“So much always roils us in America, and so much always will. But maybe as 2010 begins and the ’00s recede, we should think more about the noneconomic issues that leave us uneasy, and that need our attention. Not everything in America comes down to money. Not everything ever did.”

I’m glad Peggy Noonan would rather focus on the uncomfortable realization that not everyone in America agrees with her cultural views by suggesting our obsession with the economy is demonstrative of our UNQUENCHABLE LUST FOR WEALTH!

Personally I only have an unquenchable lust for steady employment but that’s just me.

Thank you Kevin! You may have no idea how much that petty and ignorant article Peggy Noonan wrote upset me. I was more offended by her article than I was by anything Adam Lambert did on the AMAs. In fact I LOVED his AMA performance. I do believe Noonan’s article was STRAIGHT homophobia. How Noonan can suggest that everything wrong with America is due to Adam Lambert is shear stupidity! The shock value is that her editor allowed such a trashy piece of filth to be released for public consumption. Noonan is condemning and oppressing Gay Americans the way America shackled Black Americans. Before the Black Americans were freed America suppressed WOMEN! Before WOMEN in America were liberated and given the same freedoms as the men in America we raped, pillaged and killed the American Indians! What does Noonan want us to do with Adam Lambert? Strip him void of all of his artist expression? Ban him from the public eye? Deprive him of his Constitutional Rights? This entertainer is a pioneer in his industry! He is causing a revolution of change musically and culturally and he is doing it as himself! He did not stand up and say I want to be the Poster Boy for Gay Rights. He stood up for himself as a person, as an individual! He proudly and couragously said this is me, this is what message I want to give you. This is what I want to show and teach you – my music, my gift; if you will. Now the paranoid and intimidated may run and cower away from such a wonderful gift. But, I intend to embrace Adam Lambert, his gifts, and open my heart and mind to ALL THAT HE EMBODIES. His TRUTH. I believe that is how we grow as individuals, as Americans and as a Country. I want to live my life with my EYE WIDE OPEN, not squinting half closed as Noonan lives hers in abhorrance. I do not want to socialize with the decaying and decrepit views of Noonan and her parochial consorts. Although I can’t see how anyone would befriend such a “person”. I do not want to enslave anyone. I do not want to deprive Adam Lambert anything. I want to FREE ADAM LAMBERT. I believe that standing with Adam Lambert and his art will save our Nation from itself. By stopping Noonan’s message of hatred, violent and complete intolerance of Adam Lambert from impregnating the minds of others I believe we can liberate ourselves. Save the world from BIGOTS like Noonan. Let us take a stand this year in 2010 and lets get behind Adam Lambert. Lets change America for the better. Let us as a NATION emancipate Adam Lambert. Let us as a Nation make this world a better place for our children and their children. It is time to turn away from ugly people like Noonan and it is time for a change. FREE ADAM LAMBERT! Mr. President are you listening?!

Why does Mediaite allow such disconnected logic even if the sniveling author doesn’t even pretend to proof-read…Or perhaps, and this is the scary part, it did.

Mindless conclusions based on your intended advance of your personal agenda will never offer truth to anyone other than your fellow psychotics..Deal with it.

I would love to hear what typos you speak of, Winghunter, if you think I didn’t proofread.

If you have a criticism, I always think it’s best to offer support for what you’re saying. Wanna try again?

Kevin is spot on! I read it and like Media Matters, I had a big problem with her contention that basically our discourse has become vulgar but, she never mentioned the Nazi signs with Obama photos, the gun toteing loons that showed up at townhalls where the president was speaking, the witch doctor photo of Obama, complete with a bone in his nose and the general tone and incoherency of a bunch of rude, loud, uneducated, teabagging idiots who kept screaming about government programs while clearly content to continue sucking off that government run Medicare but, to Nooners, it’s Adam Labmbert who’s the problem? Put down the bourbon Peggy dear!

Winghunter is apparently incapable of posting a comment today without using the word “sniveling.” Someone get it a tissue.

I didn’t find Noonan’s article terribly enthralling, but I believe to describe it some type of anti-gay polemic is a misread. Peggy didn’t seem so much offended about Mr. Lambert’s sexual orientation as she was about the fact he performed at prime time on a major network where he “uncorked an act in which he, in the words of various news reports the next day, performed ‘faux oral sex’ featuring ‘S&M play,’ ‘bondage gear,’ ‘same-sex makeouts’ and ‘walking a man and woman around the stage on a leash.’” I’m young and consider myself pretty open-minded, but not surprised some people took offense to such a performance. Her criticism of Lambert fits into a larger narrative about the creeping, vulgar obsession with notoriety (cf. Octo-Mom, the Salahis) that seems to manifest a new sideshow everyday in this country.

as*

And as I would say, Pat, there’s a difference between thinking that what Lambert did was inappropriate and thinking it is killing America’s “family values.” A big difference.

I often disagree with Peggy Noonan, but she tries very hard to capture what is going on outside New York as well as what she experiences personally in the Big Apple.

I’ve heard about this Adam Lambert character, but have never seen him nor have any wish too. Noonan is right when she says Middle America does not care to see Adam Lambert either.

It is all too simple to accuse someone of homophobia, falsely. I suspect Noonan does not much care what someone on Mediaite has to say about her. But the criticism does diminish this website, which does not have all that much prestige to begin with.

Ms. Noonan makes a big leap from polls showing worries about the future to her focus on a cultural issue. Personally, I don’t think one has much to do with the other, primarily because the “kids will not be better off” discussion was actually started by Perot in ’92 and I don’t know that it’s found solid footing, since.

But, it seems the author of this piece is making an equally broad leap, one which Ms. Noonan mentions, when they equated her shorthand about the aggressive side of popular culture with homophobia.

There are homosexuals throughout pop culture and society at large. One of the most popular daytime hosts is a lesbian and several well-loved actors are gay; There are homosexuals throughout all of American society and though there are some close-minded folks, I don’t think anyone would say that outright bigots are more than just a minority.

Adam Lambert made a choice to put on an in-your-face, aggressive performance that I gather was unlike anything previous in that show. A couple of days later, he tried to say that his performance was no different than another performer breaking a couple of bottles, which I’m sorry, it’s a bit like saying that Jerry Lee Lewis kicking away his piano stool is the same as Pete Townsend smashing guitars.

Not to mention that Ms. Noonan’s mistaken beliefs about the poll is another example of the big-city arrogance on which her piece, ridiculously focused.

Adam Lambert performed on a show, where a lot of kids had stayed up just to watch him. Something like 1500 people complained; the network who received the complaints decided to unbook him for a couple of shows; the New York-based blogs put up several posts and the media had a couple of days worth of discussion, but now, weeks later, nobody else cares and the subject never comes up in middle America.

It was just something that happened one night. Perhaps some feel it was a bad choice on Mr. Lambert’s part, but it generated unprecedented buzz for a debut album and he went on to sell lots of copies.

The culture wasn’t damaged. Peggy Noonan is a nut and life goes on.

Magister hits the nail on the head once again. The theme of Noonan’s piece is the aggressive vulgarity to which people will stoop for notoriety. It’s hard to argue that an otherwise forgettable American Idol contestant would still be a topic of discussion if he hadn’t made his performance as risque as possible. To criticize Adam Lambert as representative of said aggressive vulgarity is not in itself homophobic. What really should have been gleaned from this article is what Magister alludes to, the so-called “culture war,” and if people are really as offended and concerned as Noonan claims they are, which I would suspect they are not.

Pat & Magister: did you read the final question I pose? If what all you say is true, where is the article Noonan wrote following the Madonna & Britney kiss?

Mr. Gotkin:

Before reading your column, I read the Peggy Noonan piece at your link. Then I returned and finished reading your reaction, and noted this comment:

This is [a] story of poor journalism.

I agree wholeheartedly. But the poor journalism is not Noonan’s, it’s yours. (Not that this is new to Mediaite).

First of all, the illustration you chose to accompany your editorial would be fitting if you were taking on Rev. Pat Robertson, Dr. James Dobson, or Phyllis Schafly, whose objections to the expanding influence of the gay rights movement are deeply based in religious belief. Peggy Noonan is not of that sandwich-board ilk, and it’s dishonest of you (or the person who chose that image) to imply that she is somehow.

Then, you employ the deceitful device used increasingly by professional opinionators left and right: “code language.” That is, to make the words of someone with whom you disagree seem more objectionable to the uninformed by suggesting the reader shouldn’t believe the words that were actually spoken. No, readers should ignore the actual meaning of words, and instead embrace your perception of what their darker inner thoughts must be.

You wrote, “Noonan’s problem is that she hinges on homophobia.” Then, after quoting a paragraph in which Noonan almost apologizes for making Lambert’s perverted display the topic of a column (“I don’t mean to make too much of it”) you wrote:

“Translation from poorly codified indiscretion: Gay people are ruining America.”

Those are just your warm-up pitches, as you continue:

I can’t ignore disturbing shorthand homophobia. It’s a not-so-subtle way of talking that allows people of like minds to say just about everything except the offensive things they actually want to say.

Of course, Kevin, it never seem to occur to people like you that perhaps the reason why they don’t say “the offensive things” is because they actually don’t want to say them.

This is eerily reminiscent of another writer who hears things that weren’t actually said – The New York Times’ Maureen Dowd, who made a fool of herself when she wrote that “Fair or not,” she “heard” Congressman Joe Wilson silently call President Obama “boy” in his “You lie!” outburst in Obama’s health care speech. Dowd can be found on that Pulitzer Prize list you linked, and her continued presence on it devalues its prestige.

This is also the main weapon used by the likes of Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson, and other race hustlers (let me interject at this point that I am a black man); they are cocked and ready to accuse people of bias or bigotry without a shred of evidence, sometimes demanding a ransom of millions (in “donations”) to remove the tar they’ve slathered on their targets.

All such arguments are predicated on the idea that one knows what other people are really thinking if they don’t accept (or openly reject) your values. Joe Wilson calls Obama a liar (accurately)? He’s a white guy from South Carolina, so he’s a bigot – he just doesn’t say “boy” out loud. A cartoonist draws up a gag about a mad chimpanzee being the author of the stimulus bill? Obviously, the chimp represents Obama, even though Obama didn’t write the bill, and the cartoonist said that wasn’t his intent at all. Carrie Prejean doesn’t think same-sex marriage should be instituted into law, so that must mean that she secretly despised the gay men that helped her win Miss California USA.

See, there’s so much you can learn about people’s true motives and feelings by what they don’t say. Right?

Your argument against Noonan falls apart like a Jenga puzzle when you start defending gay values. I’m not saying that gays don’t have values, I’m saying that in her piece Noonan never accused gays of not having them. Once again, that was your perception of Noonan, fair or not. She was specifically focused on the deliberately provocative performance by Lambert (“faux oral sex” featuring “S&M play,” “bondage gear,” “same-sex makeouts” and “walking a man and woman around the stage on a leash”) and the fact that it all took place on broadcast – that is to say “free” — television. As Noonan wrote well before she specifically addressed Lambert:

For years now, without anyone declaring it or even noticing it, we’ve had a compromise on television. Do you want, or will you allow into your home, dramas and comedies that, however good or bad, are graphically violent, highly sexualized, or reflective of cultural messages that you believe may be destructive? Fine, get cable. Pay for it. Buy your premium package, it’s your money, spend it as you like.

But the big broadcast networks are for everyone. They are free, they are available on every television set in the nation, and we watch them with our children. The whole family’s watching. Higher, stricter standards must maintain.

You responded by suggesting this was evidence of Noonan’s “poor journalism” because of her shaky “reasoning,” and that:

Without distrust for the “alternative” lifestyle Adam Lambert now represents, Noonan’s piece comes across as aloof and out of touch. But with it, she rallies the base. Proof? That fact that she didn’t write this article after the Britney and Madonna kiss.

If you knew as much about Peggy Noonan as I do, you would know that she’s not a big fan of “rallying the base” — she did just the opposite a year ago, joining a chorus of urban intellectual conservatives in extolling the potential of Barack Obama to be a great centrist Chief Executive. I knew that wouldn’t happen.

I never went to J-school, (I’m presuming that you did, Kevin — maybe I’m wrong) but I always try to check my facts. Sometimes I fall short, and write something that is technically inaccurate, but I always try to get the big honking hippopotamus facts right. Such as the fact that the
Britney-Madonna liplock was NOT on broadcast television, it was … on cable, specifically the 2003 MTV Video Music Awards.

Another huge error of yours was linking a 1993 Andrew Sullivan NYT editorial about gays serving in the armed services openly as an example of “Gay Values, Truly Conservative.” I won’t go into the salacious details of Mr. Sullivan’s values in practice (all of you who have the stomach for that can Google his name with the phrase “milky loads” or “power glutes”), but I wouldn’t cite a man obsessed with Sarah Palin’s uterus as a good way to get people OVER homophobia.

But I guess such dead-end rhetorical devices are a part of what you call “journalism that speaks through ingenuity instead of ignorance…” Is that what you believe you’ve accomplished here, Mr. Gotkin, this collection of prejudicial, presumptive, stereotypical assertions based in a gelatinous foundation? You are mistaken.

Kevin

I don’t why she didn’t write it, maybe there was something else on her mind that week. I do remember quite a bit of chatter from parents’ groups and conservative commentators about that though. The fact that she criticized Lambert for an objectively controversial performance and didn’t criticize Madonna and Britney for their own objectively controversial performance still doesn’t make her a gay-basher though. It’s rather bizarre to argue that the informing agent in Noonan’s piece is homophobia especially when the only time Mr. Lambert’s sexual orientation is cited is in reference to his own protestations over ABC cancelling his appearance on Good Morning America.

You claim this is not the story of an angry liberal attacking a perceived conservative newspaper. It seems to me that’s exactly what this is. A conservative columnist titles her piece “The Adam Lambert Problem” and you decide, despite the fact she goes on to cite the antics of the White House party-crashers and the Octo-Mom and brings up and is bringing up general questions about vulgarity in public life, that what she really means is “Gay people are ruining America.” Sorry, I don’t buy it.

@Kevin Gotkin: As Smithee says – The Madonna/Britney thing took place on cable and I honestly don’t remember, whether Peggy Noonan mentioned it or not.

Nonetheless, I really don’t think that a kiss between two women on cable is quite the same thing as a leather-clad guy leading another around by a leash. In fact, the only thing they have in common is that they’re both between same-sex couples.

And, if you were from Mars and had no knowledge of human genders or human sexuality, I sincerely doubt that you’d consider the two acts equals.

I’ve never been a big fan of Peggy Noonan –she always seemed to have it in for Hillary Clinton, but in this instance I have to fully agree L. n. Smithee. Think about it; here’s the author somehow claiming to know exactly what Noonan’s motivations are and then castigating her for those *proven* motiviations. That’s absurd, and pretty pathetic. But wait, I MUST HATE GAYS BECAUSE I DISAGREE WITH GOTKIN!! See how silly that looks in print? Well, that’s just as silly as Gotkin’s conclusions re: Ms. Noonan in this instance.

Time to grow up, dude.