‘It’s Hamas Numbers, They Mean Nothing!’ Dan Abrams and Cenk Uygur Brawl Over Civilian Casualty Data in Gaza

NewsNation host Dan Abrams and progressive firebrand Cenk Uygur clashed over the ongoing conflict between Israel and Hamas – including the number of Palestinians killed by the Israeli military.

The conflict began after Hamas militants carried out a series of terrorist attacks in Israel nearly two weeks ago, killing more than 1,300 people. In response, Israel has conducted air strikes in Gaza, which Hamas controls. A ground invasion of Gaza is expected at some point.

This week, the Palestinian Ministry of Health claimed 500 people were killed when an Israeli bomb struck a hospital. The Israeli government denied the charge, saying that the strike was caused by a rocket fired by Gaza militants. That assessment was shared by U.S. intelligence in a statement on Wednesday.

Abrams, who is the founder and owner of Mediaite, has been critical of media outlets that broadcast the Hamas-run health ministry’s claims.

Uygur, who is a Democratic presidential candidate, began his appearance on Dan Abrams Live on Wednesday by criticizing the Israeli government for barring some journalists from Gaza, which he said hampers efforts to gather reliable information.

“When you don’t allow journalists into an area, that’s kind of on you,” he said, referring to the lack of independent sources on the ground. “So, I’m not gonna take anyone’s word for it when they won’t allow journalists into the area. And Israel has already killed a number of journalists, including a Reuters journalist. And I’m sure that every killing is, of course, an accident, including when they bombed a bus full of people. What? Seventy people died, I believe? That convoy where they asked them to leave. The U.N. has said they bombed schools, etc. So–”

“Wait, wait wait,” Abrams interjected. First of all, the 70 – there is a huge dispute about what happened there and that it may have not been Israel at all that–”

“Oh, it’s never Israel,” Uygur said sarcastically.

“I know it’s not possible that it would be the terrorists,” Abrams mocked.

Later in the interview, Uygur cited claims by Hamas that 3,000 civilians have been killed in Israeli strikes since the war began.

“Where are you getting that number from?” Abrams said. “You’re getting it from Hamas.” The host accused Uygur of repeating the data “without questioning them.”

“The number one problem in media in my lifetime has been the exact opposite of what you and Brian said,” he retorted. “They almost always take the government position as if it’s true. I’ve seen it happen 200 times, both in the case of America and Israel, and almost every time the government is lying. But the rebuttable presumption, Dan, is on the aggressor. So, when Hamas attacked Israel, they don’t get to complain about propaganda. And so in this case, Israel is the aggressor against Gaza.”

Abrams rejected the characterization of Israel as the aggressor. Later, he returned to the issue of civilian casualty numbers.

“Any Hamas number is going to include fighters and civilians together,” the host said. “I won’t even begin to accept those numbers. I don’t even know if it’s 300. I don’t know if it’s 3,000. It’s Hamas numbers, they mean nothing!”

Watch above via NewsNation.