Jon Huntsman, who’s never been anything but a politician and has absolutely no scientific experience whatsoever, is in no position to be commenting on science in any credible way whatsoever.

If he *actually* knew anything about science, he’d know that the concept of “scientific consensus” is a non-scientific concept and a complete farce. Science isn’t what everyone “agrees” it is, science is what you can prove — in a falsifiable manner — and what you can repeat. Do any of these dumb shits think Galileo had any “consensus” when he observed that the Earth revolved around the sun?

But just what “mainstream” science are people running from? Chemistry, Physics,etc? It can’t be math because we know Huntsman is polling at around 1%- he seems like someone who is running away from logic and probability!

Fact: Climate change on Mars is due to the humans on earth and their carbon footprint!!!! I just wanted that clear Huntsman when we bum a ride there from Russia or China!!!!!

That’s false, Jon.

The GOP has successfully and continues to run away from mainstream science, studies, experts, education, intellect, etc.

It’s a party based almost solely on carnal emotion and ideology. They don’t have serious, practical policies to face the problems of a complex, dynamic world. Instead, they keep things VERY simple, for their base is VERY simple.

The GOP has essentially become a party of trolls, meant solely to annoy Democrats and fulfill the self-fulfilling prophecy of big bad government.

Yes, only scientists should be able to comment on science. I’ll roll with that premise if you will.

But you can’t say what science they have disavowed can yeah?

Provides links where the GOP candidates had disavowed Chemistry, Physics, Math, etc.

Do you think comparing human knowledge of the world in 1500 to human knowledge of the world in 2011 is a fair comparison?

Fact: Here is one of those greenies!!! Hook line and sinker!!!!!

Thanks for asking a question about something he did not suggest.

Education and training have nothing to do with it. He just doesn’t know jack about the scientific method. He thinks anyone who knows that the artificial concept of “scientific consensus” is a farce is anti-science, mainly because he doesn’t know what the hell he’s talking about.

Scientific method hasn’t changed in centuries. Shows how much you know.

If God wanted us to believe in science he would have paid for Christ to get that entomology degree from Judean Community College… God would rather have his son killed than become a scientist…that says everything.

oh ya?
how old is universe?
gop math says about 6,000 years….
gop science is to take drink, spin around, take a bribe and pick a card(from a stacked deck of course)

What you call “mainstream science” is nothing more than a religious belief system.

Repeating a phony lefty talking point gets you nowhere at all , Gov. H.

Mitt just said he wants to increase military spending, decrease spending on the arts, public radio in poor rural areas, transportation and medical assitance for millions…
yes it is true—
gop wants to GIVE money to millionaires not to grow corn on their estates, GIVE money to billion dollar oil and coal companies,. GIVE money to billionair hedge fund and stock manipilators.and of course more money to the war mongers..and by give i mean BORROW money from China for…

and at the same time cut education funding, cut funding for the arts, cut health care funding and as well as transportation and other programs for those who actually work the min wage jobs that make the millionaires–millionaires..
no i may not be the smartest guy on the block–but if all of my competitors were getting more educated, building stronger infrastructures, and a healtheir populace—i may not want to compete by just buying more guns..
but that is just me~
if this was the planet of the apes–the cons would be the gorillas–
they claim to believe in God/Jesus yet support policy that take food from the hungry, medicine from the sick and edcuation from the masses…as they do all they can do to pump more money to the ultra rich who pay less taxes than ever..
again–it may be me—but i think if you support the devil—you cannot go around praising Jesus–right?

Poor joe- link to a site where the GOP committee says the Earth is 6k years old.

You can’t do it, but thanks for lying anyway.

We have some great door prizes for ya!

and at the same time cut education funding”

What a joke- libs have been for more ed funding since  time began and the scores are lower and lower- get rid of the ineffective teachers.

You should get a new prescription-.

Sounds like God doesn’t like you.

Republicans are stupid by definition.  That’s what Republican means (stupid).  If anybody has evidence to the contrary, please present it now.

You prove Dems are totally ignorant and stupid- as a matter of fact, your pic in used to display cretinism.

There is some truth in your post, Mr Westover, but not enough. The idea “scientific concensus” simply refers to the number of scientists who do confirm the view that AGW is a real and actual phenomenon.  Your clan prefers to deliberately obscure the issue with phony and absurd rhetorical propositons–like your Intelligent (sic) Design.

Jon Huntsman simply states the fact that his party is largely opposed to intellectual concerns–and the dangers therein. Everybody can see the anti-intellectual culture of your party, Tony. You reflect this, as well, with your constant ranting about so-called “useless degrees.”

Galileo basically started “science,” and so, yes, his view would be seen as the “consensus” since virtually no others were practicing science at that time.

Always happy to help you, Tony!

Love, Brother Tim

To you–and, no doubt, your cousin Palin–the “lamestream scientific community” that agrees that AGW is a real and verifiable phenomenon, is a leftist scam.

Perhaps “mainstream medicine” is a “religious belief system,” too?

All of our health care costs would go down if you folks who hate science would get your health care at church on Sunday.

Maybe you folks just don’t believe ENOUGH in all that ‘hocus pocus?’

Poor Tim, Barry has assured us that by adding another 40 million who can not pay for HC  will reduce the costs of HC.

Yeah, now that’s real science!

LMAO

re: “who’s never been anything but a politician…”

from Wikipedia (I know, not the best resource, but good for this purpose):

“Huntsman worked as a White House staff assistant for Ronald Reagan, and he was appointed by George H.W. Bush as the Deputy Assistant Secretary of Commerce and later as United States Ambassador to Singapore from 1992–1993. Huntsman served as Deputy United States Trade Representative under George W. Bush, launching global trade negotiations in Doha, Qatar in 2001 and guiding the accession of China and Taiwan into the World Trade Organization.

Huntsman has also served as CEO of his family’s Huntsman Corporation
and was elected Governor of Utah in April, 2004 and won re-election in
2008 with nearly 78% of the vote. While governor, he also served as
chairman of the Western Governors Association and as a member of the Executive Committee of the National Governors Association. On August 11, 2009, he resigned as governor to accept an appointment as the United States Ambassador to the People’s Republic of China.”

Huntsman is pretty much on the opposite side of most political arguments from me, but he is far more qualified than the rest of the Republican field. He has breadth, depth, and education. He seems to lack the charisma of, say, Perry, but at least he’s capable of doing the job in a more than competent fashion. As a person mostly not sharing his political views, at least I wouldn’t worry about him launching nuclear missiles in the middle of the night at whoever Fox “News” has identified as today’s enemy.

Tony-you don’t need to bother to squawk about this. Yelling louder, meaner, more vociferously, doesn’t make you any more correct.

If Huntsman is dumb enough to fall for the liberal’s narrative of the “anit-science” GOP then he doesn’t deserve to even be allowed to run for the GOP nomination.  And this is exactly why he polls at 0%.

I believe in the prophet Zoroaster.  Obama is just our President… a fine and good president, but no God.  

We have always paid for those without health insurance, Mr Stonepark; those costs are simply passed on to the rest of us who have insurance or make use of medical care. Keeping people away from the emergency room when they need care will save all of us a lot of money.

Do you understand? I know you folks would prefer to let sick people without money die, but civilization involves something called the social contract, and the root of that last word, “civility.”

We care for those who can’t care for themselves–we don’t kill them.

That’s a core ‘belief’ of those who want to live in a civil society.

Tens of thousands…I’ll repeat, tens-of-thousands of progessional, well-established researchers and scientists have asserted there’s NO POSSIBLE WAY to measure man’s effect on climate change!

Everything else is POLITICS!

If this was truly accepted science, you wouldn’t have anywhere near this CATEGORICAL REJECTION of the advocate’s claims.

We should rightly call this speculative, politically-motivated science, NOT REAL SCIENCE!

Fact: Every post on this site that disputes what you post prove it daily that republicans are the intellects compared to the party of decinded apes!!!

Yes, add more to the HC system who can’t pay, and costs will go down.

Yeah, that’s why HC premiums are already going up, son!

was he the one who brought us Boston’s Chicken’s “roasted chicken?”

Yeah, nice work.

btw, Google key words and pages of scientist lists come up from around the world.

Use your heads, people, and let’s be rational about the supposed “remedies” being more harmful than some amorphous causal relations! 

Fact: It totally amazes me how the human race
survived without money so long until someone invented it and told a few ancestors
of the demarodent party about it and Walla the kleptomaniac man got its start!
Jesus preached that people believe in God and be self reliant and God would
take care of the people like the birds and the fish in the sea that if you work
you will be fed that’s it!!! Who cares about others money because you will die
and you can’t take it with you!!! Joe you are a moron!!!

Fact: Another public union ran school failure!!!!

Fact: Greg has no morals either!!!!

Stonepark:

Folks who don’t have health care will wait a long time to go to the emergency room–and then the cost of treating them will be much higher than if they went earlier.

That is why MORE health care will result in LOWER overall costs.

Anything else?

Clearly Jon is not running for president any longer.  He’s hoping to get tapped for the VP slot to balance out which ever far right candidate receives the nomination.  

“Tens of thousands…I’ll repeat, tens-of-thousands”

Foghorn Leghorn,is that you?

And btw, you’re full of shite.

You should listen to him. Maybe you could even learn something. If the candidate is too conservative he will lose to Obama.

Wow. Tens of thousands? That’s a lot. Meanwhile MILLIONS of scientists are saying that man has contributed to Global warming. Over 95% of the scientists agree on this one.

Norbit is an empty vessel. Don’t even bother.

In English, please? 

And God DOES like you. It’s everyone else who thinks you’re a brainless loser. 

I do believe in witches.
I do believe in witches.
I do believe in witches.

WHAT MILLIONS?
LOL!

So, if it’s so bad, and iminent, maybe everyone should stop driving cars?
EH!

Ex, did you check out Lori Patriots posts!

You’ll love em’!

LOL

What a load of horse shit!

Do You Believe in Evolution And/or Climate change (Global warming)?

“A fine and good president” LOL.

The bible tells them so!

If you consulted 100 doctors about your condition and 95 concluded that surgery is in order, why would you risk listening to the other 5? That’s the situation with climate change. Only the fringes of the scientific community doubt the evidence for man-made global warming, and the Teapublicans have chosen to throw their lot in with them. 

Huntsman has gone rogue on this one and it’s driving the right wing CRAZY that one of their own won’t stay in line and repeat the approved talking points. 

Just reading the comments here is like listening to the banter inside a psych ward.

You could nominate Stephen Hawking for Vice President and it wouldn’t balance out the idiocy at the top of the GOP’s ticket. 

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plausible

Fact: Get the jug out of your butt or put the crack pipe down awhile and re-read it again since you are no doubt a public union school epic failure! That’s a fact and that is in English again!!!!

Oops.

Would you like to get some coffee and talk it over?

I’ve seen them. I’m not impressed. And I’m not surprised you would be. 

I would love to discuss morality over a cup of coffee if you are interested.  

Fact: Those same scientist claim it was warmer when the dinosaurs ran the earth and I guess that man caused the global warming then too!!! Moron!!!!

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/be/Raffael_071.jpg

He tried 4 time to explain what Michelle and Barack were convicted of to lose their licenses today.
Because Barack would not release his college papers.
Finally gave up.
Pretty funny though.
Maddow performance art thread.

I am sure that is laughable to a man dedicated to illusion.

Fact: Read the English on this page idiot!!! http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2007/02/070228-mars-warming.html

Jon Huntsman Warns The GOP: ‘You Cannot Run Away From Mainstream Science’

TEASPEAK TRANSLATIONI do not want the nomination.

Fact: Al Gore’s greenism cult is live and well on Mediaite!!!!

If republicans are anti-science, than without question “progressives” are about hate and murder. Look at every “progressive” government in modern history. Soviet Russia, Nazi Germany, North Korea, Cuba, China, all dictatorships that value the collective over the individual and have killed millions in the name of social progress. That of course is only if they are allowed power. “Progressives” without power roll in the mud and oink like ravenous pigs. Example, OWS, enough said. 
If you run into an “anti-science republican”, which never happened in my experience, you can at least talk to them . If you run into a “progressive’ on a power trip, they’ll make you disappear, history has given hundreds of examples of that.
As a third party libertarian, I’d rather hang with the “anti-science” republicans over hateful and murderous “progressives” any day.

Fact:
You still have not told me what Michelle and Barack were convicted of.

Biology 101: Evolution.

Poor tim, if those not covered by insurance get treatment anyways, there is no reason to change the current system which over 80% approved of.

Any thing else I can explain for ya?

Where’s The BEEF?

Where’s the actual percentage and causal relationship?

THERE IS NONE!

…that’s why the UN had to make them up!

I had to hold the backspace button for 10 minutes to get rid of that mistake!

Fact: You can’t tell me why the FBI investigated them then all of a sudden they lost their right to practice law!!!!

fax, you should check out PJTV.com.

a fine and good president,”

Yes he gave us this in 3 short years:

9.0% unemploymentRecord # on welfareRecord# in povertyRecord # on food stampsRecord# in forecloseRecord debtRecord monthly deficitsAll during Obama’s 3 years.And Obama has added to the debt at twice the rate that Bush did!

Also, he always tells the truth:

Close Gitmo? End rendition? End warrantless wiretaps? End the Patriot Act? Unemployment not to exceed 8%? Provide a missile shield to the Czech Republic and Poland? Transparency? Health Care debate will be carried on C-Span? His mother was denied Health Care coverage? Shovel ready jobs? No lobbyists in his administration? Americans want higher taxes? Pledge to cut the deficit in half during his 1st term? USA involvement in Libya will be in days not weeks?  Pledge not to rest until the BP leak stopped?  ObamaCare Fee is not a new tax?  His pledge to “immediately” implement “Pay-As-You-Go.” No Earmarks in the $787 Billion Stimulus? 2010:Obama vows to cut huge deficit in half in first term? Obama promises a comprehensive immigration bill in his 1st year

Yes he is really a good president!

LMAO

I struck a nerve!

LMAO

Fact: I did not give up I just said that I couldn’t force Obama to release why they both lost the right to practice law when the FBI investigated them!!!! What was funny is they can’t and will never have the right ever again!!!!! hahahahahaha…………. That’s funny!!!

LOL

Yeah, but it sure would wipe out the magnificent ignorance of that Dbag know as Joe Biden!

Fact: Here is another 100 for you!!! http://www.stuffintheair.com/ancient-climates.html

progressives is only a new term for liberals (which I am proudly one).
So you’re trying to tell me that Soviet Russia, Nazi Germany, North Korea, Cuba, China, are or were run by a bunch of liberals?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_F._Buckley,_Jr.#Defining_the_boundaries_of_conservatism

Stonepark,

We lead the developed world in health care SPENDING, but we don’t lead the world in many categories of HEALTH i.e. life expectancy, pre-natal care, etc.

We simply don’t have a very efficient health care delivery system.

That’s why reform is necessary.

Fact: No proggies!!!!!

It totally amazes me how you have
survived without punctuation.

Evolution is a falsifiable theory. Anthropogenic Global Warming is not.

And I don’t “believe” in science, which just goes to show that you substitute things that you call “science” for a religious belief system. I don’t “believe” in science because putting faith in science negates the scientific method itself.

That was amusing, but nobody cares that you’re not smart enough to refute my truthful post.

Why do only 20% of Dems believe evolution alone explains human beings, while 34% believe God created man within the last 10000 years and 40% believed humans evolved with God’s help?

Fact: Not the view of what happened on the MSMLSD news when that guy spoke!!! He was glorified on the MSM toilet news channels!!!

Tim link to one reputable site that shows where any county’s health care costs have gone down.

Just one country!

MG- most people know who he was – Geez!

Another lib who can’t provide a link! As a matter of fact, you libs should be called the missing links!

LOL

Winning!

Here child, answer this:

Why do only 20% of Dems believe evolution alone explains human beings, while 34% believe God created man within the last 10000 years and 40% believed humans evolved with God’s help?

I belive in everything!
And everyone!
I believe!

The Latin word for liberalism is Libertas. That also means freedom.
There is nothing liberal about modern “liberalism”. Modern “liberalism” is about powerful, intrusive government and history shows you cant get farther away from freedom than powerful and intrusive government.
Modern “liberalism” and freedom is an oxymoron.
If you want to see a true/original liberalism, go to a libertarian website.

Vostok ice core samples present great evidence for AGW. Look at periods of high volcanic activity with respect to the Industrial Revolution.

Temperture changes track remarkably well with increased gases in the enviroment.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ice_core

Further showing that you don’t know what the hell you’re talking about, Anthropogenic Global Warming is not a valid scientific theory, it’s unfalsifiable. This is why fake scientific concepts like “consensus” have to made up to support AGW. AGW is nothing but a belief system, similarly to Intelligent Design.

And humorously continuing with your tradition of not knowing what the hell you’re talking about, Galileo did not “start” science. Natural philosophy — the precursor to the physical sciences — predates Galileo by over a millennium. And Galileo ideas came from Copernicus who developed the theory of a sun-centered solar system.

Do you ever get tired of being wrong?

I find it very appropriate that when the Russians were getting our nuclear secrets from Julius Rosenberg, the Russians gave him the code name Liberal!

LOL

Wikipedia? really?
So if I sighed up for Wikipedia and changed it to say that global warming is caused by circus clowns, you’d believe it?

You’re trying to convince the right-wing nuts that the earth is not flat.. good luck.

Fact: The facts speak for themself and require any formal punctuation to ease the liberal viewing!!!!

No, I’m pretty sure Jesus hates Stonepark.

 Talk about a stupid comment, you just made one- and talking about evolution, you must be the missing link.

You friends don’t call ya Java man because ya like coffee!

*LOL*

I do enjoy watching you dig holes for yourself.

If you’re so certain that AGW isn’t the belief system that it is and it’s a valid, falsifiable theory, then how about you be the first person in the history of that belief system to actually explain how it can be falsified. Make history here on the Mediate comments section and do that for us all.

Jesus loves me and I love Jesus, that’s why I go to heaven and you go to hell.

LOL

My belief is that a liberal is one who is a open minded person,More tolerant (Except maybe dickwads like Stonepark)LOL

Wow, you GOPbaggers are calling each other out all over the place today.

You watch why too much Glenn Beck!!

BTW my attacks on you are because you treat everyone like a dick not just me.
What’s good for the goose….er….Drag queen…

Who created God?
Where did he come from?

Funny thing is, is that Huntsman is the most reasonable Republican of the bunch. He doesn’t speak ill or hate  of the opposing party, has integrity and shows respect  and yet he is only at 1 or 2 %. It just shows you what the GOP has become.

True to your GOP form, you want to rely on Popper’s lovely–though largely unloved–’theory of falsifiability.’

Is your engineering-trained, anti-intellectual brain ready to head down that path, Mr Westover?

I’m gonna guess that you’re not a logician, Mr Westover. Perhaps you should have studied something more theoretical–and less ‘usefull’ in college?

Ready yourself for battle, lad, or scamper off while you still have some remaining dignity.

kisses,

Brother Tim

Oh, right. I forgot. Wikipedia is also part of the whole global liberal conspiracy. 

Man, there’s no bottom to your paranoia, is there? 

Get a job.

Sophistry is not truth, sparky.

lol

Yes I see it now!
You are so Christ like!
I must have been blind all this time!
LOL

I pity every engineer who imagines himself an arm chair “thinker.”

Hey GRAMPS.
ROSENBERG DIED 60 years ago.

The Latin word for liberalism is Libertas. That also means freedom.

THANK YOU.

I only treat dicks like dicks- that’s why I teat you like a rancid dick.

Rosenberg’s code name was “liberal”, dick head!

man are you libs stupid!

“The Venona intercept shows that Julius Rosenberg (code name LIBERAL) was the head of this particular spy ring.”

LMAO

But his code name was still “Liberal.”

LOL

*LOL*

I love how you quoted a giant chunk of his Wikipedia article to try to refute my truthful post that he’s been nothing but a politician all his life, and you copy-and-pasted an entire “yes, you are right, Tony”. Other than a short stint when he couldn’t get political work, he kept the CEO seat warm at daddy’s chemical company. Maybe if he had a master degree in chemical engineering like Charles and David Koch do, he might have actually contribute something to daddy’s company.

No, it shows ya what a dork he is.

just4thefax 12 hours ago in reply to progressive_kitty

Fact: Obama’s both claim to be lawyers but they both were
stripped of the right to practice law due to violations against the
law!!!! Criminals of a feather flock together!

WHAT VIOLATION????

MORON.

Poor child, you can’t answer the questions can ya.

And God always existed!

You’re making things up.

*LOL* They all agree that they believe in something that they can’t prove. How scientific of them!

And I love how morons always just pull numbers out of their ass when it comes to this. About half of scientists — i.e. the half that don’t beg the government for grants to study pig shit — don’t see any conclusive evidence to back up AGW.

He and other (R)egressives use Wikipedia when it suits them.

What did I make up, Kenny boy?

You showing your ignorance again, I see!

It’s cool you believe that but I’ve found no proof to those claims.

All I know is the fact that if someone wanted to find a true liberal you’d have to go to a libertarian.

Again, you are making things up. And speaking of links, where’s yours?

: )

Next time hold down the shift key and use up or down arrow and you can highlight a whole line at a time to delete.

What tens of thousands?
That was the whole point of his reply.

He should do that for every line he has posted!

If you like Huntsman so much, you can have him. Republicans certainly don’t want anything to do with him.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nbGthv-dJp4

As a guy on another post said about Cain: You don’t need to know what they did, just that they were investigated!

LOL

No stupid.
You wrote
Fact: They would not release the documents like his school papers or anything else that they willn’t release!!!!

If they were convicted of a crime and lost their license, it would be a matter of public record.

*LOL*

Now your pathetically inventing terms!

Falsifiability and repeatability of the entire basis of the scientific method. Just because you lie to yourself and call your religious beliefs “science” doesn’t change the fact that your religious beliefs are religious beliefs.

I, on the other hand, will stick to science… and laughing at you and your arrogant lack of intelligence because it’s fun :-)

Falsify anthropogenic global warming and make history, chump! *LOL*

LOL

Poor Kenny boy- read it and weep, you ignorant  lib:

http://www.gallup.com/poll/145286/four-americans-believe-strict-creationism.aspx

Now STFU!

Fact: Moron the fact is that the FBI investigated
them and then all of a sudden they lost their right to practice law!!!! I can’t
unseal that paperwork nor can I or anyone else give you anything that he wrote back in school because it’s sealed prick!!!! Ask Mr. Transparency to open up the vault of his sealed documents and I will hand it over!!! It takes a violation of law to strip them from the bar!

For teaching you that modern “liberalism”, and therefore “progressivism”, wants nothing to do with freedom? Your very welcome!

It was a joke,
A bad one!

*LOL*

If my posts are such lies then refute them! You’ve been trying for the past couple hours and you’ve struck out every time. Probably doesn’t help you don’t know what the hell you’re talking about and that you’re such a pathetic loser that you even tried to make undisputed things like scientific method a partisan issue :-)

*LOL*

More whining from a moron who’s in over his head, I love it!

C’mon, you’re so certain that AGW isn’t a belief system then prove it! Falsify the “theory”.

Do you ever get sick of starting everything you type with Fact:?

*LOL* So you are useful for some things after all :-)

Nope, only conspiracy here is the one in your mind. You really can go to Wikipedia and change anything at any time. That why it’s refereed to as a unreliable source for information. And that’s exactly the reason why “progressives” love it. This is common knowledge,man. Get with the program.

Will you be wearing pants?

Well the MORON, why not point out that in the 1880′s
The GOP supported big business generally, the gold standard, high tariffs, and generous pensions for Union veterans.

You are NO Libertarian.

Yeah, cuz remember that time that Ronald Reagan lost the election? Me neither.

Remember that time that Bill Clinton and Barack Obama got more electoral votes than Ronald Reagan. Me neither, cuz it’s didn’t fuckin’ happen.

Whenever people say that candidates should avoid being right wing I laugh. You might as well just shout at the top of your lungs “I don’t know our history!”

Poor thing, I guess you can’t read- there was a discussion about Progressives/liberals.

I am shocked that your knowledge of US history is so, so limited.

You better go back to 9th grade.

Hey stupid.
Convicted and lost license would mean it was a matter of public record.

I bet it would be easier for you if it were in Russian.

Fact: Another swing and a miss!!

Hyuck Hyuck Hyuck.

Your turn STUPID
Show me where they were investigated.

Yeah, that’s a great analogy and all… except that it’s not. Science isn’t an opinion. Science is provable and repeatable.

Oh yeah, and science isn’t taking a number from an ONLINE POLL on a climate change site that asked if you believe in Global Warming.

Glad to see that you’re not in the GOP. Your unintellectual thinking and flagrant disregard for logic is much more suited to Progressive Socialism.

“He doesn’t speak ill or hate  of the opposing party”

So your saying that the typical “liberal and progressive”( who speak ill and hate of the opposing party all the time) is no different than the GOP front runners. And to think, a minute ago I thought I couldn’t think any less of your silly collective. Oh well, live and learn.

Don’t you just love the Orwellian tactics of leftists?

“Let’s say we’re liberals and progressives when we hate liberty and advocate regressive causes!”

Thanks for the link STUPID.
I found this on the same site.

We’ve seen
polar ice

caps
floating

away and expect to see flooding from rising
sea levels.

There are many global warming statistics
and comics

all over the
media

including the web.

See some
air pollution statistics charts.

But suffice it say that the average earth temperatures have risen by as much as 1 degree Celsius in recent
global warming history

and it could increase further.

Google it! -as my subsequent post advised!

And “Dreams of My Father” tells you so.

LOL

I sure do, Tony! Their constant fumbling in the darkness when trying to rationalize their insane ways is almost cute at times.

Ha! Okay, and then look at how carbon dioxide concentrations have steadily increased since before the industrial revolution while human industrialization has increased exponentially, you know since you’re so interested in historical evidence. And if you look at more ice cores you’ll see similar shifts in carbon dioxide concentrations before changes in the earth’s climate.

But yeah, it’s still all because I want to idle my Hummer in my driveway. You’re right, you’re totally not buying into a religious belief system.

Geico has a new slogan: “So easy, a liberal can do it.”

So stonepark, I wasted my money on a Phil degree so here goes.  If you say ‘God always existed’ they you are saying God exists thus God is some thing or something.  Where did  the substance that he ‘is’ come from?  Also when you speak of ‘time’ as you do when you cite ‘always’ what is that?  Where did time come from?

Always means all the time that has ever been.What came before time?  Whom made time?  Or, conversely if Time simply is then what significance does it have?

NotSoFast,

Not the way I roll… Just curious to discover how you became what you are… I imagine you as a big fat man with breathing problems and lots of cats… But perhaps your defects are largely mental.

Very well. Thank you for the link. You can go back to your cave now.

Let’s go global. 28% believe in Creationism, according to this poll.
http://www.ipsos-na.com/news-polls/pressrelease.aspx?id=5217

Of course you wouldn’t. He’s too decent and rational. 

You’re just proving Stylins’ point. 

That is utter rubbish, it shows how completely shallow & stupid you are since you are unable to tell the difference between scientific method versus rigid adherence to 1000s of years old texts

 The only way someone can take your anti intellectual rubbish seriously is to believe there is some huge conspiracy among the majority of the world’s scientists

Still whining because you can’t refute my truthful posts, huh?

Then take him, please! *LOL* I don’t want anything to do with him, I support much more logical candidates than that dingbat.

And those stats are worse for conservatives. But since you are a cynical troll, you ignore those inconvenient facts You are such a fake, like your childish games you play every time to prove that the racists are Democrats. Maybe your Klan group campaigned for Obama but I find it humorous to imagine them supporting Obama.

Thanks for the substance-free comment. 

Science most certainly does involve opinion and theory — theories that can be tested and from which conclusions can be drawn. It has nothing to do with “online polls” and everything to do with actual research, study and analysis of data. 

But you sound pretty typical of today’s GOP voter: willfully stupid and proud of it, which is exactly why I resigned from the party. I got tired of having to make excuses for idiots like you. 

Let me know the last time Obama spoke like Gingrich, Perry, Bachman and the rest like they do to him? I have a feeling I’ll be waiting for a while.

Get a brain. 

When are you going to start evolving? 

LOL!!

Stonepark is a cynical liar, he ignores all the facts that make his precious teabaggers look bad. 

Greg, just got done watching “60 minutes.” You’ll never guess who it was about.  His initials are Jack Abramoff and the Republicans. lol

That’s not Science, but one sign of a truly dishonest troll is switching subjects when things run against him.

I think you and your like should read the “Sermon on the Mount.”  Something the Republicans conveniently forget when they run around talking about Jesus.

Anyone watch the first part of ”60 Minutes” tonight?  Just asking.

the fact that they believe in the literal interpretation of the Bible is enough..and to deny it again proves you a liar and not serious.
he shows you as another hack that is here to push lies and hate regardless of obvious truths–
as most cons you will deny your very own rhetoric because you know it us nuts–yet amongst your  banks of wackos you dance around the fire and do the kumba ya and magic tricks..

so deny that conservatives believe in the Bible as a literal verbatim world decended from God–I dare you..
tell us that the cons do not believe Jesus is God and therefore single handildy created the moon and stars—SAY IT–JESUS IS NOT GOD…..
so what is it? are you a liar or a coward?
oh wait—i  know this one–
you are both~

 What truth? Just a bunch of childish over generalizations and cheap lies. What is hilarious is that the same people who run their mouths about how global warming is a religion, not only are lying and have no proof. (Like where are the Churches and priests?) but are the same bunch who  are usually the most into some crackpot fundamentalist faith, So in their irrational minds, they assume the people they differ with are fundamentalist non thinkers like themselves

Funny you say that because Nancy Reagan was just quoted as saying quote “if Ronnie would see what the Republican Party has turned into he’d turn in his grave.” end quote

 What did you descend from, lizards?

So you are running with a new lie that Obama has been disbarred?

i guess you have not read your good book—
you just judged your brother—
so guess who is going to hell?
yep–you get the shiny penny—
i hope it gets you across the rive Styx—don’t forget to take your suntan lotion–it may get hot~

and before you go and try to again be a fake Christian—pleast have the courtesy to at least spend 5 minutes to do a littlel research..
it is the least you phonies could do for GOD..
becuase we all know you will never follow his teachings~
peace~

But more of your ignorant teabag types match that. So once again, what is your point?

Galileo at least used scientific methods, something you don’t understand

Don’t forget to renew your membership in the Flat Earther Society. I heard it went up 5 bucks.

 I consider your claim that “Global Warming is a religion” to be a lie. Show me the proof otherwise.

You can’t believe in God and evolution at the same time? That’s a new one on me. because I do.

 Huntsman problem is that he is reasonable and enlightened, so he has a hard time appealing to a bunch of cheap cynical hacks and completely ignorant fools.

Ain’t it funny how so many of cons seem to be proving that narrative correct

“religious belief system” lie, no proof again.

While it is stupid and wasteful to own a Hummer and then let it idle in the driveway, no one ever claimed that alone was causing global warming

 Start with the ones who failed to educate you and give you any sense of integrity

x2

Very well, then…(in the most pedestrian terms I will do this for the obstinate Tony)

First of all, when folks say they “believe” in AGW, what they really mean is that they “accept” the claims of the science. The faith that one puts into folks in the scientific communtiy is not the same that we accord those in the religious communtiy.

We can evaluate Vostok ice core samples and decide if they are valid; we have no way to evaluate the claims made in the Gospel: we either believe, or don’t. There is nothing evidentiary about Jesus’ provenance as the son of god. We gotta make a leap.

Somehow in Tony’s internet wanderings, he happened upon a box of Cato institute cereal and discovered Popper’s criticism of inducttion with its attendant notion of falsifiability. Popper wants to define science in the singular terms that would preclude induction–a method that scientist have always relied upon.

Tony wants to say that since AGW is ‘unfalsifiable’ (not able to be disproved), it is not science.This is the crux of his ‘dog and pony show.’

The statement “Tony is a good father.” bears inspection.  Regardless of how much evidence I present that Tony is a bad father, that statement could never be deemed scientific in that proving it false would never withstand the rigors of scientific inquiry. Tony could always establish some criterion that would deem him a ‘good father’–no doubt just like that Family Court judge caught on video beating his daughter. If we can’t establish common ground upon which to discuss the terms of any argument or debate, we will never find agreement. This is what Tony means to say with ‘falsifiable,’with my preening modification of the argument.

But if I say, “On Thursday Tony will be transformed into a rational human being not prone to disturbing fits of rage that make me fear for his family members,” that statement is eminently falsifiable because Thursday will come and we will all still witness his frightening penchant for rage and irrationality.The term Thursday establishes a time frame that will allow us to judge his relative capacity for rationalism.

The key for Popper and Tony is that inductive reasoning also makes a leap: just because tempertures have risen with CO2 levels during heavy volcanic periods and tempertures are similarly rising with human-produced factors (methane, carbon dixoide, etc.), we can’t say for sure that humans are the reason. Tony wants to say the past doesn’t determine the future. We can’t prove something like this false–we can’t prove ANYTHING. Inductive reasoning is highly fallacious and prone to innumerable problems. Who can say anything about anything? If you want to “believe” (how about ‘accept,’ Tony?) in AGW, you must make a leap because it’s not falsifiable; it’s a naked assertion abolutely without evidence based upon the ‘unscientific’ methodology called induction.

Really? There is no evidence to support AGW? Science doesn’t really upon the notion of consesus? Induction is NOT science? Wow! I could produce lots of links and quotes but I use only one:

http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2006/02/happy-birthday-charles-darwin/

Huntsman is desperate and will say anything to stay in the headlines.  He makes some good points every once in a while, but he is just too silly to be an American president.  Since he loves China so much maybe he should try and get elected over there.

Unfortunately for Jon, GOP’ers can run away from him.

Stonepark! School tomorrow so don’t stay up too late.

No, you post dishonest crap that can only make sense if a majority of scientists were involved in either a vast conspiracy or were hopelessly deluded by some vast conspiracy of AGW Svengalis. Once again, you claim global warming is a religion, I say BS, prove it!

 Palin, Cain, Perry?

Wasn’t God always around? He created the earth that Jesus walked on long before Jesus came around. Besides my Greek gods were frolicking on earth long before some sunbaked Jew and his pals anointed Jesus as the next Messiah.

At least you leaven your predictable trash with some sad attempt at humor

 So you are having imaginary dialogs with a long dead Jew? What does he do to show his love, cause your nocturnal emissions?

 Stalin means steel and Molotov means hammer, so hammers and steel are Communists too, according to your bizarre reasoning system

intelligent Design is not falsifiable and has nothing evidentiary about it. By your standard, AGW may not be falsifible (but see below), but it is intrinsically evidentiary.

You don’t define the terms of this debate.

The philosophy of science is not written in your Bible, Tony. Inductive reasoning is very much science-based, without this phony claim of faith you maintain.

Go back to your sliderule, Hans Castorp…

Yes…Tony. Galileo didn’t really start science–that’s why there were quotes around it.

but i’ll give it to you so you hopefully don’t beat your wife and kids tonight…

Such rage!

I’m worried about your family!

Anybody got the number for CPS in Cleveland?

The mainstream media has been the only group hyping this turd since the day he “announced.” Precisely knowing he could never poll above 5%.

If anything, Jon’s supporters are the biggest group of suckers on the planet… throwing away their money for absolutely nothing in return. Fortunately, there never were that many people to begin with.

You are making too much sense and being too rational trying to explain something to an extreme right-winger. Shame on you.

No, Huntsman’s problem is that he is a liberal/socialist Democrat with no charisma, no track record of success, no supporters, and has a smarmy aura… that just so happens to be running for the wrong party’s nomination.

@twitter-283793560:disqus WiddleBabyDanielson

Really? This is news to me. Tell me, what do you think a libertarian is? And once you’re finished telling me what you think a libertarian is I will tell you what a libertarian really is, KO?

Yup.

Oh. So you’re not voting Republican this election. 

Better, I’m voting for Ron Paul. You know, the guy who said he’s gonna do all the stuff Obama said he’d do but he won’t because he’s a warmonger?

*LOL* You won’t know the scientific method if fell on your head from a tree.

Science requires way more faith than religion could ever dream of requiring.

Great! Cram your words in someone else’s mouth, and then complain about the silly things that person’s said.

Profoundly dishonest, and so transparent even a wingnut can see you doing it.

Mistake. You’ve used the “F” word (as in Fact) which is inadible to this crowd.

I realize this will be hard for you to grasp with the pudgy baby fingers of your intellect, but code names assigned by soviet era spymasters DON’T MATTER.

What you consider “appropriate” (actually I think you mean “ironic” or “telling,” but word use is not exactly your long suit, I think we’d all agree) appears to sensible people as TOTALLY POINTLESS.

The fact that you think such things matter just proves how much they don’t.

Because 80% of people are stupid, irrespective of political persuasion.

Well, sure, as long as we let you make up words and define them, you’ll seldom be on the wrong side of the “truth” — at least how you define it.

Let me make up a few terms. Hey dipshit (my word for “you”), you’re a total crackpot (my word for “thoughtful person”) who should be locked up before you hurt yourself (my phrase for “given what’s due you” — so in this case, my personal secret phrase actually means the same as every other English-speaker would mean.)

What a fun game. No one needs to ever be wrong again. Just make up the words and go your merry way!

There you go again. Liberal and Libertarian are not synonymous. So neither one is “truer” than the other.

Please feel free to pretend that you’re libertarian (when the evidence is that you’re a common garden-variety jerk) but keep that libertarian crap from slopping over to my side of the table.

@ Tim Tebow

“The faith that one puts into folks in the scientific communtiy is not the same that we accord those in the religious communtiy.”

Actually, yes it is which is what makes you so pathetic because you’re in denial. People who believe that Jesus was God, for instance, know that they can’t PROVE it, which is what makes it faith. You, on the other hand, arrogantly delude yourself into thinking that the thing you believe but can’t prove, such as anthropogenic global warming, are facts. You claim to be holier-than-thou when it comes to religion when you’re engaging in the exact same practices, except religious people appreciate faith and you’re just a self-loather.

“Tony wants to say that since AGW is ‘unfalsifiable’ (not able to be
disproved), it is not science.This is the crux of his ‘dog and pony
show.’”

That’s the crux of the scientific method. Again, it’s not my fault that you can’t handle that AGW doesn’t qualify as a theory and is merely religious dogma. Science is still science, and what you worship isn’t science no matter how much you want it to be.

“The statement ‘Tony is a good father.’ bears inspection.  Regardless of how much evidence I present that Tony is a bad father, blah blah blah”

And you just go on and on and further prove that you don’t understand what falsifiability is. Wikipedia isn’t a substitution for a quality education, chump. Just because the clergy at RealClimate came up with a justification for your religious belief system doesn’t magically make it science.

“Really? There is no evidence to support AGW?”

There’s no evidence to prove that it’s driven by humans. There are plenty of observations of carbon dioxide concentrations increasing, regardless of what the hell humans are doing, and there is evidence of temperature volatility over a very short time period in earth’s history even though the idea of an “average Earth temperature” is fallacious. But instead of trying to understand these events instead, AGW attributes them to humans without any proof, and nothing can convince you otherwise because this is your RELIGIOUS BELIEF SYSTEM.

“Science doesn’t really upon the notion of consesus?”

Not in the least bit. Under this stupid, illogical notion, gravity would exist because we all believe that gravity exists. Gravity exists because it’s a property of our physical world that we can observe and repeatedly test, dumbass. The properties of the universe wouldn’t magically change if everyone wished really hard that there were no more gravity.

“Induction is NOT science?”

*LOL* You don’t even know what induction is. You copy-and-pasted some text from a climate clergy website that tried to justify away the fact that Anthropogenic Climate Change isn’t a theory. “I turned on my Hummer and this summer was hot, so I caused the globe to warm” isn’t induction, chump. That’s mindless correlation. That’s AGW.

“Wow! I could produce lots of links and quotes but I use only one:”

No you couldn’t. That’s why you only provided that link for your religious website.

He invoked everyone thinking Galileo was wrong. Galileo was alive in a time without electricity, when the printing press was a relatively new invention. His comparison suggested exactly that. Sorry you suck at arguments.

Using that logic, literally everyone other than Romney and Perry supporters are complete rubes who have been suckered out of every dollar they’ve given their candidate of choice. A premise I don’t necessarily disagree with, for the record. But only Perry and Romney have ever had any chance of actually winning this thing.

Again, actually LEARN what induction is before you start throwing the term around. AGW doesn’t rely on induction which is why it can’t be falsified! *LOL*

@ Tim Tebow

“intelligent Design is not falsifiable and has nothing evidentiary about it.”

Corret! Nor is Anthropogenic Global Warming!

“You don’t define the terms of this debate.”

*LOL* YOU don’t define the terms, no matter how much you’d like to. SCIENCE does, and your argument is completely devoid of the scientific method.

@ morrisminor,

“blah blah blah, Once again, you claim global warming is a religion, I say BS, prove it! ”

I don’t need to prove anything. You need to prove that Anthropogenic Global Warming is science. Good luck with that! *LOL*

“While it is stupid and wasteful to own a Hummer”

Who cares what you think, you worthless busybody? How about you get a life and not worry about what other people do with theirs.

“and then let it idle in the driveway, no one ever claimed that alone was causing global warming”

That’s PRECISELY what they’re claiming — humans alone are causing the globe to warm. Thank you for illustrating, and acknowledging, how ridiculous your own religious belief system is!

*LOL* Yeah, that had zero Google hits.

And I don’t care. Still doesn’t change the fact that Huntsman has absolutely no following in the Republican party. You’re more than welcome to take him off our hands, you guys were nice enough to do that with Arlen Specter. How’s his car wash business or whatever the hell that worthless bum is doing right now? Don’t answer that because nobody cares.

styin ain’t the sharpest tack in the bunch…

Like most people with “Patriot” in your name, you are a crackpot, and a liar

*LOL* You think that being an intellectual means believing what someone told you to believe. How ironic, since that’s the very definition of anti-intellectualism.

Now since you claim you’re an “intellectual”, falsify AGW for us all so you can prove that it’s not a religious belief system but actual a viable scientific hypothesis.

Like most people with “Patriot” in your name, you are a crackpot, and a liar

And yet you can’t refute any of my “lies”. *LOL*

Keep digging that hole :-)

Mitt Romney sucks. Welcome to the 75+% of GOPers who feel the same way.

One of your broader sweeping generalizations. Maybe Top 5. Kudos.

Do you save these up on Post-it notes on your monitor?

 Where are those global warming churches and priests you keep fantasizing about? Do they have IRS and local religious tax exemptions? Do they have prayers, liturgy, rites? Can these AGW clergy marry couples? Or what about the great AGW conspiracy? If you want to talk trash, the burden of proof is on you, not me.

Show us those global warming churches and proof of the AGW Scientific conspiracy, we are waiting.

 Where are this global warming religion & churches you keep raving about?

 You lie about AGW being a religion then ignore any Science (theories, hypothesis) you disagree with. Since neither of us are trained scientists, we are both going to turn to experts! But maybe you are so versatile and talented you compound all your Rxs and do surgery on yourself too, since you are a whiz who needs no experts.

You remind me of those tobacco industry types who for decades denied cigarettes caused cancer based on pseudo scientific sophistry

You use that phrase frequently, “I struck a nerve.”

Let’s all meet some time and have a rumble!!!!!

You mean only the extreme far right wing fringe doesn’t care and that’s nothing to be proud. And yes, Nancy Reagan said those exact words and I believe is was in Time Magazine.  The conversation she had was with one of the columnists but I don’t have her name memorized but I will find the article and send you the link to it. She was asked about her support for stem cell and embryonic research, how she favors it and  the hatred and disrespect spewed towards the President by the extreme fringe, (you know, you guys) and how uncivil the discourse has been recently by both parties but she specifically singled out the current GOP and how her husband would not even be a part of that element of the Republican Party which hijacked the whole party. But anyway, that’s really embarrassing that your party’s idol, Ronald Reagan, who’s name your leaders use as much as they can would not even fit in with your extreme conspiracies and hatred. Wow, enough said.

Once again, you lie about this fake religion, so I bet you are one of those evangelical saps since you are smug, repetitive and narrowminded just like they are.

I am a worthless busybody? What about you? If your life is so great, why are you all over this board repeating the same dittoheaded rubbish?

Pretty much anyone who drives a Hummer is a bs macho bully who need a wasteful oversized vehicle to make them feel all big & tough, you loser. And besides they produce plenty of extra old fashioned pollution, as well as do way more road damage and cause more congestion, So keep showing us how inconsiderate and crass your values are by wasting your $ on a big POS Hummer.

The tide comes in and the tide goes out, you can’t explain that…

Scientists don’t believe in witches, but a lot of flaky religious types, from WICCANS to the usual Evangelical fatheads like Palin and O’Donnell do.

You mean the extreme right wing-teabaggers don’t want anything to do with him. But the Sharon Angles and Christine O’Donells are ok? Wow, you guys are out there. But hey, I love it. Keep saying the wacked out conspiracy stuff and hatred toward Obama. See how that will work out for you in the general. Don’t forget, this isn’t the 2010 election anymore. The majority of the public are on to you guys.  So please, don’t change.

Well if he is desperate to get the nomination, wouldn’t he better off repeating the kind of rubbish you hear on your talk radio shows or what Rick Perry says so he can appeal to the moron base better? Since he is running as a Republican, he can’t go wrong sounding as stupid & bombastic as the rest of them

Vulcanism.  Did you attend high school?

Next thing you know, they will suggest that modern day leftists are exactly like Reagan.

Yes, a classical liberal and you have about the same qualities as Stalin and Ghandi.

“The whole of science is nothing more than a refinement of everyday thinking”–Albert Einstein

Climate change- to conservatives, a natural and verifiable scientific causal effect of change in the world

Climate change- to leftists, a symptom of conservatives stealing the babies of leftists and reason to tax everyone at 100% tax rates

Climate change to me- a systemic development of a planet near a star

Climate change to Al Gore- a precursor to the Enron plan set up in the 80s

Climate change to leftists- an excuse to implement communism

Climate change to researchers- an excellent source of funding

Human causal Climate Change- a frelling LIE developed by morons to implement anything the communists want. There is NO argument about this there folks, even the UN admits this!

Fact: If you could read the written (English) with
that high class liberal dumb down union public edularcation you sport sooooo
high dirt bag.  Even the blind can see
that your trying to blow smoke up peoples a$$es with your globular warping
theory!!!! Moron first last and always so keep on being the sites classy
clown!!!!

Fact: Lean forward!!!!!

Fact: Lean forward turn head to left and cough!!!!

good thing your here. My bet is your communism statement is due to your dislike of a system where government, big business and very wealthy are linked by profits and favors. Because it should be, as that is the general fear of communism. My hope is that you understand that in a communist society, the government controls everything. But I also hope that you dont have a narrow view of the word “government” because if you do.. that explains your post. IF you believe that the Leader of a communist country acts on his own without any concern for the powerful men and women around him who have, generally, helped him get elected, I understand your post. IF you think, that in the government of a communist party, there are not tens of thousands of people who benefit a great deal due to their powerful connections to the government, again, I understand your post. IFFF, you think that this “power” has the form of anything other than wealth, boy do I understand your post.  Because see, what I have described exists in a few places on the planet and in the places where they do exist, they flaunt it, miserably.. However, if you do read, understand.. what I have described, which IS communism to a very nice extent.. is EXACTLY what you are wading through TODAY and have been since the first major business/government scandal you have ever heard.. and not knowing your age, I’m not sure if you can understand how far back this can be followed, NOR are you potentially able to understand the evolution of political philosophies in the first place. See, what I think is in your mind, everyone is Russia suffers.. but sadly, if you have not traveled or reached out and spoken to the numerous russians who live or are visiting and getting educations in THIS country, you are frighteningly mistaken. See, in Russia there are a few very wealthy people who have very easy and direct connections to people in power. Some of them are appointed officals, paid members of “boards” to which their appointment can be traced to their link(s) to the government.. These are very wealthy people.. and then there are people who live and have flat screen TV’s, microwaves, smart phones.. etc., and then there are a lot of really average people who work a lot to make ends meet everyday… NOW, at this point if I have to go on, GOOD LORD you and your people are some of the most dangerous people on the planet since the Visigoths.. Do you plan to sack Rome and then ask how to use the aqueducts after you kill the engineers? It only took a few centuries before that simple yet very useful tech was “rediscovered”… PLEASE read this and think about it HARDER than usual.. because there is no way you do not SEE.. -I’m not party affiliated nor do I vote as I have yet to see a candidate worth the waste of my morning or evening.. and by the way, I’ve met more than my share of politicians, AT the homes of people I know (and I dont mean Mayors. LOL).. and in all cases, there are wealthy appointed to sweet position people etc., in the room.

Nope. It tells you how far off the edge the modern Republican Party has gone. Thanks in part to the baggers and Grover Norgquist.

People here go a long way to justify their imaginary religious beliefs.

Some can’t.
LOL

You claimed once that you were a “teacher.” Please identify your school district so that I can be sure to avoid it like the plague. 

Thanks for that insight into the brain of a teapublican. 

Just a question for those posting in this thread who consider themselves Christian:

Do you believe that non-Christians reading your posts are likely to want to become Christians because they have read what you’ve written, the way you’ve written it?

bottom line is a lot of republicans have their hands in the pockets of the very large multi-national corporations who are responsible for emissions and pollution that contribute to global warming.  So of course, they have to, as a party line, deny the science and make up smoke screens and distractions to inject the idea that it’s not actually happening into the discussion.  What is the problem with treating our earth with respect, living sustainably and not destroying our resources for short term gains while forsaking the longterm viability of life on Earth?  Corporations doing this only care about their profits.  Their supporters think Jesus is coming so life on Earth doesn’t need to be longterm for them.  Standby for the Rapture…

Please don’t tell me you’re trying to have a dialog with this cretin. 

Mainstream  science once held that the Earth was the center of the Universe, that the Sun went around the Earth, that the Earth was flat, and that in all flammable materials there is present phlogiston, a substance
without color, odor, taste, or weight that is given off in burning.
“Phlogisticated” substances are those that contain phlogiston and, on
being burned, are “dephlogisticated
Personally, I would just as soon wait a bit for more evidence of AGW before upending our economic system.  Too many of AGW’s proponents want to upend the economic system, and have seen AGW as an excuse for it.

Sustainability = Good Economics.  If you can’t see that, you’re short sighted.

You engineers are certainly hard-headed. You really can’t accept the necessity of induction in science? Your engineering brain can only handle black and white, I guess, and you want science to be narrowly defined in your terms, but folks who actually do science disagree:

“What they are saying, essentially, is that science does not yield philosophically certain truth – conclusions that must be true. This is correct but irrelevant, since that has never been part of science. Rather science comes up with models of nature and then tests those models. It retains those that are validated, but only for as long as they are validates, while continuing to try to falsify even previously validated ideas. It rejects or modifies falsified ideas. Scientists also try to infer causality in order to develop an increasingly complex abstraction of nature which makes predictions that can be further tested. And all the independent threads of scientific ideas must weave together into one seamless web.
The notion that there is temporal uniformity in nature – that the future will resemble the past is not really a premise of scientific induction but rather one thread in the tapestry of science. It itself is a hypothesis that makes predictions and can be tested. For example, we have been measuring the speed of light very accurately for decades. If the speed of light were not constant and changed over time we could detect it. Therefore the constancy of the speed of light is falsifiable, but so far has been verified.
The same is true of all constants and laws so far discovered in nature. The laws of nature do not appear to change over time, and they also appear to exist throughout the universe. The principle of uniformity has been verified so far.
The only refuge for someone denying the utility of scientific induction and scientific reasoning more generally is to say that nature is so capricious and inscrutable that we cannot even reason about the principle of uniformity, or any other basic law or constant. However, such arguments, as the one above, generally take the form of using logic to demonstrate that science cannot reach conclusions that must be true – logically, 100%, metaphysically true. They then conclude that science is not valid, or “cannot be rationally justified.” But this is a false premise, because science has never been about logical truth, as I described above.”

http://www.skepticblog.org/2009/04/13/inductive-reasoning-in-science/

Did you read that, Tony? Your understanding of science is laughably limited and you presume to define the terms of debate to suit your political goals. That’s not science, Tony, but of course, you wouldn’t know that. Science isn’t truth, got it? And science makes use of the peer-review process that relies upon a community of scientists testing and re-testing theories to find workable understandings of the natural world.

I do appreciate your attempt here, though: it has pushed me to further investigate what is again another phony claim from the folks in your ‘denier’ camp.

Please don’t take out your rage on your family!

Mwah!

Brother TIm

Fact: Shouldn’t you be out there crapping on a few police cars hitting the bongo’s for more freeloader handouts?

Fact: That’s your parents choice not yours stupid moron!!!!

I do believe in witches……….I do believe in witches……….do believe in witches……

Who are you going to believe, tens-of-thousands-of scientists…or some doctored UN Reports?

LOL!

I do believe in witches……….I do believe in witches……….do believe in witches……

There is a realistic balance to be struck between industry, prices, our addiction to our own convenience,  and taking care of the planet. It’s right to look at the influence of the EPA, and it’s regulations. The problem is doing it honestly. That’s a discussion nobody seems to want to have. Now the talk is dismantle the EPA. Even now a good number of the bills the new Congress has before the Senate are bills to ease restrictions on EPA regulations.
They can keep repeating, we can’t compete with the rest of the world because of regulations and that easing regulations will translate into jobs. Examining that meme in detail to see if it’s true is another matter.

Kind of a bizarre statement.
Science may require a hypothesis or theory, and then the actual work to disprove it , which leads to knowledge.
Religion just requires faith. You believe what you’re told to believe and even evidence that contradicts it is denied in defense of “the faith”

People mistake their particular denomination and dogma for “divine authority” and react as if questioning their faith is questioning the Lord himself. It’s not. We’re supposed to question and sort out the truth from the traditions of men.  

Having been involved in teaching science, studying the conduct of scientists as a sociological phenomenon, teaching scientific method, writing and teaching on the interplay of science and politics, and conducting research for over 20 years now, I have to say Huntsman’s simplistic faith in science and scientists would be touching (much like a small child believing in the Tooth Fairy) were it not for the fact that he’s doing it to get positive media attention by beating up his fellow Republicans.  The mere fact that Huntsman fails to comprehend that you need to win over Republicans, not the media, to win the Republican nomination puts him in the “too clueless to be president” camp (where, ironically, he’ll get to spend a lot of time with his chief nemesis, Rick Perry). 

The concept of scientists being dispassionate observers interested only in “The Truth” is a myth.  Scientists are human, which means they are just as capable of being held hostage to their own biases in the face of evidence to the contrary as anyone else — more so, in fact, because they themselves, like Huntsman, believe the propaganda and so they know they have SCIENCE on their side, which leads to a dogmatic fanaticism to rival any Bible-thumping Southern Baptist or crazed imam ranting in a mosque in Iran.

No ding dong it was preists and the church that clinged to that lunacy. They usd to be one in the same with science.

I really wonder what it is like to be as stupid as you?

With polls numbers approaching 1% you can say whatever you want

Yes you did waste your money.

Poor thing,  in your  world, you think that all things are knowable. They aren’t!

God was not created; he always existed.Since God is before space, time, and matter, the issue of causality does not apply to Him.

You question is that of a sophomoric teenager not someone who graduated from college.

LOL

they aren’t “worse” for conservatives, they are better!

facts hurt your cretin-like mind don’t they.

I thought so.

You are one massive dumb ass and liar!

BTW, Obama, Clinton and Biden side with me- they all believe in God!

Now, STFU!

You are a retard!

No, he is a loser so he appeals to losers like YOU!

LOL

Poor libby boy was shattered by the truth and strikes out in anger.

Typical loser lib!

lol

Poor kenny:

You said: ”
Let’s go global. 28% believe in Creationism, according to this poll.”http://www.ipsos-na.com/news-p…

You fool!

LOL

The article says:

“A poll conducted by global research company Ipsos for Reuters News finds that one half (51%) of global citizens definitely believe in a ‘divine entity’’ compared to 18% who don’t and 17% who just aren’t sure.This compares with two in ten (18%) who “don’t believe in God/Gods/Supreme Being/Beings”

Thanks for proving what a horse’s ass you are and proving what I said!

Hey you fatuous morris;- list one lie I have posted- just one!

LOL

Somebody please explain to me how anyone can “believe” in Natural Selection – the core of Evolution – and also support a “gay gene” (born that way) as no threat to humanity.

Ignorance on full display. Laughable to the intellectually honest.

 ‘You have heard that it was said, “You shall love your neighbour and hate your enemy.” But I say to you, Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, so that you may be children of your Father in heaven; for he makes his sun rise on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the righteous and on the unrighteous. For if you love those who love you, what reward do you have? Do not even the tax-collectors do the same? And if you greet only your brothers and sisters, what more are you doing than others? Do not even the Gentiles do the same? Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect.  –Matthew 5: 43-48

I am a TRUE Republican and detest the running “ intellictual” “know it all” dumbazzes like Hannity and Limbaugh defying 99% of the scientists who know we have global warming, whether manmade of natural, and continue to show their idiocy by denying it!!!

Touche, and he pretty much is. Is anyone other than his daughters participating in his campaign at this point?

*LOL* You don’t even know what induction is. You’re copy a blog post from the Anthropogenic Global Warming clergy blog. AGW doesn’t *use* induction, it uses correlation. By your false definition of induction, ice cream causes people to cause murder! AGW uses correlation, which is completely useless in science, and “consensus” which is a political tool not a scientific instrument.

Apparently your too stupid to read a poll. NOBODY in the Republican party wants anything to do with this guy. He’s not even polling high enough to participate in future debates. We don’t want him, so you’re more than welcome to take him. I don’t really care either way, you’ve got enough arrogant politicians claiming to be scientific scholars on the far left.

In TIME Magazine… you think… Great! Then link to it if you’re so sure! They’ll appreciate get their readership above the dozens.

And again, I don’t care. I hate pretty much all politicians with very few exceptions and I don’t identify with party coalitions.

*LOL* @ morrisminor.

I continue to ask you to prove the AGW is even a valid theory and you can’t do it. Just more whining. You’re clearly in over you head. Go ahead, prove it’s falsifiable — you’d be the first!

Actually, in a way, it has.  For example, look at the shift from positivism to postpositivism.

Wrong.  A theory’s falsifiability is not necessarily dependent on the methods of observation or analysis.  Rather, falsifiability means that if the theory is false, if can be proved false through experiments, and correlations can absolutely prove a hypothesis false.  It’s quite simple, really.  If the correlation is going in a direction different that what you hypothesized, then your hypothesis could very well be incorrect.  Falsifiability essentially means that an axiomatic theory is not science.

Keep in mind, AGW theory was developed to explain the observation that surface temperatures are increasing, not the other way around, not the other way around.

Maybe you should actually develop an understanding of falsifiability and post-positivism before you start acting like an ass towards other people.  Your statement earlier that ‘correlation is useless to science’ betrays your ignorance.  I have a feeling that you read somewhere that correlation does not equal causation and decided that that means correlations are useless. 

Falsifiability does not mean that the theory needs to be ‘falsified’.  Rather, falsifiability refers to a theory’s testability.  If a theory has been falsified, that means that an experiment has produced results that run counter to what that theory states.  

The theory that ‘is it possible that the observed warming trend could be exacerbated by our pumping of carbon-based pollutants into the atmosphere’ is completely falsifiable.

Actually, aside from his stance on marriage rights and his accepting of modern science, he’s about as Republican as you can get.

All of the now-disproven theories I mentioned were once mainstream science.  And if you are a prime example of the proponents of AGW, then AGW will soon be proven as nonsensical a theory as the flat earth theory.  FYI, the past tense of “cling” is “clung”, not clinged.

http://encyclopedia2.thefreedictionary.com/phlogiston+theory
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geocentrism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heliocentrism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flat_Earth

Oh Huntsman, nice try, but you can’t take the ignorance out of America.  Especially the GOP.  Religious nuts will always be religious nuts.  Just move on, Huntsman; America is stuck in the Stone Age with the Middle East for now.

BOTH  parties are in the pockets of the people with money, call them what you wish.  If you don’t believe it, check out the largest donors to Obama and McCain in 2008.
http://www.opensecrets.org/pres08/contrib.php?cycle=2008&cid=N00009638
http://www.opensecrets.org/pres08/contrib.php?cycle=2008&cid=N00006424
http://www.opensecrets.org/pres12/index.php

And your imaginary religious beliefs are?

One can only conclude that you must have your Parties confused.

Now you know why Huntsman is so low in the polls….He’s a white Obama.

Skepticblog is a ‘clergy blog’?  That might surprise the hell out of Michael Shermer, a noted scientific historian and founder of the Skeptic’s Society.  

@shogan83:disqus – His first post was from RealClimate, which is a clergy blog. I told him he doesn’t know jack about induction, which he doesn’t, so instead he just Googled more stuff about what was in the original clergy article which has absolutely nothing to do with the fact that AGW dogma doesn’t even use induction — BECAUSE it’s dogma.

@shogan83:disqus – “The theory that ‘is it possible that the observed warming trend could be
exacerbated by our pumping of carbon-based pollutants into the
atmosphere’ is completely falsifiable.”

*LOL* That’s not a falsifiable theory. That’s like saying “It’s possible that if I hold an apple above the ground and let go of it, that it will drop to the ground”. If you understood scientific method at all, you’d understand how ridiculous your claim is.

Again, AGW is *DOGMA* — it is not scientific theory. “Carbon” is not a pollutant. The “warming trend” was preceded by a cooling trend… then a warming trend… then a cool trend — it’s called a cycle. And you can’t falsify if something is “possible”.

I’ll start the “shogan83 touches little boys ‘theory’”. You may not touch little boys today, but IT’S POSSIBLE that you could touch little boys some time in the future. Therefore, you should be jailed immediately.

@shogan83:disqus – This post of yours demonstrated perfectly that you have no idea what you’re talking about. This little gem was great:

“Keep in mind, AGW theory was developed to explain the observation that
surface temperatures are increasing, not the other way around, not the
other way around.”

Um, no dumbass. ANTHROPOGENIC Global Warming draws a friggin’ conclusion in its name, it doesn’t try to explain anything. The dogma — or “theory” as you like to lie and call it — doesn’t seek to understand the CAUSAL forces behind the climate, it CONCLUDES immediately that humans are causing the globe to warm and then grasps at straws to find evidence to back up that belief. That’s why it’s not falsifiable — IT’S A BELIEF SYSTEM. And the belief system’s various pieces of evidence have been shot down multiple times.

“Your statement earlier that ‘correlation is useless to science’ betrays your ignorance.”

That’s because they are useless in science, you’d know that if you actually knew what you were talking about. Correlation is a STATISTICAL DEVICE, not a scientific device. The correlation that “the earth climate is changing and humans are being active” doesn’t prove jack. Your kind of bankrupt reasoning is how you can “prove” that ice cream causes murder.

No, it hasn’t.

In a way, clergymen have tried to use science as a tool of faith. They’re laughed at by people who actually understand scientific method.

Just because you can’t voice your religious dogma of Anthropogenic global warming as a valid theory doesn’t magically mean that the scientific method is flawed. Instead, it means you’re an anti-intellectual.

by the way, did you watch 60 minutes last night? the first part? just asking

Actually, yes it has.  Please look up post-positivism.  The very concept that you keep misapplying, falsifiability, was not considered to be part of the scientific process until post-positivism took hold.  

You do realize that falsifiability was developed in order to deal with the Problem of Induction, right?

Did you read the polls? Just asking.

That’s rhetorical by the way, I know you don’t ready the polls because they may shatter the delusions that you create for yourself.

Really, so we shouldn’t take Huntsman seriously because a majority of cons don’t agree with him but we shouldn’t take AGW seriously because a majority of Scientists do agree with it?

@shogan83:twitter  – No, it hasn’t. Philosophy of science and the actual scientific method are two completely different things. Philosophy is based on searching for truth; there is no methodology to the process so philosophy is frequently bullshit. Science is based on enabling skepticism, there is a set methodology that rejects any attempts at subverting skepticism such as crafting claims that can’t be falsified or can’t be repeated.

You’re confusing (probably manipulating, actually) induction with hypothesis. Induction reasoning can be used to formulate a hypothesis and pretty much always is because of biased perspective. The difference is that the induction is consider the proof itself which causes the philosophical conflict whereas the hypothesis is a statement waiting to be proven wrong.

The black swan is the perfect example of this. The inductive statement that “all swans are white” conflicts with its goal of truth because there’s no way of knowing if all swans are white. The statement can never be known to be the absolute truth. The hypothesis that “all swans are white”, which is formulated from inductive reasoning, can be falsified by finding a black swan.

And this is why your religious dogma of Anthropogenic Global Warming isn’t even induction, let alone a scientific theory. “The possibility that humans are causing the globe to warm” can’t be falsified because you’re not making a definitive claim. How is a “possibility” falsified? Numerous claims from the Anthropogenic Global Warming clergy have been proven wrong before, and the response is always “well yeah, this time!” That can be said for ANY possibility and it’s an obvious tool for avoiding skepticism.

No wonder John Huntsman is so far behind in the Republican polls ie 2% max.  With Republican support from the Teapartiers who cheered when a hypothetical man to die because he was without health insurance, to not believing in the reality of global warming to Herman Cain being 4 times accused of sexual misconduct.  The Repugnants can’t tolerate a sensible candidate.  Plus why are the Teaparty members complaining about a man without health insurance when one of the major complaints of “Obamacare” is the forcing of everyone must be with health insurance.  It seems rather hypocritical to me.  It seems its wrong to force health insurance but when one doesn’t possess such insurance its their own fault if they succumb to their illness.

Say what??

 Hey Tony if you have the time tell me one conservative thing Reagan did.

Query: Has J4TF just admitted to using *2* designer drugs, one named “MSM” (some methamphetamine derivative, no doubt) and the other “MSMLSD,” which must be more of the same — except in four dimensions?

Might enhance their overall verbal acuity, though.

Just curious. You do realize that there have several scientific advances since the 1600s? And those advances include answers — in some case whole fields of study — relating to every item you listed?

I’m also sure you realize that pretending bronze age “mainstream science” compares meaningfully to the science taking place right now is laughable. Or insulting, if you sincerely expected anyone to buy that load of nonsense.

I’m happy for you to wait until ecological collapse become obvious even to those who deny it, but in the meantime, people who care about their children and their grandchildren will be acting. This is going to come down to one of those “lead, follow, or get out of the way” sort of movements.

Not sure your participation is going to be voluntary. How close to a coastline do you live?

Too many syllables for Haiku. Too low a semantic content for any other kind of verse. Hmm . . .

What about the fact that only Romney can win in the general?

Being old enough to remember when  Communists had “history on their side”, pardon me if I don’t genuflect to the AGW alarmists just yet.  Mostly, I’ve found that “conventional wisdom” isn’t.

Lets accept, for the sake of argument, that AGW is true.  What exactly do you propose to do about it?

The  basic premise, that humans can do anything to alter the trajectory of the deterioration of the environment through anything remotely acceptable to any society that exists at present is patently absurd.  Any  politician who proposed the draconian measures required would be politically dead, and very likely literally dead, if s/he tried to put them into effect.

In 1950, there were about 150,000,000 people in the USA.  In 2010 there were about 310,000,000.  Worldwide, things are worse.   In 1950 there were about 2.55 billion people on earth.  Just recently there was considerable fanfare about the 7 billionth person being born.  Even worse, the two most populous nations, China and India, are working very hard to improve the standard of living of their populations.  Newsflash:  Raising the standard of living requires an increase in energy usage.  Rising populations require rising food – and everything else – production.

So, who are you going to kill?  If you are so concerned about AGW, and want to do something about it personally, commit suicide.  Me, I’m going to live as well as possible for whatever time I have left and let posterity worry about it.

*LOL* I love delusional people. Polls show otherwise.

Did you live in a cave during the 80s?

 Delusions? whatever…….oh by the way, just wanted to let you know your membership at the flat earther society is going up five bucks in 2012.  Go check at your regular site.  http://www.worldnetdaily.com.
You’re welcome.

http://www.mediaite.com/online/redstate-chief-erick-erickson-torches-mitt-romney-and-newt-gingrich-rethinks-huntsman/

Hold that thought. Share it with your friends. Join the bands of anyone-but-Romneyans out there. Start new buzzes for Newt, Bachmann, even Huntsman.

I’m lovin’ it.

Nice work if you can get it. Of course you might die in a ditch and be eaten by your neighbors when civilization crashes. You pays your money, you takes your chances.