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CNN’s Dana Loesch To Mediaite’s Frances Martel On Webcast: ‘You Are A B*tch!’

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by Colby Hall | 2:20 pm, May 11th, 2011

» 164 comments

Conservative CNN contributor Dana Loesch and Mediaite’s own Frances Martel, a self-described Libertarian, got into a Mother’s Day fracas that demonstrates how somewhat below-the-radar new media can trump their dinosaur forebears, at least in entertainment value. They appeared on Breitbart TV Editor in Chief Larry O’Connor‘s Stage Right webcast to debate Loesch’s rather banal Mother’s Day post at Big Journalism, and the sparks flew quickly. Martel told Loesch (who had prefaced her appearance by saying she’d had four margaritas), “You’re a little bit drunk,” and Loesch dutifully responded, calling Martel a “bitch.” Why? Because, as Loesch explained to Martel, “You are a bitch.”

The subject of the webcast spat centered around Loesch’s Mother’s Day post, in which she hypothesizes that many mothers have become politically active of late because motherhood is, in and of itself, political. Loesch echoed the fears of many conservatives who see the current political landscape as “a threat to the well-being of their children.”

Martel took exception on Twitter:

As a woman who chose to study politics instead of procreating for a living (?), I’m very offended by this mentality

Martel took exception to the notion that motherhood, in and of itself, somehow confers superior political acumen. Although Loesch’s piece doesn’t explicitly say this, it is a thematic interpretation that Loesch saw fit to defend later.

After some sharp back-and-forth with Loesch and Stage Right producer Meredith Dake, Martel accepted an invitation to do the show (disclosure – this was at midnight when this Managing Editor — and father of two — who normally approves such appearance was fast asleep).

You’re probably not going to catch an exchange like this on CNN, and it’s only a taste of an at times riveting, and often rambling and unmoderated, hour or so of unvarnished debate: (you can listen to the entire show here.) The two battled over political indoctrination, education, and definitions of communism. While her detractors probably thought that, at times, it felt as though Martel was using her political science degree as a cudgel, her more persuasive explanation for why she would certainly know the definition of communism was that her parents immigrated from Cuba. Unfortunately, this was drowned in a sea of unpleasantries between the battling warriors, though its worth noting that Loesch called Martel a “communist elitist.”

The most inflammatory exchange, however, occurred shortly after Martel joined the podcast, after Loesch had reset her opinion on the politics of motherhood.

Listen to that excerpt below:

Part of the magic of Twitter is the informal, unrehearsed nature of the medium, and the same can be said of the late-night webcast. And it is fair to say that this exchange was unrehearsed and yes, perhaps even too informal. For Martel’s part, she was using hyperbole in claiming that mothers who stay at home are “second class citizens,” but as she explains later in the full podcast, she was using Loesch’s term to make a political point.

However, Loesch took great offense at Martel’s criticism, arguing that she has no room to criticize anything related to motherhood, because Martel is not a mother. Apart from the substantive issues of their debate, by this logic the only person qualified to criticize an elected official is someone who has held elected office. For that matter, it is akin to claiming that one cannot talk about drug policy unless he or she has significant experience doing drugs.

The premise of the debate (and what seems to be the misunderstanding between the debate’s participants) is not really the point. One should be expected to engage in a spirited discourse over political differences without ad hominem attacks. Dana Loesch is a contributor to CNN, yet she revealed at the outset of her debate that she’d had four margaritas before calling Martel a bitch. Would other networks allow their contributors to engage in this sort of public discourse?

When reached, a CNN spokesperson told Mediaite “CNN has always been a news organization committed to having political analysts and commentators from across the entire political spectrum. Dana is a ‘CNN Contributor’ and the network doesn’t endorse her political viewpoint — or other contributor viewpoints and ideas.”

But this isn’t about her political viewpoint. This is about calling someone a bitch on the radio.

When asked if she had any regret about using that term, a defiant Loesch told Mediaite “Not really,” later adding “especially since I’m sure (you) didn’t ask your staffer if she regrets calling stay-at-home-mothers ‘second-class citizens,’ ‘unAmerican’ and ‘looters’ on Mother’s Day, or the ad hominem, shouting, etc. which kicked off the podcast.”

Martel tells us:

I clarify in the clip several times that ‘looters’ was an Ayn Rand joke that clearly went over her head. I stand fully by “unAmerican.” The dignity of free labor is at the core of American values and participation in the free market is what keeps the country thriving. I’m pretty sure it comes from Weber’s Protestant ethic, though it cuts through all religions nowadays, and is mentioned in de Tocqueville’s Democracy in America. Anyway, to willfully abstain from participating in the free market, to me, is unAmerican, though this may be a position that only those either having lived in non-capitalist systems or barely slipping away from non-capitalist systems may take.

I never called her a bitch and I regret trying to sound conciliatory towards the end of the broadcast. Obviously this is a person too proud of her ignorance to understand bridge-building in any capacity. Then again, she has called me a “communist” several times without apology, which is actually a far worst insult than “bitch,” and has yet to explain herself.

I’m proud of what I did because Dana is an ignorant, belligerent bully and people seem to fear calling her out on her bullshit because people are afraid of kicking the hornet’s nest! She has absolutely nothing to work with other than being loud and apparently this is enough for no one reasonable to say “hey America, maybe we don’t want the dumbest and most ill-faithed among us to have a platform?”

It makes me kind of disappointed in our media, frankly.

Ouch.

In the end, Dana Loesch is not just a proud mother, but asserts that her status of motherhood gives her a level political expertise. That may, or may not, be true. But one wonders if she would be so proud to share her calling of Martel a “bitch” with her children, now or ever. Which gets to the real issue of the debate between Loesch and Martel. Is one’s own ignorance something one should wear proudly as a badge of honor?

Martel thinks not, and on that point, I happen to agree.

Big Journalism, Dana Loesch, Frances Martel, Larry O'Connor, Mediaite

The_Reasonable_Lib

There’s that old conservative class!!!!!
WCinWI

Why are you airing your Twitter arguments on your website? Mediaite is trolling for comments.

Frances said some very offensive things about women and motherhood, yet claims to be a libertarian. She sounds more like a feminist. Calling anyone second-class citizen is not right at all. Frances should feel ashamed.
The Lantern of Truth

Catfight !!

Sounds like BFD and Robert the RRK at the salon when they both want to use the curling iron at once .

That 3 minutes was way too much .
The Lantern of Truth

Be more pleasant to listen to Rap Thug Common’s “Cop Killa Serenade , Part 2 ” .
Liberal Tormentor

When asked if she had any regret about using that term, a defiant Loesch told Mediaite “Not really,” later adding “especially since I’m sure (you) didn’t ask your staffer if she regrets calling stay-at-home-mothers ’second-class citizens,’ ‘unAmerican’ and ‘looters’ on Mother’s Day, or the ad hominem, shouting, etc. which kicked off the podcast.”

What Frannie said is WAY more offensive to me, as a mother, who also works full time.
Jim R

Dana is slightly less likable and “informed” as CNN’s other right wing contributor from Redstate.com. Being brought up on vitriol and smear tactics obviously leaves the right bereft of policy specific retorts, leaving ad hominem as their only recourse. Sad.
CAINtheBULL

The moment you start insulting people… you’ve lost the argument. Btw. all internet radio shows always have terrible sound quality.
notsofast

Don’t ya just love Martel’s elitism? I got a degree, I want to see your resume,…!

She’s the white Star Jones!

Typical lib.
Edith Massey

Dana Loesch=alcoholic POS.
Francis Martel=23 year old Libertarian

How worthless.
Pablo

Focusing on raising your children is Un-American? Ah, yes. You’re supposed to let the state take care of that for you. For freedom!
notsofast

Jim R said:
Dana is slightly less likable and “informed” as CNN’s other right wing contributor from Redstate.com. Being brought up on vitriol and smear tactics obviously leaves the right bereft of policy specific retorts, leaving ad hominem as their only recourse. Sad.

Yes, that’s why Dana said Martel ‘was a little drunk.”

Wait, that was Frances saying that.
The_Reasonable_Lib

Liberal Tormentor said:
When asked if she had any regret about using that term, a defiant Loesch told Mediaite “Not really,” later adding “especially since I’m sure (you) didn’t ask your staffer if she regrets calling stay-at-home-mothers ’second-class citizens,’ ‘unAmerican’ and ‘looters’ on Mother’s Day, or the ad hominem, shouting, etc. which kicked off the podcast.”

What Frannie said is WAY more offensive to me, as a mother, who also works full time.

I thought you conservatives weren’t vile and hateful like liberals though. What happened?
notsofast

Edith Massey said:
Francis Martel=23 year old Libertarian

lib rancid POS.
WCinWI

Jim R said:
Dana is slightly less likable and “informed” as CNN’s other right wing contributor from Redstate.com. Being brought up on vitriol and smear tactics obviously leaves the right bereft of policy specific retorts, leaving ad hominem as their only recourse. Sad.

Uhhhh Dana isn’t from Redstate.com. You may want to update your knowledge on those of the Right. She’s with Andrew Breitbart. And she had her own radio program before that. And she’s beyond smart with politics in general.
MrTPar_taY

Gotta feeling Dana’s gonna own CNN by the time she gets done-move this to the web and let the fit hit the shan!
Barack Must Go

I’ll pay for the pudding or Jello. Your choice ladies.

Is Dana Loesch the spitting image ( widows peak and all ) of Lilly Munster or what ?
The_Reasonable_Lib

Pablo said:
Focusing on raising your children is Un-American? Ah, yes. You’re supposed to let the state take care of that for you. For freedom!

straw man
WCinWI

The_Reasonable_Lib said:
I thought you conservatives weren’t vile and hateful like liberals though. What happened?

Frances said those things, not Dana. Sheesh. Frances is no conservative. That’s fo sho.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oHg5SJYRHA0 S Chuñdy

If being a stay-at-home mother is such an accomplishment, why do they only get paid in macaroni art and juice boxes? There’s a reason why women with a college education (e.g. smart women) don’t have children (or at the very least, wait until they’re older to have children): they don’t see themselves solely as baby-making machines.

If you’re under 29 and have children, you’re (probably–there are always exceptions) an uneducated rube living inside a shoe.

Dana Loesch is a nobody: maybe that’s why she’s on CNN and not FOX.
Edith Massey

http://stlactivisthub.blogspot.com/2010/03/tea-party-taliban.html

Today, the tea party burned a picture of Representative Russ Carnahan after throwing shoes at it:

At the end of the video, you can hear the lady saying, “this is what happens when you don’t represent the will of the people…This is how a fire smells when it’s burning tyranny.”

The “lady” is the drunk Dana Loesch, wonder if the SS paid her a visit?
TfT

I’m so confused….

It was just recently where the ladies of the view told us that “bitches” is a term of endearment. I also beleive that NOW endorsed the term and has no problem with its use.

But now, we can a headline with the B*tch?????

Honestly, I really do wish lefties would pick a standard and apply it across the board.
Thelonious Funk

Interesting.

No wait, the other thing: Tedious.
The_Reasonable_Lib

WCinWI said:
Frances said those things, not Dana. Sheesh. Frances is no conservative. That’s fo sho.

Frances is a libertarian. Weren’t you guys claiming them as your offspring for the longest? Didn’t you co-op the libertarian tea party movement? Stooping to her level and calling her a b-i-tch isn’t very classy, now is it, notsosmart?
WCinWI

S Chuñdy said:
If being a stay-at-home mother is such an accomplishment, why do they only get paid in macaroni art and juice boxes? There’s a reason why women with a college education (e.g. smart women) don’t have children (or at the very least, wait until they’re older to have children): they don’t see themselves solely as baby-making machines.

If you’re under 29 and have children, you’re (probably–there are always exceptions) an uneducated rube living inside a shoe.

Dana Loesch is a nobody: maybe that’s why she’s on CNN and not FOX.

Wow. Just wow. Please don’t procreate. Please.
notsofast

The_Reasonable_Lib said:
Frances is a libertarian. Weren’t you guys claiming them as your offspring for the longest? Didn’t you co-op the libertarian tea party movement? St

Hey, son, address me as Sir, you lib POS!
WCinWI

The_Reasonable_Lib said:
Frances is a libertarian. Weren’t you guys claiming them as your offspring for the longest? Didn’t you co-op the libertarian tea party movement? Stooping to her level and calling her a b-i-tch isn’t very classy, now is it, notsosmart?

I like to think that I’m libertarian-minded. She’s not a libertarian. She’s a liberal. She’s like Dave Weigel. Tries to pass themselves off as a libertarian, but totally isn’t. Sheesh.
notsofast

The_Reasonable_Lib said:
The_Reasonable_Lib says:
May 11, 2011 at 2:42 pm The_Reasonable_Lib(Quote)
Thumb up 0 Thumb down 1

Go back to your mentor Rev. Wright, you racist POS!
WCinWI

notsofast said:
Hey, son, address me as Sir, you lib POS!

HAHAHAHA
Liberal Tormentor

Frannie is NO libertarian, based on her body of work here. She is a a loony lib, like most of the Mediaite staffers.
notsofast

WCinWI said:
HAHAHAHA

He is a small racist child in NYC who blames his skin color for all his failures.

Tsk, tsk
Pablo

The_Reasonable_Lib said:
I stand fully by “unAmerican.” The dignity of free labor is at the core of American values and participation in the free market is what keeps the country thriving. I’m pretty sure it comes from Weber’s Protestant ethic, though it cuts through all religions nowadays, and is mentioned in de Tocqueville’s Democracy in America. Anyway, to willfully abstain from participating in the free market, to me, is unAmerican, though this may be a position that only those either having lived in non-capitalist systems or barely slipping away from non-capitalist systems may take.

Either you don’t know what that term means, or you’re simply full of crap. Quoth Martel:

I stand fully by “unAmerican.” The dignity of free labor is at the core of American values and participation in the free market is what keeps the country thriving. I’m pretty sure it comes from Weber’s Protestant ethic, though it cuts through all religions nowadays, and is mentioned in de Tocqueville’s Democracy in America. Anyway, to willfully abstain from participating in the free market, to me, is unAmerican, though this may be a position that only those either having lived in non-capitalist systems or barely slipping away from non-capitalist systems may take.

It’s right up there in the post. How’d you miss it, Libby?
The_Reasonable_Lib

WCinWI said:
I like to think that I’m libertarian-minded. She’s not a libertarian. She’s a liberal. She’s like Dave Weigel. Tries to pass themselves off as a libertarian, but totally isn’t. Sheesh.

Liberal Tormentor said:
Frannie is NO libertarian, based on her body of work here. She is a a loony lib, like most of the Mediaite staffers.

What proof do you have of this? Her “work”? It isn’t slanted enough to the right for you so it’s automatically liberal? Libertarians tend to lean liberal socially and conservative fiscally in case you didn’t know. Furthermore, what is this moronic dividing line that you’ve somehow created between political divisions. You have no idea of a person’s beliefs and therefore have no ground to tell them what they are or aren’t. You’re entitled to your opinion, but based on the woman’s self-description your opinion is flat out wrong.
The_Reasonable_Lib

Pablo said:
Either you don’t know what that term means, or you’re simply full of crap. Quoth Martel:

It’s right up there in the post. How’d you miss it, Libby?

Please tell me what exactly you were quoting so that I can properly destroy your argument once again.
WCinWI

The_Reasonable_Lib said:
What proof do you have of this? Her “work”? It isn’t slanted enough to the right for you so it’s automatically liberal? Libertarians tend to lean liberal socially and conservative fiscally in case you didn’t know. Furthermore, what is this moronic dividing line that you’ve somehow created between political divisions. You have no idea of a person’s beliefs and therefore have no ground to tell them what they are or aren’t. You’re entitled to your opinion, but based on the woman’s self-description your opinion is flat out wrong.

No, anything I have read by Frances has been sooooooo far to the Left that I didn’t know that she was even close to the Right (in her mind). I thought she was the #2 Liberal blog author for this site. I didn’t know that Colby was. I thought Tommy and Frances were. So clearly, Frances has some work to do if she wants to be viewed as impartial because there is nothing impartial that I’ve seen about her writing. It’s been Liberal partisan writing from what I’ve seen.
WCinWI

The_Reasonable_Lib said:
Please tell me what exactly you were quoting so that I can properly destroy your argument once again.

Do your own research.
notsofast

Then again, she has called me a “communist” several times without apology, which is actually a far worst insult than “bitch,”….

Really? It is?

Hell Barry had one as his WH Green Czar and another person who, out of all mankind living or dead, had Mao as one of two persons she” turns to most.”
notsofast

The_Reasonable_Lib said:
Please tell me what exactly you were quoting so that I can properly destroy your argument once again.

You are a coward, son.
The_Reasonable_Lib

WCinWI said:
No, anything I have read by Frances has been sooooooo far to the Left that I didn’t know that she was even close to the Right (in her mind). I thought she was the #2 Liberal blog author for this site. I didn’t know that Colby was. I thought Tommy and Frances were. So clearly, Frances has some work to do if she wants to be viewed as impartial because there is nothing impartial that I’ve seen about her writing. It’s been Liberal partisan writing from what I’ve seen.

Or maybe you’re so far on the fringe that you instintively believe that anything moderate is actually liberal. Based on your own espoused beliefs I can tell you’re not libertarian. Your post says nothing, just mindless drivel about how “liberal” this site is. This is in contrast to the words of a multitude of prominent media figures including Glenn Beck who have described them as fair and moderate. Now carry on, troll.
The_Reasonable_Lib

WCinWI said:
Do your own research.

How does that even apply here? He was talking to me, but he messed up and my words don’t appear in the quote. Do you simply revel in being a dumbass?
Liberal Tormentor

Hey UNreasonable lib, Karl claim to be a conservative too.
Liberal Tormentor

WC says:

I didn’t know that Colby was

Oh he is. A word of advice, do NOT call him a liberal lapdog. You’ll find yourself banned faster than you can say, “check yourself”.
TfT

Still no article about all the lies Obama told yesterday in his immigration speech – oh well, between this and the rapper controversy becasue FLOTUS made some really dumb choices…..the words of the day are

bitch
ho

oh well.

Where is the AP fact checking Obama’s speech? Oh yeah, they are busy falsifying polls to make sure the zero’s ratings got a bump. The always propaganda folks screwed the pooch again.
kvon

WCinWI said:
Do your own research.

Hahahahaha someone is scared!
notsofast

kvon said:
Hahahahaha someone is scared!

Yeah, you and your racist pals, son.
Jim R

WCinWI said:
Uhhhh Dana isn’t from Redstate.com. You may want to update your knowledge on those of the Right. She’s with Andrew Breitbart. And she had her own radio program before that. And she’s beyond smart with politics in general.

I should have added a comma and a couple words to prevent you misreading my comment. “Dana is slightly less likable and “informed” as CNN’s other right wing contributor, who is from Redstate.com.”

Better?
The_Reasonable_Lib

TfT said:
Still no article about all the lies Obama told yesterday in his immigration speech – oh well, between this and the rapper controversy becasue FLOTUS made some really dumb choices…..the words of the day are

bitch
ho

oh well.

Where is the AP fact checking Obama’s speech? Oh yeah, they are busy falsifying polls to make sure the zero’s ratings got a bump. The always propaganda folks screwed the pooch again.

This is what I find funny; the AP is touted around here like a media god by some people when they fact check Obama and damn near any other time. Then one time the report something the fringe doesn’t like and they’re biased garbage. That’s when they go back to gallup which they just said was biased garbage a month ago. LOL
WCinWI

Liberal Tormentor said:
WC says:

I didn’t know that Colby was

Oh he is. A word of advice, do NOT call him a liberal lapdog. You’ll find yourself banned faster than you can say, “check yourself”.

I can at least appreciate/respect Tommy because he can call out his side more often than do other authors for blogs and he stands true to his politics. We can agree to drastically disagree on issues, but at least he can play fair MOST of the time.
Gasket

Loesch is an idiot, always has been. She couldn’t debate a topic to save her life.
WCinWI

Jim R said:
I should have added a comma and a couple words to prevent you misreading my comment. “Dana is slightly less likable and “informed” as CNN’s other right wing contributor, who is from Redstate.com.”

Better?

People might be able to handle you more often if you stopped calling them right wing or left wing. Just a thought.

As far as Dana, she’s beyond smart and she always takes Spitzer to task when she’s on his show. :)
WCinWI

The_Reasonable_Lib said:
This is what I find funny; the AP is touted around here like a media god by some people when they fact check Obama and damn near any other time. Then one time the report something the fringe doesn’t like and they’re biased garbage. That’s when they go back to gallup which they just said was biased garbage a month ago. LOL

How many AP authors read Palin’s first book again? Do tell. :)
perceptorii

Sorry, but Martel went way, way, WAY over the line by calling stay-at-home moms “unAmerican”. Loesch is right to be outraged, as it is an outrageous thing to say.
WCinWI

Gasket said:
Loesch is an idiot, always has been. She couldn’t debate a topic to save her life.

Link? I can link to many videos in which she takes liberals on CNN to task. Go ahead. Point me to an article that she’s authored that’s wrong. I’ll wait.
tatboy

“As a woman who chose to study politics instead of procreating for a living (?), I’m very offended by this mentality”

That quote is pretty bitchy.
WCinWI

tatboy said:
“As a woman who chose to study politics instead of procreating for a living (?), I’m very offended by this mentality”

That quote is pretty bitchy.

You should check out Frances’ Twitter. I was reading it before this story was even posted. I got to it through way of Tammy Bruce that had tweeted someone’s tweet about Breitbart’s book and then after clicking Breitbart’s Twitter, saw Loesch’s and then read her Twitter feed and saw Tommy/Frances and was like WHOA.

I don’t have Twitter either. Twitter wars are just silly. I just check in to occasional personalities/reporters.
Liberal Tormentor

I agree about Tommy, to a point WC. He is up front about who he is, but he likes to censor comments sometimes
http://www.perceptionasreality.blogspot.com/ skoorbekim

Frances Martel…
Ruling Class Pseudo-intellectual…

very disappointed in FM…
she decides who is qualified to talk politics?!
…
http://twitter.com/SailRabbits Magister

@Colby: I don’t think it’s fair for you to contact a company who employs Loesch as casual laborer on an as-needed basis for comment about something she said, which no one heard. Quite possibly you’re offended by the word b*tch or something, but if the tables had been turned and if the “Panel Nerds” did a Gchat after a few drinks would you have fired or disciplined them for any emotional, yet benign language used?

BTW: If every low-rated audio podcast qualifies as radio does that make “Office Hours” TV?
WHarropson

Between Colby and Fransis how many times was Dana called ignorant? They need to believe that don’t they. Before this interview I had the impression that Fransis was a liberal guy. I learned something.
http://www.facebook.com/people/Barbara-Hodges/100000863918892 Barbara

Words matter.
http://twitter.com/SailRabbits Magister

Clarification to my previous comment: Using salty and emotional language isn’t a crime. Of course, if Loesch had been making Polish jokes in a public forum, it’d be a different situation, but the word b*tch is pretty boring and part of most people’s vocabulary, so what should CNN have said?

(Not to mention that without listening to the podcast, one could argue that broad generalizations about a population segment may be equally, if not more offensive than a single word)
TeaPartyPatriot

Did martel actually expect DECENCY from a “Corrupt B-tard” at the c(lowns)n(itwits and socialist)n(attering nabobs) network ?
WCinWI

Wow – Finally just listened to that clip.

Frances was beyond low. Feminist talking points and demagogue shouting. It was truly painful.

Loesch: 1
Frances: 0
WCinWI

Dana to talk about Frances on her show in just a few mins. :)
TillieGlockenspiel

Frances is probably a dear child in her own way, but I have shoes and purses older than she is! (Isn’t anyone who writes for Mediaite, other than Tommy, over the age of thirty?)

Her comment about mothers, in general, and to Dana, specifically, were b*tchy, arrogant and supercilious.

I have a BA in political science- so what? Aside from the fact that a degree in political science is totally useless, it is also not a “hard” major, second only to sociology, and does not prepare one for a JOB. It IS a good major for going to law school, although now, a hard science degree is far superior for law school admission. Frances sounds like she has a lacerated ego over her degree and her “expertise.” I really find Frances’ snarkiness towards Dana laughable, since Frances has no children, and has only been in the workforce for a year or so. As the single mother of three multi-degreed children, I cannot find one thing about Frances’ opinion that has any validity. Go talk to some of the female associates at law firms, Frances, and find out what they really think, what they really want, and what their plans are for their lives once they have children.

Like it or not, Frances, the most important job you will ever have, should you so choose it, is raising your children. It is the one thing that will have an effect long past your lifetime and their own. How many men and women still obsess over how their parents didn’t love them enough or loved them too much or didn’t let them go to sleepovers or blah, blah, blah. When athletes and soldiers are on camera, have you ever heard them say, “Hi, Dad?” Nope, it’s “Hi, Mom.”

You’re lucky, Frances, you ARE very, very young- humility and wisdom can come with age.
kit9

‘Martel was using her political science degree as a cudgel’

This sentence is beyond funny. Oh, yes, the world quakes in fear at the intellect a lousy poli sci degree suggests! You’ve got to be kidding. It’s a tiny step up from, Communications degree, for god’s sake.
Gasket

WCinWI said:
Link? I can link to many videos in which she takes liberals on CNN to task. Go ahead. Point me to an article that she’s authored that’s wrong. I’ll wait.

I am not going to argue with you or even attempt to “prove” anything. I have done that enough times and don’t care to do so with you. You’re not a serious person. You are the same person who thinks Sarah Palin is a genius and infallible. Loesch is a dropout and a vacuous drone. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dana_Loesch I have watched plenty of her ad hoc interviews on CNN, even before she was employed there and she has always been vapid in debate. Nobody of importance takes her dumbass seriously. Martel reduced her to hurling invectives. Martel won by default. Can not articulate a cogent POV and resort to saying “You are a bitch!” Wow. What an insightful and persuasive argument sister! Sigh.
TillieGlockenspiel

kit9 said:
‘Martel was using her political science degree as a cudgel’

This sentence is beyond funny. Oh, yes, the world quakes in fear at the intellect a lousy poli sci degree suggests! You’ve got to be kidding. It’s a tiny step up from, Communications degree, for god’s sake.

How true, and I have one.
Azarkhan

“As a woman who chose to study politics instead of procreating for a living (?), I’m very offended by this mentality”

That is a dumbass thing to say. Besides, a polisci degree is akin to a journalism or business degree-it means very little in the real world.
http://www.mediaite.com/tv/glenn-beck-explains-how-the-unions-are-using-teachers-firefighters-and-co ImNotBlue

However, Loesch took great offense at Martel’s criticism, arguing that she has no room to criticize anything related to motherhood, because Martel is not a mother.
Apart from the substantive issues of their debate, by this logic the only person
qualified to criticize an elected official is someone who has held elected office. For that
matter, it is akin to claiming that one cannot talk about drug policy unless he or she
has significant experience doing drugs.

Which is exactly the opposite of what the left does when talking about things like abortion… remember, “it’s a woman’s choice” because men don’t understand. Funny how sometimes we can all “get it, and sometimes we can’t.
jakester

TeaPartyPatriot said:
Did martel actually expect DECENCY from a “Corrupt B-tard” at the c(lowns)n(itwits and socialist)n(attering nabobs) network ?

Another brilliant teabagger mind at work.
kit9

‘She has absolutely nothing to work with other than being loud’

She has plenty to work with as she has a real job at a real network, CNN. You work for Mediate. Dana-100, Francis ‘mothers are antiAmerican’-0.
Colby Hall

kit9 said:
‘Martel was using her political science degree as a cudgel’

This sentence is beyond funny. Oh, yes, the world quakes in fear at the intellect a lousy poli sci degree suggests! You’ve got to be kidding. It’s a tiny step up from, Communications degree, for god’s sake.

Excellent job of selectively editing my words. The whole graph reads:

“While her detractors probably thought that, at times, it felt as though Martel was using her political science degree as a cudgel, her more persuasive explanation for why she would certainly know the definition of communism was that her parents immigrated from Cuba. “
OZ

I a couple of questions. Does Dana Loesch have to be drunk, before she goes on air? And has she ever sought the help of AA? You realize that if she was half way educated, she would understand that excessive drinking is not good for your health.
murf

S Chuñdy said:
If being a stay-at-home mother is such an accomplishment, why do they only get paid in macaroni art and juice boxes? There’s a reason why women with a college education (e.g. smart women) don’t have children (or at the very least, wait until they’re older to have children): they don’t see themselves solely as baby-making machines.

If you’re under 29 and have children, you’re (probably–there are always exceptions) an uneducated rube living inside a shoe.

Dana Loesch is a nobody: maybe that’s why she’s on CNN and not FOX.

Wow .
Sean68

Is Martel the fat one?
Sean68

Sean68 said:
Is Martel the fat one?

Errr…I mean the one who can’t write for shit?
TillieGlockenspiel

OZ said:
I a couple of questions. Does Dana Loesch have to be drunk, before she goes on air? And has she ever sought the help of AA? You realize that if she was half way educated, she would understand that excessive drinking is not good for your health.

Oz, my dear, you obviously don’t know many drunks. Look at Special Ed and you can see the typical complexion. Dana Loesch simply said she’d had a few Margaritas and her complexion puts the lie to allegations that she has a drinking problem. Practicing alcoholics have no idea how obvious their addiction is, even when they haven’t had anything to drink that day.
avoidswork

The_Reasonable_Lib said:
Or maybe you’re so far on the fringe that you instintively believe that anything moderate is actually liberal. Based on your own espoused beliefs I can tell you’re not libertarian. Your post says nothing, just mindless drivel about how “liberal” this site is. This is in contrast to the words of a multitude of prominent media figures including Glenn Beck who have described them as fair and moderate. Now carry on, troll.

she’s not a troll! she’s not!

she’s a wannabe lawyer who is, like, awesome or something. she has more than one degree! can you believe it?! someone with a bachelor’s and a graduate degree! what are the odds of anyone elsoe on this board having TWO degrees! Or more than two?!

blockquote cite=”comment-457480″>Gasket said:
Loesch is an idiot, always has been. She couldn’t debate a topic to save her life.

not according to her! her uterus produced a human being. she’s more than qualified to fly a plane! to run an elected office! to drink many margaritas and make an *ss out of herself!
TillieGlockenspiel

After googling Martel, this appeared.

http://blog.reidreport.com/2010/05/mediaites-ann-coulter-frances-martel-makes-fools-of-them-with-obama-affair-smear/

It does sound as though Ms. Martel needs a little age on her.
TillieGlockenspiel

Perhaps we should consider her intemperate words simply the result of age and inexperience. BTW, Frances, I’m glad for you and your family that you escaped Cuba. Many moons ago, my dad told me that before Castro, it was one of the most beautiful places he had ever been.
avoidswork

sweet. an entire blog devoted to calling out ms. loesch:
http://danabusted.blogspot.com/

she’s a college dropout, tea party advocate who works with breitbart. doesn’t that really tell you everything you need to know about her?
Cecelia

Illogical appeals to a special authority via motherhood aside, I’m going to go out on a limb and assume that the woman in the highly unflattering photo posted here is Dana Loesch.
mlb

“…Anyway, to willfully abstain from participating in the free market, to me, is unAmerican, ”

Well, Frances, I sincerely hope that your mom worked every single day at a paying job, of course, during your childhood. I would hate to think after leaving communist Cuba that in itself wasn’t enough to earn your respect but rather earning her keep.
It will be interesting to hear from your perspective when you have a child and CHOOSE to leave it in a daycare to be raised by strangers- better yet, you could pay YOUR mom to raise your kids. Then you can remain soundly within your ‘definition’ of an American.
Edith Massey

TillieGlockenspiel said:
After googling Martel, this appeared.

http://blog.reidreport.com/2010/05/mediaites-ann-coulter-frances-martel-makes-fools-of-them-with-obama-affair-smear/

It does sound as though Ms. Martel needs a little age on her.

Agreed, it explains so much to finally know that she is only 23, you need to grow up a bit Francis.
Edith Massey

I know Mediaite probably like most blogs hire these kids right out of school, with zero work experience and more importantly zero life experience. I know they are cheap labor but come on Abrams, hire someone who can write and has some perspective.

A 23 year old Libertarian, that is hilarious.
Edith Massey

Edith Massey said:
Agreed, it explains so much to finally know that she is only 23, you need to grow up a bit Francis.

What what is Ann Coulter’s excuse she is a 53 year old tranny who still says stupid stuff.
Edith Massey

notsofast said:
Don’t ya just love Martel’s elitism? I got a degree, I want to see your resume,…!

She’s the white Star Jones!

Typical lib.

The first defense of every 20 something pseudo intellectual is to produce their degree, Francis, a piece of paper doesn’t make you intelligent and certainly doesn’t make you a good writer, life experience and lots of practice does.
konspikuous

Censoring the headline is lame.
Edith Massey

I just realized why Francis Martel saw fit to crap all over a 13 year old girl in her article. THEY ARE PRACTICALLY THE SAME AGE!!!!

http://www.mediaite.com/tv/rebecca-black-friday-superstar-finds-herself-in-bill-oreillys-reality-check-crosshairs/
Tedderman

Honestly though, has Dana Lush(sic) ever met anyone she hasn’t argued with and called a bitch?
Dem4Ever

She really meant c*nt not b*tch.
illusive man

Well Frances does erase/censor a lot of comments.

That does seem like b!tch behavior to me.

Dana is correct.
Azarkhan

avoidswork said:
she’s a college dropout, tea party advocate who works with breitbart. doesn’t that really tell you everything you need to know about her?

It tells me Dana Loesch is an ambitious, smart and hard-working woman who made it in the media world despite the fact that the odds were stacked against her. BTW, what’s on your resume?
david r

Colby Hall said:
Excellent job of selectively editing my words. The whole graph reads:

“While her detractors probably thought that, at times, it felt as though Martel was using her political science degree as a cudgel, her more persuasive explanation for why she would certainly know the definition of communism was that her parents immigrated from Cuba. ”

Sounds like she rules the roost around there. I guess by her logic, Huey Long knew nothing about politics.
M Colins

avoidswork said: not according to her! her uterus produced a human being. she’s more than qualified to fly a plane! to run an elected office! to drink many margaritas and make an *ss out of herself!

Idiotic! Loesch is simply pointing out that she has skin in the game that Martel doesnt. Parenthood certainly grants perspective. And Martel’s characterizing herself as someone who chose to have a career rather than staying at home to procreate is certainly as incendiary as “bitch”. She reduces Loesch to broodmare and you types go all atwitter with proxy outrage over her rejoinder. Youre like NFL refs who miss the infraction and flag the retaliation.
Azarkhan

1:20–Frances: “How do you think you can have a discussion about politics if you don’t have a college degree in politics?”

Because you see, that’s really all Frances has at the age of 23.
jimfact

You can’t blame Frances for thinking she is a libertarian with parents from the Republic of Cuba and an education from the Peoples Republic of Cambridge.
James Randal

After watching this video, I have developed respect for Frances Martel. She should’ve called that teabagger/GOP pig the C word in response. I was also laughing hysterically at the MSNBC reference. MSNBC shits on CNN night in and night out. Who the hell cares about Breitbart’s bullshit websites? Dana is a typical teabagger/GOP pig. She is a uterus on a stick.
James Randal

Frances Martel has finally been exposed to the intellectual dishonesty of Breitbart’s minions. Why she still shows respect for the head pig is beyond me. Good work Frances. Now please start calling out Breitbart for his bullshit as well.
James Randal

Azarkhan said:
1:20–Frances: “How do you think you can have a discussion about politics if you don’t have a college degree in politics?” Because you see, that’s really all Frances has at the age of 23.

Teabagger/GOP pig. She was using that nasty animal’s argument against her.
James Randal

Azarkhan said:
It tells me Dana Loesch is an ambitious, smart and hard-working woman who made it in the media world despite the fact that the odds were stacked against her. BTW, what’s on your resume?

What a dumb bastard. She works for a piece of shit named Andrew Breitbart. She probably did sexual favors in order to get the job. She is an intellectual midget.
ElCapitanAmerica

I’m torn, I don’t know whose side I should be taking here.

I’ve seen Dana Loesch on TV. She’s very pretty, but doesn’t really have much to contribute intellectually. This exchange kind of shows that short coming. One thing is for sure, her credentials are not impressive at all.

Frances Martel, I had no idea who this person was before this article. I’m guessing she has some kind of degree in “political science”, if that is the case, my advise to you Frances is not to brag about it. By any measure (and I’m definitively not talking economic), that’s not really the type of degree that I will show off at parties to show I’m really smart or contribute much to society.

I guess we all lose with this article and included YouTube clip, I certainly feel a bit dumber for having wasted time on it.
Pokerdude777

whooooooo hooooooooo!!! A cat fight ……. but no video…..dammmmm. That’s like watching a football game with no sound…. *sigh*
edisciple

Girl fight! Boo hoo, I was called a B word…oh well, I’ll just call mother’s “unAmerican!” Ah, say you deserve the B word Martel!
seek

All you “guys” who commented negatively about Dana, have no skin in this exchange and never will.

We who have children and made very difficult choices of either staying home and struggling financially or going to work and struggling emotionally are the ones who would know if Frances’ words deserved the label Dana called her.

I think Colby should have stayed out of it instead of injecting himself in it.

A young woman of 23 has no idea what she will do if and when she decides to have a child. Women who have sworn that a baby will not change their chosen path have gone through complete 180 when they finally have one.

I would no more tell a woman what to do and how to handle her family obligations than tell her that she has to have a child she doesn’t want.

Why does Frances feel she has the right to denigrate someone who made a different choice than Frances imagines she will?

Frances owes Dana an apology. Colby should have stayed away from the story like the plague.
pinandpuller

Frances “The Cudgel” Martel, beats back a marauding army of working moms.

Sounds like she’s been educated beyond her intelligence (or beyond her experience at the very least).
Pablo

The_Reasonable_Lib said:
Please tell me what exactly you were quoting so that I can properly destroy your argument once again.

Sorry about the quote fail. And I’m sorry about your lack of deductive ability, and thus will lead you directly to it. Your comment to which I was responding was this one. So, have at me. Whatcha got?
Pablo

Magister said:
Clarification to my previous comment: Using salty and emotional language isn’t a crime. Of course, if Loesch had been making Polish jokes in a public forum, it’d be a different situation, but the word b*tch is pretty boring and part of most people’s vocabulary, so what should CNN have said?

“Mr. Hall, don’t you have anything more important that you should be doing?”
http://twitter.com/SailRabbits Magister

@Pablo: Thumbs up!
avoidswork

M Colins said:
Idiotic! Loesch is simply pointing out that she has skin in the game that Martel doesnt. Parenthood certainly grants perspective. And Martel’s characterizing herself as someone who chose to have a career rather than staying at home to procreate is certainly as incendiary as “bitch”. She reduces Loesch to broodmare and you types go all atwitter with proxy outrage over her rejoinder. Youre like NFL refs who miss the infraction and flag the retaliation.

Of course parenthood grants a perspective that those without children do not have, but it doesn’t mean she rules the world or has a “political” perspective over non-parents. In her article, she writes as though fiscal responsibility, teaching responsibility with firearms, teaching about US history, etc., is some uniquely parental/maternal POV.

I call BS. One doesn’t have to have children to think ALL children should be protected or learn history or have responsible parents who teach them responsibly. But I would also point to DLoesch that there are a lot of subpar parents out there.

Then, in her verbal with Martel, she does a false equivalency: she alleges Martel has no standing to discuss motherhood and Martel points out that the degree-less Loesch has no standing to discuss political science. Of course, the TPer throws in “elitism” and calls Martel a “communist *ss”. DLoesch also alleges that Martel doesn’t know anything about communism, calls her a b*tch, then all she can keep saying to Martel is about the fact that Martel doesn’t have kids excludes her qualification about talking about motherhood.

I’m glad to hear that 23-yr old Martel isn’t a mother. She’s got plenty of time, if she chooses, to have a family. Sounds like her background is already more impressive that Loesch’s. She has parents who fled Cuba, came to the US and raised a young woman who got herself into Harvard. She worked hard and is now entering the blogosphere/journalistic world. At minimum, she doesn’t deserve to be called a “communist *ss” by any person.

And all Loesch could parrot was “are you a mother?” She also showed a lot of maturity by calling Martel an *ss and a b*tch.

I hope she’ll be a good mother and protect her children from her poor judgement and language when talking to a woman 8 years younger than she is.
Pablo

Cecelia said:
Illogical appeals to a special authority via motherhood aside, I’m going to go out on a limb and assume that the woman in the highly unflattering photo posted here is Dana Loesch.

This one is better. And this one. And this one. And this one.
Azarkhan

Cecelia said:
I’m going to go out on a limb and assume that the woman in the highly unflattering photo posted here

is Frances Martel. You’re right. She needs to take a semester or two with Jenny Craig.
http://twitter.com/SailRabbits Magister

@Pablo: Though to be fair, the post does look like an attempt to spark a blogwar and that could be good for both site’s traffic. Unfortunately, I think the way the discussion is characterized in the post and the embed probably does more harm to this site than the other and calling CNN sounds a lot like running to the hall monitor.
Azarkhan

avoidswork said:
She also showed a lot of maturity by calling Martel an *ss and a b*tch.

You got that right. Frances acted like she was having a debate with some punk ass college kid. She forgot she was dealing with a real woman who wasn’t gonna put up with her bullshit.
lane

Frances called Dana a ‘drunk’ and said she was not educated enough for political discussion.

First, that’s all very rude, I don’t think Colby should ‘out’ his own columnist to try to score points against Dana. Both Frances and Dana should try to be more professional.

Second, I have an BA in political science so I suppose Frances would listen to my opinion. My MBA is in finance, and let me tell you, I’m a snob on one point too. I think political science is a cake-walk of a degree. If you read a lot of political theory books and history, it’s the same thing. I wouldn’t get all excited about the degree thing. In life, experience matters more than education because you can certainly self-educate all you want. Plus, snobs really are the rudest. I would hide that trait, not highlight it.
http://www.zazzle.com/talkingpoints NORBIT Jr.

Frances was the better-reasoned of the two.

This Dana is an embarrassment to Conservatives.

Listen to Newt’s ideas…they’re well thought-out & explained.
Edith Massey

It is weird that I got so many thumbs up’s on this thread and that I agree with the majority of Republicans on here, seriously Francis is out of her league and really shouldn’t be writing for such a high profile media blog, she is probably a smart kid but probably needs to spend about 5 years learning this profession and honing her journalistic skills. She is in over her head.
dandelion28

Edith Massey said:
It is weird that I got so many thumbs up’s on this thread and that I agree with the majority of Republicans on here, seriously Francis is out of her league and really shouldn’t be writing for such a high profile media blog, she is probably a smart kid but probably needs to spend about 5 years learning this profession and honing her journalistic skills. She is in over her head.

No kidding. It was like watching a couple of sixth graders “debate.”
lane

Dana posts a fuller listing of the twitter exchang, at http://bigjournalism.com/dloesch/2011/05/11/mediaites-selective-reporting/
with some pretty good shots at Mediaite’s own salty comment language.

I think Colby should include more of the twitter exchange, it certainly adds a lot of context to the later verbal exchange.
lane

Barack Must Go said:
I’ll pay for the pudding or Jello. Your choice ladies. Is Dana Loesch the spitting image ( widows peak and all ) of Lilly Munster or what ?

Dana’s a pretty woman, so don’t let the Mediaite picture fool you. Not that it matters.
Azarkhan

lane said:
Dana posts a fuller listing of the twitter exchang, at http://bigjournalism.com/dloesch/2011/05/11/mediaites-selective-reporting/
with some pretty good shots at Mediaite’s own salty comment language.

That is pretty devastating. Thanks for posting the link.
Resistance Is Futile

Mediaite is a sad blog. The truth and education are not important here. This reflects the dumbing down of America. A blog for uneducated people.
Azarkhan

Resistance Is Futile said:
A blog for uneducated people.

I guess that’s why you’re here.
cjd ohio 1

Resistance Is Futile said:
Mediaite is a sad blog. The truth and education are not important here. This reflects the dumbing down of America. A blog for uneducated people.

glad to see you here too, you belong here with us
BarneyFranken

James Randal said:
What a dumb bastard. She works for a piece of shit named Andrew Breitbart. She probably did sexual favors in order to get the job. She is an intellectual midget.

This is misogyny at its finest…

What, Tommy Christopher can’t perform sexual favors to get ahead too?

Pig.
JennyAaberg

Colby Hall wrote:

“Dana Loesch is a contributor to CNN, yet she revealed at the outset of her debate that she’d had four margaritas before calling Martel a bitch. Would other networks allow their contributors to engage in this sort of public discourse?”

I agree that Loesch having four margaritas before going on air and then calling Martel a bitch isn’t good form, but do you really think CNN is going to object to that when they’ve got freaking Client Number 9 as a host on one of their prime time programs? Eliot Spitzer is WAY more offensive than anything Dana Loesch could ever say or do.
Catoi

From the original article:

“[B]y this logic the only person qualified to criticize an elected official is someone who has held elected office.”

This analogy is inapt. What Dana is saying is that one who is not a mother cannot comment with the same level of insight as a mother can on how motherhood changes a woman’s outlook on many issues.

In other words, it’s like saying that the only person who can speak authoritatively about what it feels like to be an elected official is an elected official.
dougx

How old is Martel. Usually when they hit 38, they start panicking and want to have a baby.
snatchax

anyone who says stay-at-home moms are second-class citizens should be called a bitch. after 4 margaritas i don’t think i could only say it once.
brownsound

James Randal said:
Teabagger/GOP pig. She was using that nasty animal’s argument against her.

How much did Media Matters pay you for that one? a nickle for each “teabagger” and “pig”. I see alot of you MM guys using both in your posts
X-3

I think stay-at-home Moms are heroes, but no moreso than the fathers who work hard to earn enough to allow their children to have full-time Moms.

Nice try for Colby to help Frances “even the score.” No less than what I expected from a liberal hack.
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Michael_T

Perhaps the best way I can put this is with a dinner analogy.

I could easily have a conversation over dinner with the assertive, but funny, Ann Coulter or Joy Behar. They can both be blunt and acerbic with their strong political views. But I have little doubt that if I didn’t insult them or name call we could have a lively – even funny conversation.

Of course the same would be truer of Rachel Maddow or S.E. Cupp. Two pundits who have accomodating personalities and respect for other views.

But these two (Loesch and Martel) – no way would I want to spend anytime with them. Rigid in their views, insulting in their rhetoric and too apt to resort to personal attacks – or at least resort to insults.

But that’s just me. I have no tolerance for meanness or poor manners in a public setting. Life’s too short.
Michael_T

The_Reasonable_Lib said:
There’s that old conservative class!!!!!

My reaction as well.

Why does it seem like when it comes to political women most of the meanness comes from the conservatives … not all, but most.?

Personally I think it is a habit picked up from talk radio. Just like your teenage son may come home with a potty mouth if he kept spending his weekends with the “Jersey Shore” crowd. :)
http://constitutionallibertarian.co.cc DavidKramer

What a joke.

A lot of liberals here are going on and on about how Dana was being out of hand when the exact opposite is true. Typical projection by the masters of hypocrisy. Who started this whole brouhaha with calling someone nothing more than a baby factory? Also implying that anyone that did not got to school for some worthless political degree should not bother to inject anything into the political discussion.

What I find highly humorous in this whole thing, Martel and Mediaite both showed their lack of class and what they really believe. REALLY, contacting CNN to get their viewpoint on it? WOW, what did you expect, her to get fired for calling a B#tch a B#tch?

Martel is NO LIBERTARIAN. Her thought process on the role of any citizen to engage in the political discussion and our very self government is antithetical to that name. Being a Constitutional Libertarian for the past 20 years, over 40 by the way, I would group her in with a elitist mentality of governance. Where only the “edumacated” have a say in our own governance.

MARTEL, do us all a favor and go to the party and ideology you really belong to, the progressives/liberals/socialists/communists or whatever they are calling themselves nowadays.
pinandpuller

Michael_T said:
Why does it seem like when it comes to political women most of the meanness comes from the conservatives … not all, but most.?

Most? Surely you mean targets of meaness?

If it were me I’d play golf with Rachel Maddow any day and let her hit from the Men’s tee-not that there’s anything wrong with that!
pinandpuller

DavidKramer said:
Martel is NO LIBERTARIAN. Her thought process on the role of any citizen to engage in the political discussion and our very self government is antithetical to that name. Being a Constitutional Libertarian for the past 20 years, over 40 by the way, I would group her in with a elitist mentality of governance. Where only the “edumacated” have a say in our own governance.
MARTEL, do us all a favor and go to the party and ideology you really belong to, the progressives/liberals/socialists/communists or whatever they are calling themselves nowadays

She’s a Libertarian like Bill Maher is: legalize Pot.
http://www.sarainitalyblog.blogspot.com/ sarainitaly

“As a woman who chose to study politics instead of procreating for a living (?), I’m very offended by this mentality”

I don’t understand why Frances took issue with the post. I don’t find it offensive, or wrong, nor does it say that non-mothers are not political. I think Dana raises some good points about why more and more moms are becoming involved politically. Sounds like it was a positive mom story for mothers day…

I don’t think Dana should have called her a biotch, but I must say that tweet does come across as *rather bitchy*.

So, a woman who has children doesn’t study anything but procreating? They can’t also study politics? I am confused by her tweet…

“she has no room to criticize anything related to motherhood, because Martel is not a mother. Apart from the substantive issues of their debate, by this logic the only person qualified to criticize an elected official is someone who has held elected office. For that matter, it is akin to claiming that one cannot talk about drug policy unless he or she has significant experience doing drugs.”

I disagree that you can’t criticize or comment or discuss an issue, not having first hand experience. however, first hand experience gives you a perspective that you can not have without it. You can not know exactly where a mother is coming from, wrt to her concern over her child’s future, unless you too, have a child. You can discuss it, and criticize it, but you can’t *know*. Same with an elected official – you can’t truly know, unless you are one.

“willfully abstain from participating in the free market, to me, is unAmerican,”
Playing the age card, I am going to bet that Frances, as a single 23 year old, will have a much different outlook in 20 years wrt stay at home moms, and the importance of their role, in society.

I tried to listen to the clip and it was too hard to understand – I will try to listen to the whole thing, later.
Barack Must Go

Michael_T said:
My reaction as well.

Why does it seem like when it comes to political women most of the meanness comes from the conservatives … not all, but most.?

Personally I think it is a habit picked up from talk radio. Just like your teenage son may come home with a potty mouth if he kept spending his weekends with the “Jersey Shore” crowd. :)

How do you do that? Not to many fellas can let alone bend over and service themselves like that, yet you can do while still typing.
Pablo

I’d like to know how one procreates for a living.
http://www.sarainitalyblog.blogspot.com/ sarainitaly

Pablo said:
“As a woman who chose to study politics instead of procreating for a living (?), I’m very offended by this mentality”

“As a woman who chose to study politics instead of procreating for a living (?), I’m very offended by this mentality”

I just realized I misinterpreted her tweet a little. I thought she was saying people who study procreation, instead of politics – her comment was even bitchier than I thought…. That’s a low blow.
jegget

Martel’s comments are indefensible. Dana treated her with more respect than she deserved. According to Martel’s twitter account, my own mother is “unamerican and lazy” and a “womb”. All for being a stay at home mom. Martel doesn’t seem like a terrible person to me, but I couldn’t be more offended by what she said. I guess they don’t teach class or tact to political science majors.
http://constitutionallibertarian.co.cc DavidKramer

pinandpuller says:
She’s a Libertarian like Bill Maher is: legalize Pot.

LOL. Yep, that is the usual extent of the pseudo libertarians.

They have no stance on the federal legal tender laws.
They have no stance on forcing people paying for services they do not want-property taxation for public schools.
They believe in open borders but they still want to give free services to those same people breaking our immigration laws.
They have NO IDEA what a true libertarian believes.

Libertarianism’s basic tenet is self governance. In ALL aspects. The closest true libertarians are communities like the Amish or the Menonites. They do not want government interference or help in any of their affairs. I wonder if Martel took any help paying for her schooling, unemployment, etc?

I wonder if Martel would call for the release of ALL people in jail for non victimization crimes?

I wonder if Martel realizes that seizure of private property like property taxes or labor income taxes is a soft form of communism?

I wonder if Martel even know what allodial titles are?

I REALLY dislike progressives infiltrating my party. Just as I am sure Republicans dislike progressives infiltrating their party.
Liberal Tormentor

Hey Colby, how about an update to include Dana’s response?

Mediaite’s Selective Reporting

http://bigjournalism.com/dloesch/2011/05/11/mediaites-selective-reporting/
ARC91681

As a woman with a political science degree who chooses to stay at home with my son, I’m offended by Ms. Martel’s comments. What does she have against mothers who want to raise their own children?
Kitsune

ARC91681 said:
As a woman with a political science degree who chooses to stay at home with my son, I’m offended by Ms. Martel’s comments. What does she have against mothers who want to raise their own children?

My best guess is that she sees them as an obstacle to her own empowerment. The old “If you’re not with me, you’re against me” view.
Liberal Tormentor

Frannie,
Do us and your future children a favor and don’t reproduce.
Michael_T

sarainitaly said:
I think Dana raises some good points about why more and more moms are becoming involved politically. Sounds like it was a positive mom story for Mother’s Day…

I think you make a very valid point. All Dana seemed to be conveying was that conservative mom’s are becoming increasingly concerned about their children’s future.

Frances OTOH took this as an opportunity to mock those who do not choose college over starting a family. IMO she missed a real opportunity to criticize those in the Tea Party crowd who are anti-intellectual.

In this world economy we need to embrace, fund and encourage higher education – not label (and vilify) the highly educated as some kind of effete elitist mutant snobs. Instead (and somewhat ironically) Frances comes across as the real snob in this cat fight. What a golden opportunit wasted.
lane

Frances’ tweets about mother and politics would make even the most reasonable woman want to use profanity. Call CNN and apologize, that’s ridiculous.

Colby, do you really think you should ‘call out’ Dana for profanity with the extremely rude tweets from Frances. I’m looking at Frances Martel’s witter feed, and holy crap. It’s stunningly rude. To all woman, since the whole point is for woman to have the choice that works best for their family.

For example, Frances tweets “Well, 2 points: people who don’t study politics have less valid opinions than those who do; also choosing not to work bothers me”.

Another charmer tweet from Frances “@DLoesch No no no– I clarified to @meredithdake before, I think you’re encouraging housewife mothers to get into politics, which is bad

how about Frances tweets “glorifying motherhood as a career is really disrespectful to women who put off motherhood to be something more than a womb”

Also from Frances, tweets “Women whose career is to be a “mother” and nothing else SHOULD BE second class citizens, because they choose to be unemployed”.

And yes, there are more…

Being young is no excuse for such rudeness. How mediaite can post this story as an attack on Dana is a shocker. I cannot believe your story is not updated yet. Read for yourself http://twitter.com/#!/francesmartel

Honestly, I cannot believe you focused on Dana’s actions. This is a learning experience for Frances, not Dana. And to think you whined to CNN about their employees professional conduct. Ironic.
lane

Sorry for the long last post. I just was shocked by Frances’ tweets on the subject. Colby’s attacks on Dana were shocking as well.
juan

WOW – MEDIATE:
. . . . . .

The only mistake made was that my attention was given to a website that routinely attacks conservative women (conservatives in general, really), whose White House correspondent routinely cusses at readers on the site (with the approval of Mediaite Editor Colby Hall, apparently) –

– with the belief that they would be professional enough to extend the courtesy of objectivity to this topic. (Context)

P.S. The comments at Mediaite on this are amazing.

*More perspective from Turncoat Diva.

** Bigs contributor Dan Riehl chimes in.

http://bigjournalism.com/dloesch/2011/05/11/mediaites-selective-reporting/
http://www.sarainitalyblog.blogspot.com/ sarainitaly

juan said:
WOW – MEDIATE:

wow, i just went and read the tweets. those were bad… and i don’t have kids, but i found them offensive.
VoiceofReason

The_Reasonable_Lib said:
This is what I find funny; the AP is touted around here like a media god by some people when they fact check Obama and damn near any other time. Then one time the report something the fringe doesn’t like and they’re biased garbage. That’s when they go back to gallup which they just said was biased garbage a month ago. LOL

Actually dumbass they are not touting it at all….they are clowning on the deck stacking they did to falsely claim Obama was more popular than he was…….you’d know this if you EVER read anything besides that which echoes your own ideals.

dumbass.
VoiceofReason

kit9 said:
‘Martel was using her political science degree as a cudgel’ This sentence is beyond funny. Oh, yes, the world quakes in fear at the intellect a lousy poli sci degree suggests! You’ve got to be kidding. It’s a tiny step up from, Communications degree, for god’s sake.

Amen.

I take shit for my engineering degrees from physicists who claim engineers are lightweight thinkers.

You can only imagine their disdain for those of the “squishy” sciences like poli sci and sociology…….
VoiceofReason

Colby Hall said:
Excellent job of selectively editing my words. The whole graph reads: “While her detractors probably thought that, at times, it felt as though Martel was using her political science degree as a cudgel, her more persuasive explanation for why she would certainly know the definition of communism was that her parents immigrated from Cuba. ”

It doesn’t make it any better or right.

I am a detractor and she’s simply a bitch. And armed with nothing but bitchiness……no clubs. Just world class PMS.
VoiceofReason

TillieGlockenspiel said:
After googling Martel, this appeared. http://blog.reidreport.com/2010/05/mediaites-ann-coulter-frances-martel-makes-fools-of-them-with-obama-affair-smear/ It does sound as though Ms. Martel needs a little age on her.

I might have a bit better understanding of AC than some here but one thing I know for sure…….Fran…..u couldn’t polish AC’s pumps.

Manny still on the sauce, dimwit?
VoiceofReason

M Colins said:
Idiotic! Loesch is simply pointing out that she has skin in the game that Martel doesnt. Parenthood certainly grants perspective. And Martel’s characterizing herself as someone who chose to have a career rather than staying at home to procreate is certainly as incendiary as “bitch”. She reduces Loesch to broodmare and you types go all atwitter with proxy outrage over her rejoinder. Youre like NFL refs who miss the infraction and flag the retaliation.

Perhaps Fran’s prob is nobody wants to put a baby in her and it’s the green eyed monster rearing it’s ugly head.

Fear not Frannie….there’s a world full of chubby chasers out there and one is just right for you!!
essequamvideri

Hey Colby Hall!

Why haven’t you updated your story? WHY didn’t you post the entire interview? Because you know that Franny comes off as a complete imbecile!

Listen to the whole interview:
http://bigjournalism.com/dloesch/2011/05/11/mediaites-selective-reporting/

Read Franny’s & Tommy’s obnoxious sexist tweets.

Libertarian? Sure. She’s just another Debauchery Libertarian – like Bill Maher. I wanna be freeee … as a bird – to smoke pot, to snort coke, to pop an Oxy, and to have unlimited sex with whatever gender and in whatever numbers – and pay for it if I so choose. And of course, Franny, just like Billy, show their totalitarian roots – F when she repeatedly asserts that only people w/ sufficient education (who’s the judge of that? a 23-yr old nobody?) should participate in politics, and B when he says that the American people should be dragged kicking & screaming into accepting ObamaCare.

This is absolutely dishonest reporting. No surprise from Mediate, which now runs the pesky pop-ups from MSLSD w/ libsmacktalkers Ed Schultz & Laurence O’Donnell.
essequamvideri

And no one’s talking about the huge elephant in the room …

There was a time when highly educated – even brilliant – people, engineers & doctors & lawyers; and talented, creative people – celebrities of their time – musicians, artists. actors ….. all collaborated, by commission and by omission – to virtually enslave groups of people, and to later exterminate them.

Who were those elitist brainiacs? The Nazis, and those who worked with them, and those who turned a blind eye to their evil, wicked power-hungry machinations.

Franny & Maher & TC would fit right in with the foolish, over-educated Ruling Class of 1930′s Germany. What was their original sin? The lust for power & control over others – and their putting themselves on pedestals in order to judge & condemn those who they thought just too stupid, or disabled, or uneducated, to understand their Big Ideas.
Liberal Tormentor

Don’t worry Colby, we’ve all collectively, “checked ourselves”.
PunditMom aka Joanne Bamberger

Motherhood is political — Dana just needs to know that she’s the worst example of it. The rest of us don’t need 4 margaritas or feel we have to call those we disagree with a bitch! Maybe she’ll read my book? ;)

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1933979941/ref=s9_simh_gw_p14_d0_i1?pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=center-2&pf_rd_r=0GXRDHHYRRDYTW3V0KEM&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p=470938631&pf_rd_i=507846
http://www.sarainitalyblog.blogspot.com/ sarainitaly

PunditMom aka Joanne Bamberger said:
Maybe she’ll read my book? ;)

probably not, since you insulted her so *bitchily*.
maizie75

Frances, you seem like a nice girl, but you seem to be implying that stay at home mothers don’t work and just “loot” the rest of society (I don’t know if Dana got the Rand reference, but I wouldn’t be surprised if she did.) I’m not a mother but I know many stay at home moms who work their butts off.
Common Sense

Common is no more a “Thug” than Dana Loesch. Slap yourself.