Well THIS sounds like a good idea. What could go wrong here. We all know cops are honest and NEVER lie. Not to self avoid Tennessee AND Indiana from now on. The cops there can f*ck you and it’s legal.

*Note*

If you stop the money from getting back to Mexico, they’re not going to travel the Tennessee highways anymore.

They aren’t shaking down ” real ” Americans on the way to grandma’s house..so sit down and shut up mutts…..you don’t have any money for them to take in the forst place.

Unf’ingbelievable.

Police…Crooked…Gee Whiz….What a surprise there.

Conservatives and Liberals can both agree that this is completely f’ed up.

The thing is the erosion of civil liberties is going to be the very thing to unite the right and left in the country, and when that happens look out.

Only the money?

Only the money?

Who is going to miss a small brick of solid perico?

A lot of illegals get screwed this way.

I’m no fan of illegals but here’s what happens to them in cases like this:

They come here, live a dozen or more in a small house or apartment, work as landscapers or wiaters or dishwashers and save every dime they can for their families in Mexice. They pool their money and a couple of times a tear they head south.

If they’re stopped and police find that money (I’ve seen $20,000 in one car the money can be taken without cause other than suspicion that it’s drug money. The illegals don’t make a complaint and don’t fight it in court because where they’re from the police jack people up. It’s what they do.

They just lose and they’ve not done anything illegal.

This crap needs to stop, and stop NOW. So does our “war on drugs”. It’s stupid and mindless and accomplshes ABSOLUTELY nothing. We do it because we’ve always done it that way and that is the worst excuse for doing anything.

This is pathetic and is a legal version of organized crime.

I feel very strongly about this issue. So strongly in fact that I actually agree with Color Me Badd in these two statements:

“Conservatives and Liberals can both agree that this is completely f’ed up.”

Yup. This conservative, anyway.

“The thing is the erosion of civil liberties is going to be the very thing to unite the right and left in the country, and when that happens look out”

Yup. with this caveat – the left needs to wake up and realize it’s their side that is promoting many of our liberties being taken and speak out aginst it instead of cheerleading Obama and his “transparent” administration.

Harry Flashman said:
I feel very strongly about this issue. So strongly in fact that I actually agree with Color Me Badd in these two statements:

“Conservatives and Liberals can both agree that this is completely f’ed up.”

Yup. This conservative, anyway.

“The thing is the erosion of civil liberties is going to be the very thing to unite the right and left in the country, and when that happens look out”

Yup. with this caveat – the left needs to wake up and realize it’s their side that is promoting many of our liberties being taken and speak out aginst it instead of cheerleading Obama and his “transparent” administration.

Harry I agree with nearly everything you said, first of all I don’t cheerlead Obama, in fact when Liberals make excuses for him, it makes me more mad than a Republican ripping him, because with Republicans I know where it comes from. With Liberals for example who justify Obama’s war in Libya, are just hypocrites, because of George W. Bush had bombed Libya without permission of Congress, which incidentally is now an illegal war as of today because of the expiration of the WPC.

Actually I totally agree with your entire statement. But I would say that those on the Right need to wake up too, because during the Bush admin. you never heard a peep from them when Bush was circumventing the Constitution. I mean the Patriot Act is unconstitutional, but you never heard a word from the Republicans, and it is still illegal, which was just extended 4 years yesterday.

See common ground can be achieved even on Mediaite.

Coler Me Badd said:

“See common ground can be achieved even on Mediaite.”

Again, yup.

When we see clear instances of our liberties being taken like this we need to act as one. We can differ politically but this is one huge umbrella that covers us all.

I read Orwell’s 1984 when I was a kid and it scared the hell out of me. This kind of conduct by our authorities should scare the hell out of anyone.

Harry Flashman said:
Coler Me Badd said:

“See common ground can be achieved even on Mediaite.”

Again, yup.

When we see clear instances of our liberties being taken like this we need to act as one. We can differ politically but this is one huge umbrella that covers us all.

I read Orwell’s 1984 when I was a kid and it scared the hell out of me. This kind of conduct by our authorities should scare the hell out of anyone.

Yep when it all comes down to it, we are all in this together we may have differences about how to get to where we want to be. But it is important to remember it is essential all of us, Republicans, Tea Party members, Dems., far left liberals vs. the establishment who are seeking to strip us of our Constitutionally protected rights, and right now they are taking away our liberties at an alarming rate. We all need to wake up now.

tatboy said:
Well THIS sounds like a good idea. What could go wrong here. We all know cops are honest and NEVER lie. Not to self avoid Tennessee AND Indiana from now on. The cops there can f*ck you and it’s legal.

Wow….I’m shocked I agree with your sentiment here.

Harry Flashman said:
A lot of illegals get screwed this way.

I’m no fan of illegals but here’s what happens to them in cases like this:

They come here, live a dozen or more in a small house or apartment, work as landscapers or wiaters or dishwashers and save every dime they can for their families in Mexice. They pool their money and a couple of times a tear they head south.

If they’re stopped and police find that money (I’ve seen $20,000 in one car the money can be taken without cause other than suspicion that it’s drug money. The illegals don’t make a complaint and don’t fight it in court because where they’re from the police jack people up. It’s what they do.

They just lose and they’ve not done anything illegal.

This crap needs to stop, and stop NOW. So does our “war on drugs”. It’s stupid and mindless and accomplshes ABSOLUTELY nothing. We do it because we’ve always done it that way and that is the worst excuse for doing anything.

This is pathetic and is a legal version of organized crime.

Holy crap! I agree with you too?

“Holy crap! I agree with you too?”

Hey, wrong is wrong. Taking someone’s property on a mere suspicion and without adjudication, forcing the citizen to resort to the courts to get his own property back stomps all over the Fourth Amendment.

Gasket said:
Wow….I’m shocked I agree with your sentiment here. Holy crap! I agree with you too?

I’m a libertarian. I don’t like oppression from the left or the right. And I don’t trust authority from the left or the right. I stay consistant. I didn’t like Bush taking my rights away and more than Obama. I have been SHOCKED by the defence on the left of Obama’s administrations iron fist approach to freedoms and liberty. *ie… Boing trying to go to North Carolina.*

Harry Flashman said:
“Holy crap! I agree with you too?” Hey, wrong is wrong. Taking someone’s property on a mere suspicion and without adjudication, forcing the citizen to resort to the courts to get his own property back stomps all over the Fourth Amendment.

You should check out what cops can now do to you in Indiana in your own home… sick. Do ANY of the Amendments count any more?

Harry Flashman said:
A lot of illegals get screwed this way.

I’m no fan of illegals but here’s what happens to them in cases like this:

They come here, live a dozen or more in a small house or apartment, work as landscapers or wiaters or dishwashers and save every dime they can for their families in Mexice. They pool their money and a couple of times a tear they head south.

If they’re stopped and police find that money (I’ve seen $20,000 in one car the money can be taken without cause other than suspicion that it’s drug money. The illegals don’t make a complaint and don’t fight it in court because where they’re from the police jack people up. It’s what they do.

They just lose and they’ve not done anything illegal.

This crap needs to stop, and stop NOW. So does our “war on drugs”. It’s stupid and mindless and accomplshes ABSOLUTELY nothing. We do it because we’ve always done it that way and that is the worst excuse for doing anything.

This is pathetic and is a legal version of organized crime.

As someone that has employed hundreds of South Carolina and or Washington State drivers licensed Mexicans, nod, nod, wink, wink in my New Jersey Garden Center/Landscape business over the years, I can state for the record your post is non reality based, in other words ( full of shit ).

First of all, nobody pays these workers anywhere enough money, after rent, food, cell phone, etc. for them here in the states, to be saving wads of cash to return home with at the end of the season.

Each week, my guys anyway, go to the local Western Union office, or put cash into Pay Pal accounts, to be sent back home to their families on a weekly basis.

They DO NOT save up piles of cash, then drive it back to Mexico themselves as you’ve falsely stated.

What a waste of taxpayer dollars. This “war on drugs” has been a failure. The federal government needs to decriminalize drug use/ possession and had the issue over to the states.

But of course they won’t do that.

If a free and independent adult wants to smoke pot or do a line of coke (like the young Obama and Bush) in the privacy of their own home they should be able to.

Color Me Badd said:
Yep when it all comes down to it, we are all in this together we may have differences about how to get to where we want to be. But it is important to remember it is essential all of us, Republicans, Tea Party members, Dems., far left liberals vs. the establishment who are seeking to strip us of our Constitutionally protected rights, and right now they are taking away our liberties at an alarming rate. We all need to wake up now.

I agree with you 100%. These establishment politicians are about increasing government power, which has a direct effect on individual liberty and freedom.

Ron Paul 2012

As someone who supports legalization, decriminalization or normalization, I applaud the Tennessee station for doing an investigation and running it as a series during sweeps, but I don’t see why the story itself would be news outside of Tennessee’s borders. (Though the competition between agencies is a nice twist)

Forfeiture laws exist across the country, not every state can seize on suspicion and some require an actual conviction, but a quick glance at the letter grades assigned in the “Policing for Profit” report cited in the clip shows that most states rate a C or less.

Note for anyone time-restricted, here’s a journal article about the report which I consulted for the link.
Needless to say, people have been protesting this for years. Kudos to the station for the report.

Barack Must Go said:
As someone that has employed hundreds of South Carolina and or Washington State drivers licensed Mexicans, nod, nod, wink, wink in my New Jersey Garden Center/Landscape business over the years, I can state for the record your post is non reality based, in other words ( full of shit ).

First of all, nobody pays these workers anywhere enough money, after rent, food, cell phone, etc. for them here in the states, to be saving wads of cash to return home with at the end of the season.

Each week, my guys anyway, go to the local Western Union office, or put cash into Pay Pal accounts, to be sent back home to their families on a weekly basis.

They DO NOT save up piles of cash, then drive it back to Mexico themselves as you’ve falsely stated.

Okay now I know Harold Camping is right because I agree with Barack Must Go now, WTF????? Seriously you guys the end of the world is tomorrow, we all agree with each other on here!!!! WTF/????

Mas Liberty5 said:
I agree with you 100%. These establishment politicians are about increasing government power, which has a direct effect on individual liberty and freedom.

Ron Paul 2012

Really do think that the more the establishment overplays their hand on the civil liberties issue, more and more of us are going to get together. As of this week the 4th Amendment no longer exists in this country. This should be freaking people out! Instead of us getting hung up on what Newt did or didn’t say or if Donald Trump is running, we all should be concentrating on the important stuff. Our government both state and national are trashing this constitution, this is not a partisan issue This is an issue for all Americans.

I am going to be kinder on here and not get wrapped up in the pissing matches of red vs. blue anymore, cause that is what they want us to be doing anyway. I am done with this pro wrestling as politics BS. It is fun and stuff, but crazy stuff is going on in our country right now, and every American should be aware of it and ready to stand up for the Constitution, no matter what your political affiliation is.

Color Me Badd said:
Okay now I know Harold Camping is right because I agree with Barack Must Go now, WTF????? Seriously you guys the end of the world is tomorrow, we all agree with each other on here!!!! WTF/????

Maybe this really is it…

Barack Must Go said:

“As someone that has employed hundreds of South Carolina and or Washington State drivers licensed Mexicans, nod, nod, wink, wink in my New Jersey Garden Center/Landscape business over the years, I can state for the record your post is non reality based, in other words ( full of shit ).’

As a twenty year street cop I can tell you that it does happen and that the agency I worked for cautioned its officers against it. as a supervisor I certainly cautioned mine about this very thing. But, hey, you own a landscaping business. You must know how things work on the street at 3 in the morning and you certainly must know all about law enforcement.

I’m aware of the Western Union thing. A lot of illegals won’t use it because they don’t understand it and don’t trust it, and because they think the govenmnent can track them and their families through it.

You might want to try a bit of fact seeking before you tell someone he’s full of shit.

Decades ago they called police officers like this “Fee Grabbers” who fished the roads on Fridays, a traditional payday, so as to relieve their prey of the weight of their hard earned paychecks. Crooked then, crooked now.

Harry Flashman said:
Barack Must Go said:

“As someone that has employed hundreds of South Carolina and or Washington State drivers licensed Mexicans, nod, nod, wink, wink in my New Jersey Garden Center/Landscape business over the years, I can state for the record your post is non reality based, in other words ( full of shit ).’

As a twenty year street cop I can tell you that it does happen and that the agency I worked for cautioned its officers against it. as a supervisor I certainly cautioned mine about this very thing. But, hey, you own a landscaping business. You must know how things work on the street at 3 in the morning and you certainly must know all about law enforcement.

I’m aware of the Western Union thing. A lot of illegals won’t use it because they don’t understand it and don’t trust it, and because they think the govenmnent can track them and their families through it.

You might want to try a bit of fact seeking before you tell someone he’s full of shit.

The Prosecution rests….

Barack Must Go said:
The Prosecution rests….

Yeah if you are gonna disagree with someone, lets see some facts, not you are wrong. The end.

“The Prosecution rests….”

Amen.

From the ““Policing for Profit” report;

The highest standard is “beyond a reasonable doubt,” commonly associated with convictions on criminal charges. As shown in Table 2, only four states require such a high standard for civil forfeiture proceedings, and one of those, California, only uses it when certain property is at issue. (Most commonly, in states with two forfeiture standards, the higher one is for the forfeiture of real property such as land and homesteads.) In another of those states, North Carolina, all forfeitures are criminal actions; civil asset forfeiture essentially does not exist in North Carolina. Only Nebraska and Wisconsin require beyond a reasonable doubt for all civil forfeiture.

“Probable cause” is the lowest standard used for forfeiture, and it is the standard for some property in 14 states. Probable cause is the same standard used to justify search warrants and the arrest of suspected law violators and means merely that the government has a reasonable belief that a person has committed a crime. It is also the standard law enforcement must meet in most states for a seizure of property— the first step in the forfeiture process.

As Table 2 shows, 27 states employ a “preponderance of the evidence” standard for forfeiture of some property, and so does the federal government, making it the most common standard. It is considered higher than mere probable cause and generally equates to the idea that it is more likely than not that the property is related to criminal conduct and thus subject to forfeiture. Finally, 13 states use a “clear and convincing” standard for some property. It poses a greater challenge for government to prove its case than probable cause or preponderance, but less than reasonable doubt.

In short, in the vast majority of states and at the federal level, the standard of proof required to forfeit an individual’s property is lower than the standard required to prove that the individual was guilty of the criminal activity that supposedly justified the forfeiture in the first place. Given this situation, it is not surprising that upwards of 80 percent of forfeitures occur absent a prosecution.

The report puts Tennessee among the 27 states using “preponderance of the evidence” and like a lot, if not most, they assume guilt, plus reporting and record-keeping isn’t required.

@ Color Me Bad,

Once again I agree. I’ve said it before that these politicians and their media cronies like to keep Americans in the red/blue partisan divide. We are easier to control like that. What they don’t want is us questioning the whole freaking system. They’d rather we were pitted against each other and not them.

You are correct also about the 4th Amendment. It is consecutively being trashed by the jackboots at the TSA, local paramilitary law enforcement and etc.

What’s so new about this? The drug war advocates, including the police that are for the unconstitutional drug war, have been “on the take” for the last seventy five years. When a cop pulls you over, and the cop takes a disliking to you, all the cop has to do is plant an illegal drug in your car. The main reason the stupid drug war keeps going is because of all the money and belongings that they confiscate from those in possession of recreational drugs.

It’s a game that’s been going on for far too long, and if there weren’t so many gullible Americans, the drug prohibition would have been ended a long time ago, or it may have never been created in the first place.

Lets face it, we have too many dumb people in this country, right now the “end of the world” religion freak is making money hand over fist from these stupid people that fall for the idiotic drug war as well.

The drug war prohibitionists have no constitutional right to tell any American what recreational drug they can use, anymore than alcohol or anything else, yet they just keep their drug war terrorism going, it’s just plain criminal!

Jonnie Dorman said:

“When a cop pulls you over, and the cop takes a disliking to you, all the cop has to do is plant an illegal drug in your car.”

That’s straight up stupid.

Yeah, all cops carry stashes of drugs to plant on you just because they don’t like you. They risk malfeasance or tampering with evidence or falsifying a report charges and going to federal prison just because you make them mad.

Ignorant fool.

It scares me that this is actually news to people.

Civil Asset Forfeiture laws across this country are nothing short of terrifying.

I suggest Cato’s “Policing for Profit.”

Color Me Badd said:
Yeah if you are gonna disagree with someone, lets see some facts, not you are wrong. The end.

Exactly. My experience with my people were, are and will continue to be real ( in the present tense ).

If you actually read what your ‘ liberal compatriot ‘ states, not one personal ( first person experience ). All hypotheticals, my boss told me, old told the class I taught, etc.

If you actually read what I have stated, it only pertains to Mexican farm ( nursery, trees, shrubs, etc ) workers in New Jersey.

I have become quite close with my employees and even many of their families ( wives, children and even grandchildren ) have come here to work.

I have help many with various court problems from non return of security, to car loans ( off the books ) at 23%. I would think if they or someone in our industry across the country had been subjected to this treatment, I surely would have been aware before today.

Again, read what Flashman states. He knows nothing first hand of any cases, let alone Mexican farm workers as he has stated. Just what some law enforecement bulliten referenced in his department.

You are a fellow lib, so by all means take the normal route and side with him, it’s OK, you have my express permission. I was simply addressing what I consider to be a bullshit claim with actual personal experience, that’s all.

JoeRyMI said:
It scares me that this is actually news to people.

Civil Asset Forfeiture laws across this country are nothing short of terrifying.

I suggest Cato’s “Policing for Profit.”

Wasn’t that the guy living in OJ’s guest house when he didn’t kill his ex wife Nicole and Ron Goldman ?

People, I don’t want to be overly dramatic, but, this is, by definition, “tyranny”. Also, note that this form of policing is the spawn of the Drug War.

For those of you who think I am overreacting, wait until it happens to your son, your brother, wife, nephew. Furthermore this type of policy can and will turn a good Cop into a bad one. A Nation of Laws into a Nation of the arbitrary and capricious.

Do not minimize what is happening here…

PURVEYOR OF RHETORIC

Hey BARACK, what did MEDIADOUBT do to anger you so? Wow!

That is not only insanity, but literal highway robbery. It sound like they are the equivalent of the highwaymen of the history books in Europe. The drug laws have allowed law enforcement the ability to confiscate money and property that they suspect came from drugs, but to allow the officers to collect a portion and to make it mandatory is more than insane. It should never be allowed. This is surely a violation of a persons civil rights and should surely be unconstitutional. Wow. How can we allow this kind of thing to happen?

Barack Must Go said:
Exactly. My experience with my people were, are and will continue to be real ( in the present tense ).

If you actually read what your ‘ liberal compatriot ‘ states, not one personal ( first person experience ). All hypotheticals, my boss told me, old told the class I taught, etc.

If you actually read what I have stated, it only pertains to Mexican farm ( nursery, trees, shrubs, etc ) workers in New Jersey.

I have become quite close with my employees and even many of their families ( wives, children and even grandchildren ) have come here to work.

I have help many with various court problems from non return of security, to car loans ( off the books ) at 23%. I would think if they or someone in our industry across the country had been subjected to this treatment, I surely would have been aware before today.

Again, read what Flashman states. He knows nothing first hand of any cases, let alone Mexican farm workers as he has stated. Just what some law enforecement bulliten referenced in his department.

You are a fellow lib, so by all means take the normal route and side with him, it’s OK, you have my express permission. I was simply addressing what I consider to be a bullshit claim with actual personal experience, that’s all.

Wow well said, and I agree Barack Must Go.

They said we were being paranoid. That this sort of thing wouldn’t happen. We’ve all heard that before, yet we went and voted for the people who create these conundrums, over and over.

The “Search and Seizure” Laws quickly morphed into ominous Police tools. They started out with distributing seized cash and property between the Federal Government and various municipalities. However, direct Cash payments to Police Officers were ‘obviously’ considered unethical. hence, disallowed. The Cash and Property was used to further the “Drug War”, meaning, purchase of weapons, flak vests, new uniforms, training equipment and community relations. All of which seem reasonable, as long as the “seizure” was done “legally” and “Constitutionally”.

But, now this next step, dangling baubles and Cash in front of Cops and… the obvious will happen.

Furthermore, John Stossel, about 20 years ago, did a story on Cops, or, a Cop in the South that was pulling over Rental cars and cars with out of State Plates, claiming he saw them veer over the center line, which was nonsense. Stossell got the Cop(s) on tape, lying. (I believe the Cop was fired, but, quickly rehired in an adjoining State)

Perhaps, the most tragic victims of the rogue Cop(s) were the Migrant Workers returning home to Mexico who had their Summer Wages confiscated and cars impounded. Even back then the “search and seizure” law contravened an old legal adage: “you are innocent until proven guilty”. The Migrants and other victims had to prove they were innocent to get the money and property back! The Victim’s were now broke, how could they hire a lawyer. (in a foreign land) But, it wasn’t happening to us, so we let it go.

I could go on with more stories, but, then I would sound Anti-Law Enforcement, which I am not. This sort of thing falls within the purview of the Legislatures.

We need, in this day and age, vigilant, pro-active Police. However, simple common sense, not to mention our Governmental Treatises, tell us this is an abuse of Police Power. Like I wrote above: “wait until it happens to you”.

PURVEYOR OF RHETORIC

Mean while, the US President says he doesn’t need congressional approval to continue the bombings in Libya even though the War Powers Act 60-day time line had ended.

http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2011/05/white-house-on-war-powers-deadline-limited-us-role-in-libya-means-no-need-to-get-congressional-autho.html

But in 2007 here is what then Senator Obama said:
“The president does not have power under the Constitution to unilaterally authorize a military attack in a situation that does not involve stopping an actual or imminent threat to the nation.” – Sen. Barack Obama December 20, 2007.

Hey, these officers are putting Obimbo’s “share the wealth” philosophy into practice, so what’s the problem? Take form those that “do”, and give it to everyone else. Yes Sir, nothings better than seeing a corrupt ideology come together.

purveyor said:
People, I don’t want to be overly dramatic, but, this is, by definition, “tyranny”. Also, note that this form of policing is the spawn of the Drug War.

Do not minimize what is happening here…

PURVEYOR OF RHETORIC

Hey BARACK, what did MEDIADOUBT do to anger you so? Wow!

Purveyor, right on the danger, wrong on the Genesis.
Fifty years ago, Wudowici, Ga. became (in)famous as a speed trap on the NY to Fla. highway.
You got a small ticket, and a court date two weeks later.
You could “post bond” of around $100, or go to jail.
The Sheriff, the Magistrate and the Town split the “bond” when you did not appear.
The Interstate System put small town speed traps out of business
It was inevitable they would find another loophole to make money.
Another “cash cow” is the seizure of autos when there is no sober driver available..

Just a thought:

I find it curious and disturbing that the ‘scientific’ poll of the “thumbs up, thumbs down”, seems to be biased toward “thumbs down” on this issue. There are many Posts, mine included, that warn the reader of diminished Constitutional rights. Many Posts of this persuasion are reasoned and historically sound. YET, we get a thumbs down! Huh?

Yes, I know I am being redundant, but, wait until it happens to you, or, someone in your family. The Power of the State can is formidable!

PURVEYOR OF RHETORIC

Barack Must Go said:
The Prosecution rests….

Harry Flashman said:
“The Prosecution rests….”

Amen.

Say two redneck white boys who will never be thought to be black, hispanic, gay, “hippies”, or whatever.
Says two complete @ssholes who have never heard of a “throw away” gun, or a “drop dime”.
Two clowns who haven’t seen a “Cop show” since “Car 54– Where are you?”

GLACKIN:

“Wrong” is so, um, er, confrontational, even denigrating. Couldn’t you have been a bit more diplomatic and just mentioned that there are, indeed, earlier examples of this type of corruption?

Quite simply, it is as if a compatriot has hurt my fragile feelings. Ouch! LOL

I am from Colorado and I remember about 20 years ago, Cops in Eagle County, (Vail) were “profiling” cars with Grateful Dead stickers, Rental Cars with two or more African American males etc. While I firmly see ‘profiling” as a viable and effective Police tool, the “Genesis” you refer too is a harbinger of how quickly the well intentioned person or idea, can go awry.

“Beware when pursuing the Monster, lest he become you.” Nietzsche

PURVEYOR OF RHETORIC

Glackin said:
Say two redneck white boys who will never be thought to be black, hispanic, gay, “hippies”, or whatever.
Says two complete @ssholes who have never heard of a “throw away” gun, or a “drop dime”.
Two clowns who haven’t seen a “Cop show” since “Car 54– Where are you?”

I watch ” The First 48 ” every night. I do so just so I can put a face to your posts the next day.

Tennessee does not have a state income tax, corporate and business taxes are lower than in most states, sales tax is about 7.5%, property taxes are low throughout the state, auto tags in my county are $24/year, insurance rates are low.