al Qaeda, but I’m inclined to believe that they were the least educated and most willing to blow themselves up for a cause they could believe in. They could not believe in Gaddafi’s Libya. But they just might believe in the new Libya’s future.

Hey I just want to point out it doesn’t matter whether you are Republican or Democrat, no matter what happens the President is still black. And Kenyan. And a Socialist. TeaScrotes rule.

putting our men/women in harm’s way vs.  not putting our men/women in harm’s way?

if i had to choose, i’ll take the former. 

So, if you had your way, Osama would still be alive, right? So, Obama screwed that one up, right?

I think you don’t understand the situation. Perhaps when they down an airliner, it will become a bit clearer for you.

But hey, we got Gadaffi, right? Even though that wasn’t supposed to be our mission. Wait, what? He’s still out there somewhere?

Nevermind.

By the way, that response was to the current Libya conflict, not the Vietnam war, but intervening posts will confuse folks about that.

I tend to think tactically, Spawn. I’m looking at how we reached in and got tangled up with the tar baby that was Vietnam. One glaring difference is the lack of laser guided cruise missiles. There are certainly others.

Now for what happened in Vietnam. It goes all the way back to before WW II. France had colonized Vietnam, then lost it when Japan invaded it. At the end of the war, Japanese troops were allowed to stay there and stay  armed as a police force until the French sent troops back.

Meanwhile, communism was rising in the region, and everybody was choosing up sides in the Cold War. The other effect of WW II was communists getting North this and North that, while capitalists got South this and South that.

So, the French are trying to defend their colonial rule and capitalism, but they are losing to the communists, and we, as God and Communism fearing capitalists, took on more and more responsibility for what the French could not do. Maybe you have heard of the Domino Theory? If we let South Vietnam fall, the rest of the world would suddenly turn communist. That’s pretty dumb, and it is/was LIBERALS who called Bullshit! on the whole thing.

Note that this is exactly like our defense of South Korea, except that the terrain and the enemy’s methods were very different.

You conveniently don’t want to know that because it doesn’t fit your prejudices.

But doesn’t this put Obama in exactly the same position Nixon was in?
I mean trying to end the war is a way that salvages something, and definitely not able to pull out on Day One of his administration. It is a tough position to be in, and there are plenty of folks who will criticize no matter what he does.

And you’re a racist idiot…..I’m convinced of that.

But doesn’t this put Obama in exactly the same position Nixon was in?

Yeah, but he seems to be shuffling his feet a bit.. I doubt I would be asking the Pentagon on their opinion, seeing their job is to war. I assume he is waiting to withdraw for political purpose at end of first term.. so it remains in the minds of voters he pulled out..I doubt this will include Iraq..another new base in the middle east..

I personally do not see the need for these wars.. no matter who ends up with the oil. The terror threat is gone here if we wish it gone.. ofcourse thats propaganda too.. Helps expand Government into private lives.  If not for our environmentalist here in America, we would drill here and have plenty. With less American death. As a biproduct..oil prices “should” go down.. course, why would the companies want to sell cheaper..they are raping us already? six of one..half dozen the other..

@PabIo:disqus
It was strategy, not tactics, that got us tangled up in Vietnam.

I just finished posting to Good Lt about Vietnam in this same area. I hope you will take a look at it. I compared what happened in South Vietnam with what happened in South Korea. Both wars were about the same thing, and had exactly the same cause. Communism was spreading after WW II, and the bad guys got North X while the good guys got South X. The bad guys tried to take South X away from the good guys, so the good guys fought back.

The single most significant differences between the Korean War and the Vietnam war were the terrain (jungle hides everyting), the troops and their tactics (guerrilla war vs. conventional war), and infrastructure. There were no communist targets in South Vietnam that were worthy of cruise missiles, even if we did have them then. We did have plenty of bombers, but all they could go after were bridges that could easily be rebuilt and convoys of supplies that had multiple routes available to them. The Ho Chi Min Trail was not just one trail. The jungle canopy hid concentrations of troops, and the Vietcong dug tunnels so deep that even conventional bombs didn’t destroy them.

We did bomb North Vietnam, but we didn’t have cruise missiles then, and even if we did have them, they wouldn’t do more damage than our conventional bombers did at that time. We still fly the B-52 today.

Here is a simple rule about tactics and strategy. If there are generals and admirals involved, it is strategy. Tactics is for officers below the rank of general/admiral. Of course, every presidential decision must be strategy. When presidents get involved in tactical operations, they muck it up. Just ask Jimmy Carter.

Amen Brotha!  It’s obvious the memo went out in the FOX Newsroom to make this a “Mission Accomplished” moment.  It started with Dick Morris on Hannity and Fox and Friends ran with it.  Hmmm where have we seen this before? Can anybody on FOX News think for themselves?

Fox and Friends.
Snarky little bitches. That goes for the women, too.

Fox and Friends.
Snarky little bitches. That goes for the women, too.

The Myth of the Clinton Surplus

http://www.craigsteiner.us/articles/16

Haliburton was constantly investigated, so was Blackwater.  Also,  a book was written in 2009 about five years of hearings and 250,000 pages worth of investigations into fraud in both theaters, fraud that continues under the Obama administration.

BTW, if there were no hearings or oversight, how did so many private contractors get debarred from working in both theaters?

http://www.devex.com/en/blogs/development-assistance-under-obama/in-us-war-contracting-a-problem-on-accountability-of-contractors?g=1

http://jonathanturley.org/2011/05/23/kabul-bank-officials-cited-in-secret-report-for-stealing-a-billion-dollars-in-aid/

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f5M_Ttstbgs

Go back and read his speech.

“Paranoia strikes deep. Into your heart it will creep.”
Buffalo Springfield  – For What It’s worth.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wm6NeM-6vBE&feature=related

Perhaps, hubby has had me operating a dozer, driving tractors and attempted to talk me into operating his old Northwest crane shortly before that thing croaked but at 5’3″ and 115 lbs, those levers of power were something I did not think I could handle.  I seriously doubt,  even given the Cliff Notes version of taking off and landing a F-102, that I could do it.  It really sticks in many a lefties craw that President Bush did fly those babies, credit where credit is due.

Forgive me, just had to post this, lol.

http://zionstrumpet.com/2010/09/28/george-w-bush-flew-fighter-jets-obama-cant-figure-out-how-to-negotiate-an-umbrella/

Umm, he flew the Delta Dagger(F-102) not the Delta Dart(F-106).  My hubby was an air traffic controller(Navy) in the late 60′s early 70′s but we certainly wouldn’t want him in the control tower today.

Check this one out:

http://michaelinmi.wordpress.com/2010/03/06/debunking-stupid-liberal-memes-part-i-president-george-w-bush-is-an-idiot/

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rYYCiaHhnx4

Agreed. What we did in Libya was to stop a cleansing of non-Gaddafi supporters. To use the doctrine that we should not attack a country that did not threaten us is an oversimplification of our policies. We stopped a slaughter of people due to a request of the U.N.. We intervened with a coalition of countries to stop a mass murder by a confirmed mass murderer. If the status quo had been upheld, we wouldn’t have been there.
We have done this many times in the past.

@ Pablo
Your questions aren’t simple black and white answers.
“Toppling a dictator because we decide it’s time he goes. Good or bad?”
- That depends entirley upon what actions he is taking at that time. If he is invading another country, perhaps it is a good thing/perhaps it is not. If he is commiting genocide in his country, it is probably a good time to get involved if it is only to evacuate the citizens.
“War for oil? Good or bad?”
- In the broadest terms, that is simply bad. To kill for a possession is bad. The war has to have other merit besides the fact that you want a countries resources for your own.

@ Pablo – Bush did NOT have the U.N. approval. On September 16, 2004 Secretary-General of the United Nations Kofi Annan, speaking on the invasion, said, “I have indicated it was not in conformity with the UN Charter. From our point of view, from the charter point of view, it was illegal.”[1]

@ Pablo. We fired missles – that is pretty much it. Our allies did the heavy lifting and shouldered the brunt of the costs. It is amazing how in one sentence you deride the President ’…he’s hiding leading from behind?(which is a direct talking point phrase) and in the other you state ‘We beat the living crap out of the Libyan military’. For the most part, those two statements seem somewhat contradictory. If we beat the crap out of them, it doesn’t seem like we were hiding much. If we were leading from behind it is ironic that we fired the first missles. We sent in cruise missles first to stop his advancement on a very large populace he was going to slaughter – but we actually had U.N. approval – unlike Bush in Iraq. I know you falsely stated earlier that Bush had the U.N. approval, but if you look at what Koffi Anan stated at the time, it pretty much refutes that.

@Pablo…I now see you are not seriously debating. Troops on the ground for Osama was limited to a very small surgical operation. A cruise missle strike would have wiped away a great opportunity to gather intelligence. Theer is no way you cannot see the difference between the two.
Right now, you are arguing in bad faith. The point of this discussion should be a friendly, honest discourse about Libya. You are arguing wildly and throwing out everything to defend your position whether it is logical or not.

The U.S. did NOT attack Lybia NOT on ground troop was there, it was the UNITED NATIONS that set the No FLY ZONE. It was the Brits and other countries that took the lead NOT THE U.S. Get your facts straight before you speak 

The U.S. did NOT attack Lybia NOT on ground troop was there, it was the UNITED NATIONS that set the No FLY ZONE. It was the Brits and other countries that took the lead NOT THE U.S. Get your facts straight before you speak