So Jonny is being disingenuous. We’re not paying the bank salaries – oh, we are. And who has been pushing it all? Liberals.

I was just reading a story about Rahm Emanual’s buddies in Chicago who supported him for election to mayor – VERY HEAVY in the financial industry.

As for public sector union jobs, Jonny should be smart enough to know that the teacher’s making a low 5 figures aren’t the issue…just like the lower end banker isn’t th issue in the financial industry.

Somehow, Jonny and other liberals know that the lower end bankers aren’t an issue so why is he focusing on the teachers that aren’t an issue??

Ahh, he’s a liberal – so the truth does not matter.

I’ll give an example in Illinois. Guess what Illinois taxpayers owe the top 100 Teacher’s Administrators in Illinois for pensions???????

Remember, I’m talking about the top 100 paid administrators – just 100 people.

Over $885 MILLION DOLLARS. See
http://www.championnews.net/article.php?sid=1023

There is a salary list too. You will be amazed at what some teachers make. Jonny is supposed to be smart…how come he misses these things?

Now I understand why people think Fox is full of shit.

Alz said:
http://www.championnews.net/

That’s where you get your info? That teabagger web-page wouldn’t even claim that stuff as news. They labeled it an opinion piece.

Nice points for contention. A few points of missed truth:
1. Student teachers do not usually get paid at all. Nothing. Student teachers do their student teaching as part of the college requirement.
2. They forgot to add the retirement payments tax payers pay into teacher funds. The retirement payment is also a benefit.
3. It is NOT 9 months of work for a teacher. It is 6 months. Most school districts that do not do year round education have a school schedule of 185 days. That carries over for a nine month period but actually only equals (do the math, 30 days avg. per month divided into 185 days of scheduled school) 6 months.
Do teachers have it easy? No. But if you really, really want to be fair, you have to take the average salary, add ALL the benefits then multiply the money X2 since they only work 6 months of the year by total days. Suddenly the 85K turns into 170K… and many, many, many teachers have a second job on weekends and in the summer. If teachers really want to get mad they should find the person who made them go into the teaching profession and hold that person accountable.
Just saying…

And don’t even get me started on tenure. Young teacher, 22-23 years old. Work 4 years (usually) in a school. The school board offers you tenure. You accept. That is the golden Socialist pass to job security. Once a teacher has tenure it is very difficult to remove that teacher from their position. Most contracts guarantee a raise every year. And the benefits add up. I know an art teacher in a rural community at a high school with less than 500 students. This teacher makes 72.5K a year for 185 days work. Not a bad chunk of change for a farming community. Yep, they have worked in this school for 35 years and they have earned their benefits. Still, not a lot for them to protest.

IIWII said:
It is NOT 9 months of work for a teacher. It is 6 months. Most school districts that do not do year round education have a school schedule of 185 days. That carries over for a nine month period but actually only equals (do the math, 30 days avg. per month divided into 185 days of scheduled school) 6 months.

Any argument you make that is actually valid is dismissed by this poor mathematical misleading attempt to belittle their time earned.

Nacho said:
Any argument you make that is actually valid is dismissed by this poor mathematical misleading attempt to belittle their time earned.

It is math. 185 scheduled school days. That is 6 months… and a few days.

IIWII said:
It is math. 185 scheduled school days. That is 6 months… and a few days.

Idiot post of the week.

IIWII said:
It is math. 185 scheduled school days. That is 6 months… and a few days.

Wow, its so obvious, how could I have missed that…

Dipshit

IIWII said:
It is math. 185 scheduled school days. That is 6 months… and a few days.

185 school days at 8 hours a day equals 1480 hours.

That’s only 61 24-hour periods.

Teachers are getting paid their salaries for 61 work days!

Lazy bums!

BFD said:
185 school days at 8 hours a day equals 1480 hours. That’s only 61 24-hour periods. Teachers are getting paid their salaries for 61 work days! Lazy bums!

We were not talking hours… we were talking days. And if the truth be told… school days are not 8 hours long. Teachers usually have 5-6 classes of less than an hour each. AND they have a prep period where they do not teach anything. Under your math, it is 185 days x 6 hours / 24 = 46.25 24 hour periods. And that is the math if you want to do it your way.

Nacho said:
Any argument you make that is actually valid is dismissed by this poor mathematical misleading attempt to belittle their time earned.

Don’t know how you missed it… but you did. Public school education?????

IIWII said:
We were not talking hours… we were talking days. And if the truth be told… school days are not 8 hours long. Teachers usually have 5-6 classes of less than an hour each. AND they have a prep period where they do not teach anything. Under your math, it is 185 days x 6 hours / 24 = 46.25 24 hour periods. And that is the math if you want to do it your way.

What do you suppose they do during that prep period? A teacher’s job is not just in the classroom.

damien said:
What do you suppose they do during that prep period? A teacher’s job is not just in the classroom.

Wellllllll, during my prep period I read breaking news, get caught up on world events, get in touch with other teachers and exchange ideas and thoughts… pretty much the same thing I would do out of school.

Alz, you really don’t have man logical reasoning skills, do you? Can’t you read either? Teachers do NOT make hundreds of thousands of dollars a year. And your web site “proof” is a pack of lies. Go look up actual teacher salaries on a REAL website. $50,000 a year is high. Most starting salaries are around $28,000 a year.

Ahhh – but you’re a conservative, so the truth does not matter.

HILARIOUS AS USUAL!!!!

You FOX ‘news’ Partisan Hacks always come with the same garbage.

You are such BRAINWASHED ZOMBIES! You believe anything your Corporate Overlords tell you.

All you FOX ZOMBIES are just another set of Lee Atwater style experiments. There is a set of words you respond to like Pavlov’s Dog. You’re mere conditionalized animals! HAHAHA! . I make money off you Clowns with just a few phrases and you don’t even know what’s happening to you.

KEEP ON BELIEVING FOX ‘news’ ZOMBIE$$$$$$$

IIWI, you sound like a bitter, fired teacher. My husband is a teacher, and he works at least 60 hours a week. There’s the 6 hours he’s actually teaching, the hour of prep time (which, for real teachers, is not used to “get caught up on world events or read breaking news”, for god’s sake; he counsels students, and PREPS for his classes). Then he comes home and has 4 hours of correcting and lesson plans. So, let’s see, that’s about 10 hours a day, or 50 hours a week. On the weekends he typically spends 4-6 hours creating lesson plans and correcting homework. Add another 10 hours a week. 60 hours a week for nine months is 48 hours a week. Far more than you slackers who work for private industry.

And you are completely wrong about tenure (gee, what a surprise). All it means is that there must be a REASON to fire you, not because you walked into the building wearing a yellow shirt and your boss hates yellow. Which, for you people who don’t understand capitalism, is perfectly legal in any right-to-work state.

And did you fail math or something in third grade? A working month is NOT 30 days long. It is 22 days, because of somethings called WEEKENDS. Which were brought to you by unions. Sheesh. How did you miss that? Private school education?

Sad,sad day in America when the rich start attacking teachers.They got their tax cuts.Thought $250,000 year was almost poverty.Wonder what they think $50,000 a year is?Disgusting and sad.

IIWII said:
We were not talking hours… we were talking days. And if the truth be told… school days are not 8 hours long. Teachers usually have 5-6 classes of less than an hour each. AND they have a prep period where they do not teach anything. Under your math, it is 185 days x 6 hours / 24 = 46.25 24 hour periods. And that is the math if you want to do it your way.

So will you now compare a teachers salary to other career salaries after you subtract weekend, vacations and holidays from them?

I can’t wait for that!

IIWII said:
Wellllllll, during my prep period I read breaking news, get caught up on world events, get in touch with other teachers and exchange ideas and thoughts… pretty much the same thing I would do out of school.

So, you’re a crap teacher, or would be, if you’re just being facicious. Fair enough, but do you really think all teachers should be striped of their bargaining rights just because you’re a lazy slob.

grafxmail7 said:
HILARIOUS AS USUAL!!!! You FOX ‘news’ Partisan Hacks always come with the same garbage. You are such BRAINWASHED ZOMBIES! You believe anything your Corporate Overlords tell you. All you FOX ZOMBIES are just another set of Lee Atwater style experiments. There is a set of words you respond to like Pavlov’s Dog. You’re mere conditionalized animals! HAHAHA! . I make money off you Clowns with just a few phrases and you don’t even know what’s happening to you. KEEP ON BELIEVING FOX ‘news’ ZOMBIE$$$$$$$

To be far, almost all of the clips Stewart showed are from Fox Business rather than Fox News, and from what I gather (as I said in a comment on an earlier article) I don’t watch network news) Fox Business has taken a rather more Libertarian rather than conservative bent, and as such might be expected to take a more anti-public worker approach. I’m not saying that makes it right, but I think you should be clearer about what you’re attacking.

Actually the average salary for a teacher just starting out with no masters degree in the state of WI is around $100,000. If you have your masters, add another $15-20,000 onto your actual salary. I’d say that’s a nice pay scale.

Also, the AFSCME union head for the state of WI makes more than our Governor. The union leader makes around $165-170,000 on salary alone.

http://maciverinstitute.com/2011/02/labor-leaders-living-large/

Collective bargaining for the state of WI also doesn’t include work conditions like classroom size, a major talking point of those that are pro-collective bargaining.

http://maciverinstitute.com/2011/02/administrators-refute-weacs-class-size-claims/

IIWII said:
Wellllllll, during my prep period I read breaking news, get caught up on world events, get in touch with other teachers and exchange ideas and thoughts… pretty much the same thing I would do out of school.

Well why aren’t you still in teaching since you had it so great?

Here’s also a way to check out the salaries of WI residents, as its public info:

http://www.postcrescent.com/article/99999999/APC0110/80221166

I can just imagine what will happen in other states now, as students who are conservative start actively ignoring their teachers wishes because their parents are feeding them nonsense. It’s just going to start a bunch of crap… kids will start saying stuff like “we pay your salaries, you have to do what we say”… and their parents will agree. Why ruin what was already working, figure out a way to cut the budget without taking workers rights. It would be hard but a talented governer could find a compromise… this guys just creating problems for the country.

Snowspot said:
I can just imagine what will happen in other states now, as students who are conservative start actively ignoring their teachers wishes because their parents are feeding them nonsense. It’s just going to start a bunch of crap… kids will start saying stuff like “we pay your salaries, you have to do what we say”… and their parents will agree. Why ruin what was already working, figure out a way to cut the budget without taking workers rights. It would be hard but a talented governer could find a compromise… this guys just creating problems for the country.

Perhaps you don’t know how states run when you’re bankrupt. I don’t know where you live. No person should be forced to pay into a system by force. That is what the unions do. If you want education to change and teachers to get paid more, then get rid of collective bargaining and you have a whole new ballgame. If you can’t see that union leaders are the problems with unions, then conservatives can’t help ya.

Snowspot said:
this guys just creating problems for the country

I agree.Seems all the republicans want is descent in America.Trying to pit everyone against each other instead of trying to work things out for the better.

Anyone who goes into teaching thinking they’re going to get rich don’t deserve to be teachers.

The average salary for teachers in WI is a little above $46,000. The starting pay is a little more than $25,000.

http://teacherportal.com/salary/Wisconsin-teacher-salary

WCinWI said:
Here’s also a way to check out the salaries of WI residents, as its public info:

http://www.postcrescent.com/article/99999999/APC0110/80221166

*whoops….I meant the salaries of the public employees. Most teachers without a masters made around $45-50,000 starting out. I saw two outliers out of say 10 that made $35,000 and $40,000 otherwise it was around $49-55,000 with Bachelors degrees and $65-71,000 with masters.

OxyCon said:
Anyone who goes into teaching thinking they’re going to get rich don’t deserve to be teachers.

Teachers know your not going to get rich. Would be nice just to live a decent life.At least as well as those poor $250,000 dollar poverty stricken people.

WCinWI said:
That is what the unions do. If you want education to change and teachers to get paid more, then get rid of collective bargaining and you have a whole new ballgame.

That is the dumbest thing I’ve read tonight. Yeah, get rid of collective bargaining. That way they can just freeze or cut teachers salaries and say the hell with you, take it or leave it. Why don’t we go back to child labor and the sweat shops too. The RWers want to go backwards not forward.

the real john t said:
That is the dumbest thing I’ve read tonight. Yeah, get rid of collective bargaining. That way they can just freeze or cut teachers salaries and say the hell with you, take it or leave it. Why don’t we go back to child labor and the sweat shops too. The RWers want to go backwards not forward.

Ummm perhaps if you knew what was going on in WI, you would understand that collective bargaining on salary is being kept. You are just a dunce.

the real john t said:
That is the dumbest thing I’ve read tonight. Yeah, get rid of collective bargaining. That way they can just freeze or cut teachers salaries and say the hell with you, take it or leave it. Why don’t we go back to child labor and the sweat shops too. The RWers want to go backwards not forward.

Now if you would like to find a teacher on the site that I provided, that earns $25,000, that would be great because the lowest I saw was $35,000. On average, teachers make $32.17 per hour, more than a nurse or accountant apparently. I’m using the site you linked. As I said, if you can find me someone that fits the criteria that you provided, go ahead and link it.

the real john t said:
That is the dumbest thing I’ve read tonight. Yeah, get rid of collective bargaining. That way they can just freeze or cut teachers salaries and say the hell with you, take it or leave it. Why don’t we go back to child labor and the sweat shops too. The RWers want to go backwards not forward.

Last I checked, the private sector had to pay for their own health insurance and retirement accounts.

You clearly don’t know how any of this works.

..and yet millions of Americans continue to brand Obama as a “socialist” or a “Marxist”, when one of our largest banks made over $17 billion last year. Funny, I never realized Marxism involved redistribution of wealth from the poor and middle classes to the rich.

Some good people of America still think its noble to want to educate the youngest Americans among us.To give everyone a chance at a decent future.I call that a patriot. lover of the good old USA. Shame on the people trying to make being a teacher so unappealing no one will have an education but the people who can bid the highest for it.

ROCKSTEADY said:
Some good people of America still think its noble to want to educate the youngest Americans among us.To give everyone a chance at a decent future.I call that a patriot. lover of the good old USA. Shame on the people trying to make being a teacher so unappealing no one will have an education but the people who can bid the highest for it.

Yes – shame on the union leaders.

ROCKSTEADY said:
Teachers know your not going to get rich. Would be nice just to live a decent life.At least as well as those poor $250,000 dollar poverty stricken people.

When I was a school kid, alot of my teachers lived in the same lower middle class neighborhood I grew up in and were my neighbors, in a neighborhood full of smallish cape cod and ranch style homes. Even the high school principle. Both my parents worked full time jobs, while some of the female teachers were single and lived alone.

IIWII said:
Nice points for contention. A few points of missed truth:
1. Student teachers do not usually get paid at all. Nothing. Student teachers do their student teaching as part of the college requirement.
2. They forgot to add the retirement payments tax payers pay into teacher funds. The retirement payment is also a benefit.
3. It is NOT 9 months of work for a teacher. It is 6 months. Most school districts that do not do year round education have a school schedule of 185 days. That carries over for a nine month period but actually only equals (do the math, 30 days avg. per month divided into 185 days of scheduled school) 6 months.
Do teachers have it easy? No. But if you really, really want to be fair, you have to take the average salary, add ALL the benefits then multiply the money X2 since they only work 6 months of the year by total days. Suddenly the 85K turns into 170K… and many, many, many teachers have a second job on weekends and in the summer. If teachers really want to get mad they should find the person who made them go into the teaching profession and hold that person accountable.
Just saying…

Should we do the math to determine the average workers salary if they worked 30 days per month, or can we just say you are an idiot

WCinWI said:
shame on

No.Shame on Governor Walker and the republican for starting this fight against teachers and the public education system. And shame on those poverty stricken $250,000 poor people.shame on you for defending Walker and the GOP party.

Nacho said:
Wow, its so obvious, how could I have missed that…

Dipshit

BFD said:
185 school days at 8 hours a day equals 1480 hours.

That’s only 61 24-hour periods.

Teachers are getting paid their salaries for 61 work days!

Lazy bums!

HAHAHAHAHA

That way they can just freeze or cut teachers salaries and say the hell with you, take it or leave it.

t-bone

Welcome to the real world.

WCinWI said:
Last I checked, the private sector had to pay for their own health insurance and retirement accounts.
You clearly don’t know how any of this works.

No, you’re the one that doesn’t know how things work. Why don’t you just admit you’ve never had a job in your life and have no idea how it really works.

And millions of Americans insist that without more tax breaks for the wealthy, and with the supposed burdens imposed upon business by health care reform, companies can’t do additional hiring and will be forced out of business…so given, say, a 5% hit on their profits, JP Morgan would only have made 16 billion last year. I guess it’s hard to get by as a business on 16 billions bucks. I can understand why they’d need to fold up their tents with such meager profits.

OxyCon said:
Anyone who goes into teaching thinking they’re going to get rich don’t deserve to be teachers.

God bless the good ones, though!

the real john t said:
No, you’re the one that doesn’t know how things work. Why don’t you just admit you’ve never had a job in your life and have no idea how it really works.

Nice try at deflection. Now if you’d like to post me out those details that I asked for, that would be great. :)

If not, continue your rage.

BTW, WCinWI, when are you going to stop lying about teachers in WI making an average salary of $100,000?

Olby Sucks said:
God bless the good ones, though!

Perhaps liberals should be required to watch Waiting for Superman.

Tracy Byrnes Tee Hee.

the real john t said:
BTW, WCinWI, when are you going to stop lying about teachers in WI making an average salary of $100,000?

I didn’t say that they made a salary avg. of $100,000. That’s the standard package for someone with what seems a Bachelors degree. If you have a masters it looks like you’re at around $65-71,000. Standard avg. salary is say $50,000 plus barely contributing anything towards health and retirement packages. Most people in the private sector have to contribute their own allotted funds instead of essentially “free” money.

Nacho said:
That’s where you get your info? That teabagger web-page wouldn’t even claim that stuff as news. They labeled it an opinion piece.

Wow this is like the Bozo the clown show for teabaggers, thanks to the teabag for this awesome site. This is like the Weekly World News for even stupider people.

It’s pathetic that the union thugs would use schooll teachers as shields.

Alz said:
So Jonny is being disingenuous. We’re not paying the bank salaries – oh, we are. And who has been pushing it all? Liberals.

I was just reading a story about Rahm Emanual’s buddies in Chicago who supported him for election to mayor – VERY HEAVY in the financial industry.

As for public sector union jobs, Jonny should be smart enough to know that the teacher’s making a low 5 figures aren’t the issue…just like the lower end banker isn’t th issue in the financial industry.

Somehow, Jonny and other liberals know that the lower end bankers aren’t an issue so why is he focusing on the teachers that aren’t an issue??

Ahh, he’s a liberal – so the truth does not matter.

I’ll give an example in Illinois. Guess what Illinois taxpayers owe the top 100 Teacher’s Administrators in Illinois for pensions???????

Remember, I’m talking about the top 100 paid administrators – just 100 people.

Over $885 MILLION DOLLARS. See
http://www.championnews.net/article.php?sid=1023

There is a salary list too. You will be amazed at what some teachers make. Jonny is supposed to be smart…how come he misses these things?

Thank you for the invaluable link to Champion News. This is maybe the funniest teabag website I have seen thus far and there is strong competition. Do they call themselves Champion News because it’s sort of like the Special Olympics where everyone is a champion?

Olby Sucks said:
God bless the good ones, though!

I love the argument that is out in the media or blogosphere that in WI, unions have already given in to demands for health and retirement packages. Yet, there are countless articles about various unions in different districts that have put forth contracts not including these concessions. I would think that would go against their “we will agree to these concessions” meme. :)

t-bone don’t forget to point out my typo…

WCinWI said:
Nice try at deflection.

I didn’t deflect anything you idiot. This is what you said:

WCinWI said:
Last I checked, the private sector had to pay for their own health insurance and retirement accounts.

If you knew anything about a lot of private sector jobs the employee pays in so much of their 401k plan or pension plan and the employer matches what they pay in. The same with health care. Now why don’t you just admit you have no idea what the hell you’re talking about.

Color Me Badd said:
Thank you for the invaluable link to Champion News. This is maybe the funniest teabag website I have seen thus far and there is strong competition. Do they call themselves Champion News because it’s sort of like the Special Olympics where everyone is a champion?

Wow – making fun of the helpless. How truly sad of you.

WCinWI said:
Wow – making fun of the helpless. How truly sad of you.

Obama made fun of the Special Olympics, too. Classy.

the real john t said:
I didn’t deflect anything you idiot. This is what you said:

If you knew anything about a lot of private sector jobs the employee pays in so much of their 401k plan or pension plan and the employer matches what they pay in. The same with health care. Now why don’t you just admit you have no idea what the hell you’re talking about.

I’m younger therefore I haven’t had a grown-up job yet. I do have my masters and I have interned for top notch companies (even interned at the Rose Bowl…woot woot) but I do have a Roth IRA. I understand that with 401k’s, you can match up to 3 or 5%, however that’s based on what that particular business sets as its own way of handling things. That’s not a given. As far as health care, there are different options with that too. From what I understand, a lot of companies do co-pays…but I wouldn’t consider this a matching, as I would think that you are merely subsidizing a large number that the company has to be held liable for.

However, what you fail to mention is that the private sector is not given any money. They have that ability, but there is a choice. Teachers and unions get “free” money in off-set for a lower salary amount. However, if you have a masters, it looks like you’re doing ok.

Terrorist hide behind women and children and union thugs hide behind teachers…which is worse?

Olby Sucks said:
Obama made fun of the Special Olympics, too. Classy.

I know…what’s up with him pulling a Rahm? :)

I do have my masters

wc

Congrats!

wtf?!!! deceptive title and misrepresentation by frances martel of what Jon Stewart said about teachers. on the contrary, Jon exposed the hypocrisy of Fox business as they tried to defend wall street and the bush tax cuts while demonizing teachers and unions.

WCinWI said:
I’m younger therefore I haven’t had a grown-up job yet. I do have my masters and I have interned for top notch companies (even interned at the Rose Bowl…woot woot) but I do have a Roth IRA. I understand that with 401k’s, you can match up to 3 or 5%, however that’s based on what that particular business sets as its own way of handling things. That’s not a given. As far as health care, there are different options with that too. From what I understand, a lot of companies do co-pays…but I wouldn’t consider this a matching, as I would think that you are merely subsidizing a large number that the company has to be held liable for.

However, what you fail to mention is that the private sector is not given any money. They have that ability, but there is a choice. Teachers and unions get “free” money in off-set for a lower salary amount. However, if you have a masters, it looks like you’re doing ok.

Oh and by grown-up job, I merely mean one that offered benefits. After I got my grad. degree, I went to work in health care on the marketing side but I made less than I made prior to entering grad. school and I was hourly. So I was working, just not at a seasoned job.

Just wanted to put that “I’m a bum” mentality to bed. :) I’ll be taking a prep class for the LSAT starting in April. Fun times.

Olby Sucks said:
I do have my masters

wc

Congrats!

Haha thanks…I really want the JD degree though. Then maybe online blogs won’t call me a random alcoholic or birther….haha

WCinWI said:
I’m younger therefore I haven’t had a grown-up job yet. I do have my masters…

I’m sure you have a masters degree. Just where did you get it from?

WC, be careful what you divulge to t-bone about your personal life cause he’s evil and hangs out with evil peeps.

WCinWI said:
Haha thanks…I really want the JD degree though. Then maybe online blogs won’t call me a random alcoholic or birther….haha

And if the JD doesn’t happen, I will just stuff myself with ice cream, cry a lot and come back online meaner than ever. :)

the real john t said:
I’m sure you have a masters degree. Just where did you get it from?

Somewhere in the US. If that’s good enough for Obama, then that’s good enough for me. :)

the real john t said:
I’m sure you have a masters degree. Just where did you get it from?

See what I mean, WC? Don’t tell this prick anything personal.

Olby Sucks said:
WC, be careful what you divulge to t-bone about your personal life cause he’s evil and hangs out with evil peeps.

Haha oh I won’t divulge anything beyond what I’ve already said. I like my resume thus far. No need to make that public. Besides, since the court in IL just made it legal to publicly name people on blogs, uh oh!

Olby Sucks said:
Terrorist hide behind women and children and union thugs hide behind teachers…which is worse?

You, hiding behind one of your horse’s ass.

Olby Sucks said:
See what I mean, WC? Don’t tell this prick anything personal.

And he wonders why I call him a stalker! He’s beyond creepy.

Olby Sucks said:
See what I mean, WC? Don’t tell this prick anything personal.

Ooooh I always wanted to learn to horseback ride. :)

WCinWI said:
And he wonders why I call him a stalker! He’s beyond creepy.

He comes here from newshounds and they are the worst of the worst. fake royal king is a newshounder, too.

WCinWI said:
Somewhere in the US.

Yeah, that’s the thing about the internet. Anyone can lie and make themselves look good. But from your comments it seems you aren’t smart enough to graduate from high school let alone college.

WCinWI said:
Ooooh I always wanted to learn to horseback ride. :)

Cowgirl up!

the real john t said:
Yeah, that’s the thing about the internet. Anyone can lie and make themselves look good. But from your comments it seems you aren’t smart enough to graduate from high school let alone college.

sez the union thug…

Olby Sucks said:
He comes here from newshounds and they are the worst of the worst.

And Olby comes from Dollar’s Dump. But he even got banned from there. He’s been banned from every site he’s been on except this one.

the real john t said:
Yeah, that’s the thing about the internet. Anyone can lie and make themselves look good. But from your comments it seems you aren’t smart enough to graduate from high school let alone college.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Oh would I just love to see you say all of the mean stuff you type to people on this site…….your mother must be so proud.

Olby Sucks said:
He comes here from newshounds and they are the worst of the worst. fake royal king is a newshounder, too.

Just went over that site to check it out. I had to crack up when I saw that they had a store. I thought liberals hated capitalism. I’ll stick to HotAir and Breitbart vids.

WCinWI said:
Ooooh I always wanted to learn to horseback ride. :)

Too bad. You see Olby doesn’t ride horses he jacks them off for a living. He has to do that in order to keep living in his parents house.

the real john t said:
And Olby comes from Dollar’s Dump. But he even got banned from there. He’s been banned from every site he’s been on except this one.

I got banned? That’s news to me. You have a list of all these blogs I got banned from?

Newshounds is worse than DKos and Democracy U? I love that DKos is crazy enough to create an internet family. That is when I know a site has gone off the deep end.

the real john t said:
Too bad. You see Olby doesn’t ride horses he jacks them off for a living. He has to do that in order to keep living in his parents house.

I think you’re projecting your own male fantasies. I’d see your male physician.

WC, I have to hit the rack. Be safe!

WCinWI said:
Oh would I just love to see you say all of the mean stuff you type to people on this site…….

Yeah, you’re just like murf on here. He said he was going to find me and kick my ass. When I sent him an email telling him where he could find me, he sent one back saying it was all in good fun. Just a BS lying coward like you.

Haha you too Olby. Off to bed myself! Dream happy thoughts! :)

the real john t said:
Yeah, you’re just like murf on here. He said he was going to find me and kick my ass. When I sent him an email telling him where he could find me, he sent one back saying it was all in good fun. Just a BS lying coward like you.

You big tough guy you…

WCinWI said:
I think you’re projecting your own male fantasies.

Just ask Olby what he does for a living.

the real john t said:
Yeah, you’re just like murf on here. He said he was going to find me and kick my ass. When I sent him an email telling him where he could find me, he sent one back saying it was all in good fun. Just a BS lying coward like you.

I find emailing someone from an online site like this creepy. And as a conservative, I don’t condone violence. That’s a liberal principle. Now continue your rage with others!

OHHHHH!!! Look at that. Olby and WC are going to bed together to lick each others ass.

WCinWI said:
I find emailing someone from an online site like this creepy. And as a conservative, I don’t condone violence. That’s a liberal principle. Now continue your rage with others!

Maybe you can’t comprehend what is written. I’m not the one that said I was going to kick someone’s ass. Murf was.

From the article: “Stewart made a point of Governor Scott Walker’s claim that everyone in the state had to sacrifice, and that couldn’t exclude teachers.”

From an NYT editorial; “The Hollow Cry of ‘Broke’”:

” . . . The federal deficit is too large for comfort, and most states are struggling to balance their books. Some of that is because of excessive spending, and much is because the recession has driven down tax revenues. But a substantial part was caused by deliberate decisions by state and federal lawmakers to drain government of resources by handing out huge tax cuts, mostly to the rich. As governments begin to stagger from the self-induced hemorrhaging, Republican politicians like Mr. Boehner and Mr. Walker cry poverty and use it as an excuse to break unions and kill programs they never liked in flush years. . . . ”

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/03/opinion/03thu1.html?src=recg

Bush, Cheney and the Republicans used lies, twisted intel, fearmongering and Fakes “News” to embroil us in two illegal wars that killed thousands of American soldiers and untold numbers of innocent civilians – wars that may ultimately cost $3 trillion, without so much as a drop of Iraqi oil to show for the tragic and costly losses we endured. They gave unneeded tax cuts to their fat-cat donors and the already rich while allowing desperate Americans to languish. They allowed their Wall St, bankster pals to rob our Treasury and tank our economy.

All the while, they spent like sailors on a binge – more than doubling the national debt. But NOW Republicans tell us they have suddenly discovered “fiscal responsibility.”

Yeah, right.

jrcmi said:
All the while, they spent like sailors on a binge – more than doubling the national debt. But NOW Republicans tell us they have suddenly discovered “fiscal responsibility.”

Conservatives aren’t very happy with Republicans either. Did you notice the last election? Nevertheless, it would be good for America if Democrits EVER would “discover fiscal responsibility, being the ones who’ve made it a party platform to break the economic back of the U.S. by creating dependency that can never be satiated.

Being a Liberal anti-American operative, Stewart deliberately avoids the main factor in the dispute over the irrationality of government worker unions. “Bargaining”: can only have credibility when done between the workers and payers. Government workers NEVER have to face the payers they demand more from.

It’s revealing that government unions, workers, and DIMS they’ve suckered into the riot aren’t concerned about the people in Wisconsin losing their jobs and their homes to the Obama Depression, and continue their selfish demands for more of the citizens’ ‘stuff.’ One could argue that our soldiers in the military have a MUCH more crucial role to play being employed by the citizenry. Should they be unionized and go on strike whenever they want more?

Walker should have organized a mass firing ala Reagan. Give the selfish slobs 48 hours to get real, then dump ‘em into the cesspool they prefer to swim in. Enough DIM-O-WIT whining that Liberals should be immune to the financial woes wrought by their own bloated government malfeasance.

Davo said:
Being a Liberal anti-American operative

Sometimes I just have to laugh at the insanity of you teabloggers.

Libs & union HACKS have already LOST the PR battle here, but Little Jon does need something to fill his show with each night, so a limp-wristed propaganda effort probably seems like a good idea.

Poor, poor Jon; Poor, poor Libs.

Hey Little Jonny Boy,

When will you be doing the Lavish Lifestyle of Their UNION LEADERS?

ChrisNH said:
Libs & union HACKS have already LOST the PR battle here,

Ummm…no.
Even the latest pos Rasmussen poll has the majority siding with the unions over the CBR issue.

BFD said:
Ummm…no.
Even the latest pos Rasmussen poll has the majority siding with the unions over the CBR issue.

Not to mention that the Wisconsin Governor has backed himself into an unwinnable corner; He has struck a no compromises stance which means that eventually he’ll have to fire the current crop of teachers and when they’re replaced by randoms off the street with no experience, little education and being nothing more than a warm body, parents aren’t going to be very happy.

Oh, and I realize it’s been three or four pages ago, but…

IIWII said:
We were not talking hours… we were talking days. And if the truth be told… school days are not 8 hours long. Teachers usually have 5-6 classes of less than an hour each. AND they have a prep period where they do not teach anything. Under your math, it is 185 days x 6 hours / 24 = 46.25 24 hour periods. And that is the math if you want to do it your way.

You do realize that by using this scale most of the pundits included in Jon’s excellent takedown only “work” one to three hours a day?

Oh, and I assume that most, if not all of these anchors, reporters and those behind the cameras are members of AFTRA or a similar AFL/CIO-related union.

Magister said:
He has struck a no compromises stance which means that eventually he’ll have to fire the current crop of teachers and when they’re replaced by randoms off the street with no experience, little education and being nothing more than a warm body, parents aren’t going to be very happy.

That’s bullshit. They’ll be able to hire eager & qualified teachers like my 28 year old son, an elementary school teacher who actually cares about the job and the kids.

timzank said:
That’s bullshit. They’ll be able to hire eager & qualified teachers like my 28 year old son, an elementary school teacher who actually cares about the job and the kids.

I’m sure they’ll be able to find a few winners, but I doubt they’ll find thousands, especially now that they’ve threatened benefits and teacher’s salaries have been called into question.

timzank said:
That’s bullshit. They’ll be able to hire eager & qualified teachers like my 28 year old son, an elementary school teacher who actually cares about the job and the kids.

Then, by all means, we should exploit your son and others dedicated to service. Treat them like krap. Pay low wages. Cut back on the benefits. Hold them in utter contempt. Because, they’ll keep coming back. Good think there Timmy, as always.

Meanwhile, here is some more tolerance via the Union thugs.

http://www.dispatchpolitics.com/live/content/local_news/stories/2011/03/04/copy/senate-bill-5-drama-spills-into-restaurant.html?adsec=politics&sid=101

“It could have (gotten physical),” said Sen. Frank LaRose, 31, a Fairlawn Republican who served as a Green Beret. “The group was agitated and they were shoving the owner, and he had nothing to do with this.”

I’m sure Mediaite and the other national media is going to run right out and report on these attacks.

Magister said:
eventually he’ll have to fire the current crop of teachers and when they’re replaced by randoms off the street with no experience, little education and being nothing more than a warm body, parents aren’t going to be very happy.

Which is probably your little way of saying that parents everywhere are ‘very happy’ with ‘publick skools’ now?

And you would try to convince us that the ‘experience and education’ possessed by publick skool teachers is delivering good results? When these ‘esteemed educators’ only care about themselves?

LOL @ that.

Yesterday, a number of districts in our metropolitan area gave out huge numbers of layoff notices. In our case in Texas, not because of unions and collective bargaining, because we have none. This was simply pure fiscal mismanagement by our long time governor and our long time Republican legislature, making symbolic in the individual but massive tax cuts in reliable revenue streams, shifting the tax burden to unreliable revenue streams which, in fact, failed during W’s general recession and never, never cutting a cent from the budget. The anxiety among teachers, students and parents has been palpable, and morale is at a very. very low point. Of course, the remaining teachers will have bloated classrooms for years to come. And, more layoffs are coming in the next two weeks. All of this at a time when Americans are falling further and further behind Europe and Asia in education. It’s a wondrous way to further “American exceptionalism” and build the economic future in America, isn’t it? Sponsored in Texas by Rick Perry and our Republican Legislature ….

Magister said:
I’m sure they’ll be able to find a few winners, but I doubt they’ll find thousands, especially now that they’ve threatened benefits and teacher’s salaries have been called into question.

That’s bullshit too, do you have any idea how many thousands of kids have recently graduated across the nation (in the last 5 years) with teaching degrees that are working in another field? I’ve got 4 in my family and there are thousands more that would much rather be teaching than waiting tables, selling insurance or barely getting by on the “substitute” teacher gig. These kids didn’t get degrees to teach because of the union benefits.

ChrisNH said:
And you would try to convince us that the ‘experience and education’ possessed by publick skool teachers is delivering good results? When these ‘esteemed educators’ only care about themselves?

That’s a huge lie and an insult to some of the most dedicated people in America. But, by all means, continue to bleat, kvetch, moan and whine on a website and do nothing to improve the situation.

timzank said:
That’s bullshit too, do you have any idea how many thousands of kids have recently graduated across the nation (in the last 5 years) with teaching degrees that are working in another field? I’ve got 4 in my family and there are thousands more that would much rather be teaching than waiting tables, selling insurance or barely getting by on the “substitute” teacher gig. These kids didn’t get degrees to teach because of the union benefits.

Interesting how you family confirms every rightist argument you make.

Good point Chris. While I don’t have a big issue with collective bargining, individuals should be able to come together as they want, I believe it shouldn’t be mandatory for a job. As an individual I should have the choice, and that means I shouldn’t have to have a portion of my wages, the fruits of my labor, taken so some union thug can promote some idiot politician.

This is about power, and the Dems are pissed because a less powerful union means less $ for their pocket books.

PAC labor unions gave the DNC over $60 million in ’08, and over $58 million in ’10.

@ Real King,

When the City of Houston can’t balance a ledger or their accounts, it is not the Gov fault. What we have are municipalities that can’t live within their means. Of course you blame such issues on the Gov. It sucks for people getting laid off but if the Govt knew how to live within its means this would n’t happen.

ChrisNH said:
When these ‘esteemed educators’ only care about themselves?

Really?So Timzank’s 28 year old son only cares about himself. News to both of them I’m sure since his son Is an eager & qualified teacher according to Timzank .

The Real Royal King,

“All of this at a time when Americans are falling further and further behind Europe and Asia in education.”

Yeah that whole Department of Education is really paying off isn’t it.

timzank said:
working in another field?

Maybe they are working in another field because people like WALKER are closing all the schools,or taking away every incentive to even want to go into the teaching field.At least they are working,right.

THE REAL ROYAL KING said:
Interesting how you family confirms every rightist argument you make.

The union actually keeps these kids from getting the jobs by allowing the dregs to remain. Unions are an unnecessary entity in 2011, plain and simple.

ROCKSTEADY said:
Maybe they are working in another field because people like WALKER are closing all the schools,or taking away every incentive to even want to go into the teaching field.At least they are working,right.

They can’t get teaching jobs because of the union protected flunkies that can’t be fired. If it was based on ability and qualifications (you know, what would benefit the students) the good ones would be teaching and the rotten ones would be in another line of work. The unions protect the idiots and in reality turn away the talented ones.

More Liberty4 said:
Department of Education

This seems to be the main goal of the Republican party . To take away jobs instead of creating jobs. trying to make the education system Die instead of coming up with ideas to make it better.Is going to WAR the only thing Republicans can get behind? Our young people are good enough to fight and get killed in your WARS you love so much but not good enough to get an education in a public system.Shame.

Freaking conservatives bringing the country down to hell.

ROCKSTEADY said:
This seems to be the main goal of the Republican party . To take away jobs instead of creating jobs. trying to make the education system Die instead of coming up with ideas to make it better.Is going to WAR the only thing Republicans can get behind? Our young people are good enough to fight and get killed in your WARS you love so much but not good enough to get an education in a public system.Shame.

We’ve poured gazillions of taxpayer dollars since the 70′s into the Dept. Of Ed. and never acheived a better result, can you justify dumping billions each year into something that clearly, factually, demonstrably does not work? We turn out a worse product now (students) than we ever did BEFORE the Dept Of Ed.

How can you justify it? Seriously??????

ImJustThatDamnGood said:
Freaking conservatives bringing the country down to hell.

You’re way (dept of ed & unions) hasn’t raised student results in over 40 years Einstein. If it doesn’t work (especially after 40 years) ya think maybe it’s time to try something different? Or are you happy with the results??

timzank said:
That’s bullshit too, do you have any idea how many thousands of kids have recently graduated across the nation (in the last 5 years) with teaching degrees that are working in another field? I’ve got 4 in my family and there are thousands more that would much rather be teaching than waiting tables, selling insurance or barely getting by on the “substitute” teacher gig. These kids didn’t get degrees to teach because of the union benefits.

timzank said:
We’ve poured gazillions of taxpayer dollars since the 70’s into the Dept. Of Ed. and never acheived a better result, can you justify dumping billions each year into something that clearly, factually, demonstrably does not work? We turn out a worse product now (students) than we ever did BEFORE the Dept Of Ed.

How can you justify it? Seriously??????

timzank said:
You’re way (dept of ed & unions) hasn’t raised student results in over 40 years Einstein. If it doesn’t work (especially after 40 years) ya think maybe it’s time to try something different? Or are you happy with the results??

You have 4 family members trying to get into a field that CLEARLY does not work?

Yeah, those poooor teachers. Here’s yet another example of what goes on right here in NYC…teachers getting paid to do union activities while the city has to foot the bill for their replacements in the classroom. Unreal…

http://www.nypost.com/f/print/news/local/union_classic_le_en_jrQKCmKdjWQbMAtzqHASxI

timzank said:
timzank

I disagree with everything you say so our conversation is over.I believe in Public education.I believe in supporting our Young in America. I believe they are worth more than just pawns to be killed in a War the republicans love so much.I believe in giving every American youngster an opportunity to be educated.Education is not just for the Rich who can buy their way thru school.Good luck to your son.Glad he at least has a job.Republicans have not made it so bad in the waiting field yet have they.They do love their servants.

More Liberty4 said:
@ Real King,

When the City of Houston can’t balance a ledger or their accounts, it is not the Gov fault. What we have are municipalities that can’t live within their means. Of course you blame such issues on the Gov. It sucks for people getting laid off but if the Govt knew how to live within its means this would n’t happen.

First: I don’t live in the Houston area. Thanks be to God.
Second: Cities have nothing to do with education in Texas. Texas schools are organized by Independent of Consolidated School Districts.
Third: School Funding is a combination of local (via property tax) and state (via general revenue funding).
Fourth: Most local funding has remained stable. In a few places, it is down slightly. In a few places, it is up slightly. Generally, it is at or near stagnant.
Fifth: Perry and the Republican Legislature ran up a US $34B deficit, and state funding is taking a serious, serious hit.

Next time you want to go hunting, bring some ammunition.

More Liberty4 said:
The Real Royal King,

“All of this at a time when Americans are falling further and further behind Europe and Asia in education.”

Yeah that whole Department of Education is really paying off isn’t it.

I suppose it might mean we would be even further behind. Fact is: Too many Americans are too self-absorbed to give a tinker’s toot about our future.

timzank said:
The union actually keeps these kids from getting the jobs by allowing the dregs to remain. Unions are an unnecessary entity in 2011, plain and simple.

I need an antidote to your anecdotes. Good day to you. Return to your creative writing.

ChrisNH said:
Which is probably your little way of saying that parents everywhere are ‘very happy’ with ‘publick skools’ now?

I’m a parent and though I liked the parent-run charter that we had before we moved, I can’t say that I was “very happy” and I’ll go so far as to say that I’m somewhat disappointed in the school we have now, but most of my disappointment is centered around administrative things and not my children’s teachers.

And, while a big city might have an easier time with a wholesale replacement of all teachers, when you get to the smaller towns with a limited labor force, it’d be more difficult to find qualified applicants and in pretty much every location, they’d be firing someone’s favorite teacher who does an outstanding job.

right-is-wrong said:
You have 4 family members trying to get into a field that CLEARLY does not work?

Sure do, what’s your point? That they should simply give up and not work in and improve the field of education? You want it to stay the way it is? You’re satisfied with the status quo? You think young college graduates with ducation degrees should throw up their hands and say fuck it? That’s your solution, the hell with the youngest and brightest, let’s just leave things the way they are. Great, just great.

Bust the frickin union grip and let the people that are qualified teach the kids, you’ll see the test scores go up.

Yes, they are so poor like that union teacher in NJ who called out Christie to say she should be making $83,000! $83,000!

But guess what? The lying union teacher POS was already making MORE than that!

” On the internet, there is a video of an exchange between Governor Chris Christie and Rita Wilson, a school teacher in the Rutherford School District.

The teacher demands more salary, telling Christie, “if she were paid $3 an hour for the 30 children in her class, she’d be earning $83,000, and she makes nothing near that.”

Christie told her that teachers go into teaching knowing the salary. The teacher tries to claim she does it as a calling, but clearly thinks she should be doing it to earn a cushy living.

There’s just one problem. There is one Rita Wilson working for the Rutherford School District. Assuming the teacher confronting Governor Christie is the same lady, she has no freaking clue what she makes.

Public records from the school district show her making $86,000+.”

THE REAL ROYAL KING said:
I suppose it might mean we would be even further behind. Fact is: Too many Americans are too self-absorbed to give a tinker’s toot about our future.

So you agree the 46 billion a year doesn’t help.

Of course, Stewart misses the point. It isn’t the pay, its the pension and the free health care for life.

How about being honest for once, Jon?

timzank says:
Your comment is awaiting moderation.

March 4, 2011 at 10:01 am timzank(Quote)
0 0
right-is-wrong said:
You have 4 family members trying to get into a field that CLEARLY does not work?

Sure do, what’s your point? That they should simply give up and not work in and improve the field of education? You want it to stay the way it is? You’re satisfied with the status quo? You think young college graduates with ducation degrees should throw up their hands and say fu** it? That’s your solution, the he** with the youngest and brightest, let’s just leave things the way they are. Great, just great.

Bust the frickin union grip and let the people that are qualified teach the kids, you’ll see the test scores go up.

As usual, Stewart hits his mark. It’s all the other disasterous events in the private sector coupled with state’s mismanagement of budgets that leads a conservative to think that it’s the teacher’s fault.

If all of Walker’s other budget cuts didn’t demonstrate that he’s making the poor people of his state, especially women and children, the ones to suffer the most.

If unions were really the problem, ALL public unions, including fire/law enforcement would be on the table. But they are not, revealing the amoral underbelly of the Walkers of the world – liberally-education things are bad and must be crushed!

WCinWI said:
Oh and by grown-up job, I merely mean one that offered benefits. After I got my grad. degree, I went to work in health care on the marketing side but I made less than I made prior to entering grad. school and I was hourly. So I was working, just not at a seasoned job. Just wanted to put that “I’m a bum” mentality to bed. :) I’ll be taking a prep class for the LSAT starting in April. Fun times.

So, in about 5 years, when you have some real world experience, your voice will have some validity.

Until then, you’re a pesky concern troll spouting drivel learned from FNC, Hot Air and Big____ sites.

WCinWI said:
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA Oh would I just love to see you say all of the mean stuff you type to people on this site…….your mother must be so proud.

Yes, those who throw around hate and talk like tough guys on here make me laugh. I doubt they have the balls to talk face-to-face with anyone in the manner they use here. The real racist king is number one on that list, but even here he really only goes after women. BFD, while being clever and sometimes funny, is also what I think of as an internet punk. I pride myself in only saying here what I would say to a person face-to-face.

the real john t said:
Yeah, you’re just like murf on here. He said he was going to find me and kick my ass. When I sent him an email telling him where he could find me, he sent one back saying it was all in good fun. Just a BS lying coward like you.

Anytime you want to meet in Marine Park, Red Bank, NJ and repeat in person, to my face, what you have said on here just let me know the day, the date and the time.

Magister said:
I’m sure they’ll be able to find a few winners, but I doubt they’ll find thousands, especially now that they’ve threatened benefits and teacher’s salaries have been called into question.

If they fire all of the teachers and make Wisconsin a “right to work” state, they can just rehire those same teachers.

WCinWI said:
I didn’t say that they made a salary avg. of $100,000. That’s the standard package for someone with what seems a Bachelors degree. If you have a masters it looks like you’re at around $65-71,000. Standard avg. salary is say $50,000 plus barely contributing anything towards health and retirement packages. Most people in the private sector have to contribute their own allotted funds instead of essentially “free” money.

Is the average worker salary based on comparable education or similar positions? How dare people with a masters degree make more money than those with bachelor degrees! It’s like they have gained expertise in a specific area that not everybody has. It’s not like if you cut their salaries they will leave for some other school willing to pay for their expertise. We cut the salaries and bonuses of the bankers and they all stayed in place. Those teachers may be greedy, but luckily Wall Street showed us sacrifice for the common good can work.

RichS said:
Anytime you want to meet in Marine Park, Red Bank, NJ and repeat in person, to my face, what you have said on here just let me know the day, the date and the time.

Girls, you both are pretty. Why fight?

WCinWI said:
Haha thanks…I really want the JD degree though. Then maybe online blogs won’t call me a random alcoholic or birther….haha

Beware. There are more people with law degrees than good paying jobs for them. If a JD would really help your long term plan, I’d say go for it. Otherwise, think long and hard about it. Speaking with those I’ve known who have recently finished the degree, you may become a random alcoholic because of it.

Yargburger said:
Girls, you both are pretty. Why fight?

I never said a word about fighting. I’m offering the chance to show you are willing to say in person what you type from a position of anonymity.

RichS said:
If they fire all of the teachers and make Wisconsin a “right to work” state, they can just rehire those same teachers.

One would suspect that most of the current teachers would hold the line.

Magister said:
One would suspect that most of the current teachers would hold the line.

Its easier to “hold the line” during times of high employment then it is during times of high unemployment. You could have an out of work accountant teaching match. An out of work electrical engineer teaching physics, etc.

Yargburger said:
Beware. There are more people with law degrees than good paying jobs for them. If a JD would really help your long term plan, I’d say go for it. Otherwise, think long and hard about it. Speaking with those I’ve known who have recently finished the degree, you may become a random alcoholic because of it.

Hahaha I know. The market right now is over-saturated with lawyers, but it’s just a long-term goal to have and use it. I can always get a job at the Federal level, right? :)

Thanks Jon for once again pointing out how ludicrous the argument has become.

I mentioned the Bush tax cuts a week ago when WI was being discussed. If the states are in a budget crisis it is realistic to expect the teachers union to agree to some cuts. But, how does that reconcile with fighting so damed hard to save those making over $250,000 a tear a few % points when the whole nation is in a crisis.

Jon also does a good job of pointing out the shameful opinion for hire state of TV media. It’s not their job to have consistent intelligent commentary and analysis. It’s their job to feed whatever controversy is currently in the news regardless of how inconsistent , or oversimplified it is.

I’m going to guess this thing starting in WI, is the beginning of a dismantling of public education. I was concerned about it when Bush started talking about school vouchers.

Magister said:
One would suspect that most of the current teachers would hold the line.

Well then it was never about the kids anyways.

Seriously. The myths of unions is falling off. I want our education system to change and until you get rid of the political arm, it’s not gonna happen.

Also, I don’t believe in FORCING someone to pay into something that they don’t use. You should have a choice in the matter. If you’re not going to utilize their services, then you shouldn’t have to pay into it. What’s your beef with that? What is your beef with someone earning in essence $100,000?

CosmosDan said:
Thanks Jon for once again pointing out how ludicrous the argument has become.

I mentioned the Bush tax cuts a week ago when WI was being discussed. If the states are in a budget crisis it is realistic to expect the teachers union to agree to some cuts. But, how does that reconcile with fighting so damed hard to save those making over $250,000 a tear a few % points when the whole nation is in a crisis.

Jon also does a good job of pointing out the shameful opinion for hire state of TV media. It’s not their job to have consistent intelligent commentary and analysis. It’s their job to feed whatever controversy is currently in the news regardless of how inconsistent , or oversimplified it is.

I’m going to guess this thing starting in WI, is the beginning of a dismantling of public education. I was concerned about it when Bush started talking about school vouchers.

Most people making over $250,000 are small businesses that file as individuals. Case solved.

CosmosDan said:
I’m going to guess this thing starting in WI, is the beginning of a dismantling of public education. I was concerned about it when Bush started talking about school vouchers

Of course this is whats happening.Stop any chance of our youngest Americans not having the right to a good education.keeping the masses of young stupid with no job choices but to go into the military so they can have plenty of pawns to fight and be killed for the name of the good old USA. What will happen when these good old patriotic Americans don’t want to have their government giving vouchers to families for school?keep em dumb and hungry and we can control them…The Republican way.

frances martel is the bret breibart of mediaite.

WCinWI said:
Most people making over $250,000 are small businesses

Yes, we can see they are living in poverty.Case not solved ,only in your own mind.:)

ROCKSTEADY said:
Yes, we can see they are living in poverty.Case not solved ,only in your own mind.:)

I don’t talk to conspiracy theorists like yourself. I believe in a flat tax so don’t yell at me. :)

Alz said:
I’ll give an example in Illinois. Guess what Illinois taxpayers owe the top 100 Teacher’s Administrators in Illinois for pensions???????

Remember, I’m talking about the top 100 paid administrators – just 100 people.

Over $885 MILLION DOLLARS. See
http://www.championnews.net/article.php?sid=1023

There is a salary list too. You will be amazed at what some teachers make. Jonny is supposed to be smart…how come he misses these things?

First, we agree that Administrators are a bunch of bureaucrats that are way overpaid and have ridiculous retirement benefits.

However, try to be accurate. These are not Teachers. These are the people who do nothing to help educate our students.

These are the board of education people who decide every couple of years to change teaching systems (can’t say what influences these decisions), which means some textbook publisher makes millions off the school system for new textbooks, workbooks, teacher guides and training. I saw it happen in the time my sons (three years apart) went to the same school. They ditched a three year integrated math program for no good reason, which totally screwed up my younger son who had to change before he could complete the third year of the program.

As far as the salary list, please provide it, instead of making baseless attacks on Jon Stewart, just because he shows the incredible hypocrisy of the Republican party (“a contact is a contract” “we can’t restrict pay or we won’t be able to attract the best people” “$250K is almost poverty… but teachers make way too much with their $50K salaries)

And don’t forget Fox’s Tracy Barnes, who complained that those poor Wall Street folks had already “spent their bonuses so how could you get them back?” while screaming that teachers are “setting a bad example for our children in fighting for things that quite frankly they don’t deserve.”

Go ahead, explain to us the wisdom and consistency of these statements.

Just a small point about a small business. They pay for everything, work 18 hour days and 7 days.
Have unreal regulations and paperwork. Usually employ 3 to 5 people whom they pay out of.
the $250,000. Bottom line, some do not $5/hour but are living their American Dream.
BTW, spouses, children usually work for free for the American Dream.
Don’t be fooled; Small Businesses are no cake walk and are HARD WORK.
But the great reward: “Being in charge of your own destiny!”

WCinWI said:
Most people making over $250,000 are small businesses that file as individuals. Case solved.

Posting a talking point without any evidence to back it up is not quite enough for me to consider it solved.

Not true, most are sub-chapter ‘S’

Been there / done this, do you own a small business and provide jobs for others?

IIWII said:
Do teachers have it easy? No. But if you really, really want to be fair, you have to take the average salary, add ALL the benefits then multiply the money X2 since they only work 6 months of the year by total days

Let’s see, after national vacations, paid holidays, sick days and weekends, you work how many days? Maybe 220-240?

Oh wait, let’s look at the actual hours you work, and deduct your coffee breaks, lunch and the massive amount of time you spend trolling around the internet, making personal calls and texting.

If you are anything like the average American worker http://www.hrmguide.com/performance/wasting-time.htm

“August 27 2007 – The third annual survey of over 2000 employees across all job levels by Salary.com found that over 63 per cent of respondents admitted to wasting time at work and the average amount was 1.7 hours out of a typical 8.5 hour day.”

So to be fair, you work maybe 7.5 months a year, but you waste 20% of that time screwing around. In other words, you work 6 months out of the year, doing what? Something that helps build the future of our country?

Or are you just selling health insurance and profiting off sick and dying people?

It’s funny how when we take your absurd logic and turn it back on you, it doesn’t sound so good, does it?

Now, let’s drop this ridiculous line of argument and get down to reality.

My mother was a teacher. I know how hard it was for her. I also remember her telling me how once in a while some giant teenager would come back to her kindergarten class, give her a hug and thank her for what she did for him as a child.

I sincerely hope that you make the world better by what you do and that people come back to see you after many years to thank you for helping them become successful people.

But your contributions to this discussion only add to the hatred and intolerance of this issue.

Thanks.

WCinWI said:
Well then it was never about the kids anyways.

Seriously. The myths of unions is falling off. I want our education system to change and until you get rid of the political arm, it’s not gonna happen.

Also, I don’t believe in FORCING someone to pay into something that they don’t use. You should have a choice in the matter. If you’re not going to utilize their services, then you shouldn’t have to pay into it. What’s your beef with that? What is your beef with someone earning in essence $100,000?

Maybe I’m just dense, but I’m not sure what you’re asking.

Of course teachers wanting a livable wage that at least tries to be comparable to what they’d get in the private sector and a menu of benefits isn’t “about the kids”. Wanting good teachers and their love for the profession is “about the kids”, but the compensation package and the ability to collectively bargain is more about the teachers.

As for the problems with education, I mentioned in a previous comment that my children were in a parent-run charter before we moved. My wife divided the school’s committees and she was on two, while I was on the rest. The school was parent-run, so we oversaw every aspect of the system from budgeting, hiring, construction, fundraising, enrichment programs, etc.

We don’t have a similar option in our current locale, but the majority of my concerns involve administrative issues, regulation, top-down dictates and the lack of parental involvement, either by the parent’s individual choice or because the system limits their opportunities.

And finally, your last paragraph throws me off a little… I don’t have a problem with teachers making $40k a year before benefits, I think they should earn more and as for your thing about people paying into a system they don’t use, I’m guessing that you mean unions and from what I’ve seen, the Wisconsin teachers seem to be pleased with their representation.

Jon Stewart brings laughter and reason to an argument in Wisconsin that has become dominated by uber-con nonsense. Scott Walker is looking to put a notch in his gun handle, but only succeeding in awakening hard working people across America to the extremes of the Tea Party “revolution.”

^obviously, I meant to say “my wife and I divided”, but the “and I” got lost in the edit.^

ROCKSTEADY said:
Of course this is whats happening.Stop any chance of our youngest Americans not having the right to a good education.keeping the masses of young stupid with no job choices but to go into the military so they can have plenty of pawns to fight and be killed for the name of the good old USA. What will happen when these good old patriotic Americans don’t want to have their government giving vouchers to families for school?keep em dumb and hungry and we can control them…The Republican way.

There is already a disparity in public education in this country that is a dangerous precedent . That doesn’t mean we can solve it by throwing money at it. We need to use our resources responsibly, however, IMO, we need to stress how education is good for the nation as a whole.

WCinWI said:
Most people making over $250,000 are small businesses that file as individuals. Case solved.

Actually, they don’t.

Under 10% of them do according to studies I have read. And it’s a personal choice as to how they elect to file their federal taxes.

http://www.businessweek.com/smallbiz/content/mar2009/sb20090326_784114.htm
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/10269/1090234-28.stm
http://www.cbpp.org/cms/index.cfm?fa=view&id=2697

Magister said:
We don’t have a similar option in our current locale, but the majority of my concerns involve administrative issues, regulation, top-down dictates and the lack of parental involvement, either by the parent’s individual choice or because the system limits their opportunities.

Parental involvement is something we as a society are not as good at as we ought to be. I learned that when two of my very smart kids were having trouble in school. Not because the opportunity didn’t exist, but because the encouragement and involvement at home wasn’t there. My own dam fault, but fortunately we caught it and addressed it.,
My son recently got on the school board in his kids district because he saw some problems that needed to be addressed. I think education is where “It takes a village” really comes in.

avoidswork said:
Actually, they don’t.

Under 10% of them do according to studies I have read. And it’s a personal choice as to how they elect to file their federal taxes.

http://www.businessweek.com/smallbiz/content/mar2009/sb20090326_784114.htm
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/10269/1090234-28.stm
http://www.cbpp.org/cms/index.cfm?fa=view&id=2697

The argument at the time was that small business translated into jobs. A few % points was referred to as job killing. Turns out that’s not true. A very small % of job producing small business would be affected, compared to a huge chunk of income that could address our national debt.

@CosmosDan: I agree, wholeheartedly. When we moved to our previous town, we examined the two options and chose to go with the charter which happened to be entering its second year, so there were more opportunities both due to the school’s system of governance and because it was still new.

Here, we live in a town about four times the size of our previous. We selected the part of town where we purchased our house because of the school district and in our second year, we’re starting to wheedle our way onto the available committees and are doing more volunteering.

THE FACTS: The Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel confirms that’s how much the average Milwaukee teacher will be paid in salary and benefits in 2011: the average MPS teacher would receive total compensation of $101,091 — $59,500 in salary and $41,591 in benefits.

The MAJORITY of Wisconsin taxpayers can only dream of having such luxurious incomes and benefits.

@TeaPartyPatriot: I don’t see a link to the “Journal-Sentinel” article, but Milwaukee is a large city with a competitive labor market and probably a higher cost of living, so they’d have to pay more and offer better benefits to keep better teachers.

gene said:
Just a small point about a small business. They pay for everything, work 18 hour days and 7 days.
Have unreal regulations and paperwork. Usually employ 3 to 5 people whom they pay out of.
the $250,000. Bottom line, some do not $5/hour but are living their American Dream.
BTW, spouses, children usually work for free for the American Dream.
Don’t be fooled; Small Businesses are no cake walk and are HARD WORK.
But the great reward: “Being in charge of your own destiny!”

I agree with you Gene.I also believe EVERYONE has the right to an Education to try and reach that American dream.No matter what financial background you come from.

@TeaPartyPatriot: Here’s a link to BLS’s chart of mean wages in the Milwaukee MSA for all occupations, if you’d like to make comparisons.

BruinAlum77 said:
I sincerely hope that you make the world better by what you do and that people come back to see you after many years to thank you for helping them become successful people.

Very nice.A truly noble public service truly an American thing to do to better the country.Interesting to me the people who “want their America back” would not support educators.Teachers do make a difference in many peoples lives.

TeaPartyPatriot said:
THE FACTS: The Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel confirms that’s how much the average Milwaukee teacher will be paid in salary and benefits in 2011: the average MPS teacher would receive total compensation of $101,091 — $59,500 in salary and $41,591 in benefits.

The MAJORITY of Wisconsin taxpayers can only dream of having such luxurious incomes and benefits.

Maybe if they had stayed in school and paid attention to the teachers, “The MAJORITY of Wisconsin taxpayers” would have been able to get a higher paying job…..

gene said:
Have unreal regulations and paperwork. Usually employ 3 to 5 people whom they pay out of.
the $250,000.

Yeah, I own a small business. When I file a schedule C, I deduct cost of goods sold and whatever I pay for labor to come up with my gross revenue (line 5, schedule C). In addition, I can deduct for all kinds of business related expenses that a person on a regular salary could never do. After all the deductions, I am left with net profit (line 31, Schedule C) which is taxable income and taxed at the corresponding tax rate.

So, I don’t understand where you are coming up with your facts. Please show some proof that eliminating tax cuts for people earning over $250K per year actually means their gross revenues.

TeaPartyPatriot said:
link

It would be nice if you actually read the links you supply. The “average” teacher you’re talking about include postsecondary educators with PhD’s. FYI, these people are called “professors.’

If we look at all the average salaries for all people classified as teachers below college level, and wieght them according to their actual numbers, the average salary for a “teacher” is $43,260.61

If we look at most of the other professions (jobs requiring college education, certification, continuing education, etc.) listed in the link, there is hardly a single professional job with a mean average salary under $60K.

In the pulbic sector, Policemen average over $78K. Firefighters average over $66K. Nurses average over $62K.

So stop these ridiculous attacks against teachers. They are the lowest paid professionals of all our key public servants, but they play a vital role in building the future.

BruinAlum77 said:
So stop these ridiculous attacks against teachers. They are the lowest paid professionals of all our key public servants, but they play a vital role in building the future.

Very well said Bruin.

Here is a page I did on a search for teachers salaries:
http://teacherportal.com/teacher-salaries-by-state
you can see beginning Wisconsin salary at $25,222 and the average is $46,390, you can also see what the others states have.

Now, I was married to a school teacher years ago, he went to college, did the student loans (which we paid off) and began his teaching career to really ‘teach’ the children. He was an awesome teacher….our beginning salary? a little bit over $5,000.00 for all that education and loans to pay back. His parents had to bring us bags of food so we could eat every weekend. We had hardly any furniture, could not even afford to charge on credit cards to pay off. We were young, and the time to start families, which we did.
To have a baby at that time….the charge from the hospital was $360 and the doctor charged $365 for everything…but we had to make payments every month to both of them to pay them off, which we did. Every year we looked forward to the tiny amount that he would get hoping someday that we would be able to make it. I learned how to go pick vegetables from fields, can/freeze/plan ..anything I could do to make ends meet. I made all my clothes and the children’s clothes as much as possible.

My husband also taught some night classes to help make ends meet. We also started a small business on the side in which he worked summers, after school and weekends. This was in a small community in the hills and there were not job opportunities for me and I was committed to being a good mother and wife, running the home etc. Our personal married life suffered greatly (as others do too) as he was never home. I know many here know the feeling of losing your partner and feeling alone, needing adult companionship and bonding.

The amount it went up every year, never did compensate for the rise in electricity/housing/food/cars, and expenses, we were always in the hole it seemed. Comparatively, the starting salaries today, are not much better then what we started at, looking at the inflation and costs of things these days. The housing costs compared to then is astronomical, as you all know!

We even planted gardens, grew a lot of our own food, had chickens etc but it was never luxurious….a vacation?..Ha! He taught summer school as well as working in the small business in the summers. He also was always working at night when he was home on more studies/lessons/grading/learning for his kids. He was an awesome teacher, as many are who dedicate themselves to the kids, to the future for them and for all.
Yes, there is deadwood there, I have never been ‘for’ the tenure thing, as it insulted me that there were teachers getting paid who didn’t deserve it. I would get rid of that one….no one else gets paid for ‘not’ doing their job.

It took a toll on us, our relationship and we finally divorced, which also is probably common, splitting up families, which also takes a toll on the children too. There is much more to say, but my point being, that these days with the costs of things, I wish everyone who works have some kind of bargaining power… We have seen corporations do the most damage to the american worker, more then any union has. (and I agree that the executives of the unions are too powerful and too ‘fat’!)/. We see corporations moving our jobs overseas, not willing to pay american workers decent wages and benefits, so their ‘fat cats’ can get richer and ‘use’ slave labor in other countries. We have seen corporations cut wages, cut hours, hire people part time so they don’t have to pay benefits, thus breaking up families more, so they have to work 2, 3 and more jobs, hurting the whole family units. You want to take on someone, take on the corporations who do this!

I don’t think some people ‘caught’ the satire that Jon Stewart was making…..that ‘we’ have bailed out the biggies and their contracts keep them getting the bonuses and big salaries….and compared to what the teachers are getting, that is really insane.

I am not even sure where they get those figures on the ‘benefits’…..basic health and dental??….the states do not pay that much I don’t think, as they get package deals. Most teachers are not only working at night on their school work, but on weekends and in summers ….many times going to conferences and studying to keep up with the latest for their students……and guess what folks, the teachers have two options, they can divide their yearly salary up into 12 months, which makes each month slimmer, or have it for 9 months and then have to work at something else to create income. If someone is starting out at $25,000.00 or there abouts, that is about $2,000.00+or – a month, and I know some people on unemployment make more then that and …guess what, they also get medical, etc care, which the taxpayer is paying for. Lay off teachers? Fire them? Makes no sense at all. Do that and they are not ‘putting’ into the system with their labor/love/teaching for ‘your’ children, but they will be taking ‘out ‘ of the system with unemployment, etc. That is a lose-lose situation, not to even add on the burden to the kids and the other teachers, trying to handle bigger loads.

You want our government to actually do something with the budgets that help Americans, then dang it all, lets cut the military spending, the research to build bigger bombs to kill more people, the secret programs that we don’t even know about. NASA just lost a $424,000,000 satellite……that is our money folks!…down the drain. Did we need this??……or did your children need college education, or some jobs, or dental care? ….we need red item veto ability on the government budgets …..guess what ….they don’t even let us know what they are doing.
Oh by the way, check out CAFR…..our federal govt and state governments, etc have funds that they have gotten from ‘investing’ your money, and get back in interest, and don’t even include it in the budgets as income. They use it for their own ….’or someone’s interests’ ……not for our own projects.

This whole thing is another thing to divide up the people, put us one against the other, so we can’t see the forest for the trees.

Remember, a nation divided…..cannot stand…….and ‘they’ are doing a good job of it aren’t they?

katrina said:
Remember, a nation divided…..cannot stand…….and ‘they’ are doing a good job of it aren’t they?

Exactly. Get the working class to fight among themselves and twist the knife while they’re not looking.

IIWII said:
It is math. 185 scheduled school days. That is 6 months… and a few days.

don’t forget the administrative staff, they work all year..

Color Me Badd said:
Thank you for the invaluable link to Champion News. This is maybe the funniest teabag website I have seen thus far and there is strong competition. Do they call themselves Champion News because it’s sort of like the Special Olympics where everyone is a champion?

Ahh, the liberals are so predictable. They ignore the information and just start to whine.

Here are the facts I mentioned: In Illinois, the taxpayers owe the top 100 Teacher’s Administrators in Illinois for pensions OVER $885 MILLION DOLLARS.

Remember, I’m talking about the top 100 paid administrators – just 100 people.

Over $885 MILLION DOLLARS.

WE CAN’T AFFORD IT. Can you liberals see this? For everyone who clicks, thumbs down, tell us how we’re going to pay for all of this????

the real john t said:
The average salary for teachers in WI is a little above $46,000. The starting pay is a little more than $25,000.

http://teacherportal.com/salary/Wisconsin-teacher-salary

The starting pay is meaningless when it keeps going up. The unions purposely keep the starting pay low for various reasons, but one of them is so they can always say that teachers make so little.

Well, boo hoo, the monies that have to be spent are much greater and we can’t afford it. Why is it so hard for liberals to understand budgeting?

Socialist said:
don’t forget the administrative staff, they work all year..

No, you mean they get paid all year. Thanks.

BruinAlum77 said:
$43,260.61

$43,260.61 is equal to over $57,000 for 12 months.

Also, the benefits are huge. In Milwaukee it all tops a $100,000 per year – and this is for NINE months. Annualized, it’s $133,000. Not too shabby.

IIWII said:
Nice points for contention. A few points of missed truth:
1. Student teachers do not usually get paid at all. Nothing. Student teachers do their student teaching as part of the college requirement.
2. They forgot to add the retirement payments tax payers pay into teacher funds. The retirement payment is also a benefit.
3. It is NOT 9 months of work for a teacher. It is 6 months. Most school districts that do not do year round education have a school schedule of 185 days. That carries over for a nine month period but actually only equals (do the math, 30 days avg. per month divided into 185 days of scheduled school) 6 months.
Do teachers have it easy? No. But if you really, really want to be fair, you have to take the average salary, add ALL the benefits then multiply the money X2 since they only work 6 months of the year by total days. Suddenly the 85K turns into 170K… and many, many, many teachers have a second job on weekends and in the summer. If teachers really want to get mad they should find the person who made them go into the teaching profession and hold that person accountable.
Just saying…

Single dumbest person to have ever lived.

You Righties are so fun to watch how you live your lives like your playing Whac-A-Mole.

A bunch of drooling half-wits waiting for your Corporate Overlords telling you what the next ‘problem’ is so you can ‘Whac’ it.

Gooble Gobble!!! HAHAHAHAHA!!!!

Typically the higher wages are paid to top administrators, often people with 25 plus years of service who work year round. It matters greatly to those who recieve say $25,000 as a starting salary because that figure is below the poverty line and what they have to live in some times for years. Most teachers I know personally and are related to work second jobs and try to teach summer school to make ends meet. My sons Asst. baseball coach worked nights in a pizza restaurant for years as his wife was raising their 6 kids. He died last year at the age of 43 and all every one said at his funeral was how hard he worked. Your right though these teachers got it much too cushy.
Just this past November, “The experts” at Fox news were busy telling us that $250,000 per year did not make you rich. Oddly, today all these same so called “experts” at Fox are now telling us that 50 to 100 thousand per year is too much. Which is you degenerate morons, which is it?

Alz said:
$43,260.61 is equal to over $57,000 for 12 months.

Also, the benefits are huge. In Milwaukee it all tops a $100,000 per year – and this is for NINE months. Annualized, it’s $133,000. Not too shabby.

As usual, you show no evidence for your claim. Also, according to the original agreements made with the public sector unions, they agreed to lower wages in exchange for stability and benefits. If teachers agreed to lower salaries in exchange for their health and retirement benefits, they are paying for their benefits.

BTW, is it just teachers that you want to abuse, or do you feel the same way about the police and fire fighters?

Alz said:
$43,260.61 is equal to over $57,000 for 12 months.

Also, the benefits are huge. In Milwaukee it all tops a $100,000 per year – and this is for NINE months. Annualized, it’s $133,000. Not too shabby.

The bullshit level is getting pretty high in this comment section.

Alz said:
Ahh, the liberals are so predictable. They ignore the information and just start to whine.

Here are the facts I mentioned: In Illinois, the taxpayers owe the top 100 Teacher’s Administrators in Illinois for pensions OVER $885 MILLION DOLLARS.

Remember, I’m talking about the top 100 paid administrators – just 100 people.

Over $885 MILLION DOLLARS.

WE CAN’T AFFORD IT. Can you liberals see this? For everyone who clicks, thumbs down, tell us how we’re going to pay for all of this????

You are saying that 100 people are getting 8.8 million dollars each?

What flat earth website did you read that on?

Jon Steward shows up these media celebrities, they are not news professionals, to be duplicitous double talking jackasses.

Sheer brilliance Jon. Bravo.

kvon said:
You are saying that 100 people are getting 8.8 million dollars each?

What flat earth website did you read that on?

That’s HILARIOUS!!!

These Whac-a-Mole Wacko Righties actually believe so much stuff blindly.

Look at how much this guy typed up and never thought to do some simple math.

You showed him he is a COMPLETE TOOL with ONE SENTENCE!!!

HAHAHAHAHHAH!

BruinAlum77 said:
As usual, you show no evidence for your claim. Also, according to the original agreements made with the public sector unions, they agreed to lower wages in exchange for stability and benefits. If teachers agreed to lower salaries in exchange for their health and retirement benefits, they are paying for their benefits.

BTW, is it just teachers that you want to abuse, or do you feel the same way about the police and fire fighters?

- $43,260.61 * 12/9 = $57,680. 9 months is generous too as some schools districts are working less than that.
- Many teachers take other jobs in the summers too. Others vacation.

- then add in the benefits.

WE CAN’T AFFORD IT. Who is going to pay for the $885 MILLION that Illinois taxpayers owe 100 administrators????

You lefty’s are delusional: THERE IS NO MORE MONEY.

kvon said:
You are saying that 100 people are getting 8.8 million dollars each?

What flat earth website did you read that on?

It’s the pension cost assuming that live to their actuarial age. Here it is with a list of NAMES:
http://www.championnews.net/article.php?sid=1023

Before you lefty’s whine, 1) look at the numbers and 2) tel us how we can afford all of this?

This is why starting salary is just a diversion. Quit trying to fool people.

the real john t said:
Well why aren’t you still in teaching since you had it so great?

Who said I am NOT teaching???????? Dang them!!!! Check my profile…….. and stop assuming.

Whew…sure am glad I’m not being distracted with the typical liberal bogus complaints like corporate hand out witch hunts, no universal health care, or the demolished state of our economy. (boo hoo!) Now…Overpaid Wisconsin Teachers, there’s an issue that warrants our immediate attention and criticism. Damn them uppity, cheese eating, learned, greedy folk!!

Alz said:
– $43,260.61 * 12/9 = $57,680. 9 months is generous too as some schools districts are working less than that.
- Many teachers take other jobs in the summers too. Others vacation.

- then add in the benefits.

WE CAN’T AFFORD IT. Who is going to pay for the $885 MILLION that Illinois taxpayers owe 100 administrators????

You lefty’s are delusional: THERE IS NO MORE MONEY.

Let me get this straight. You are trying to say that a teachers YEARLY salary of $43,260.61 of what they actually get paid. Then claim because they only work 9 months you try to multiply that by 12/9??? SO your saying they should get paid $57,680?? Just making sure you know that the $43K is paid over the year not what they work. 40K plus benefits for a COLLEGE DEGREE job is not very good my friend. Most of my friends that have college degrees are well above 50K with some benefits. Oh and the crazy part is they almost have an endless ceiling of pay raises they could receive if they move up. Teachers max out after a little while, somewhere near $60K.

Are you sick of highly paid teachers?

Teachers’ hefty salaries are driving up taxes, and they only work 9 or10 months a year! It’s time we put things in perspective and pay them for what they do – babysit!

We can get that for less than minimum wage.

That’s right. Let’s give them $3.00 an hour and only the hours they worked; not any of that silly planning time, or any time they spend before or after school. That would be $19.50 a day (7:45 to 3:00 PM with 45 min. off for lunch and plan– that equals 6 1/2 hours).

Each parent should pay $19.50 a day for these teachers to baby-sit their children. Now how many students do they teach in a day…maybe 30? So that’s $19.50 x 30 = $585.00 a day.

However, remember they only work 180 days a year!!! I am not going to pay them for any vacations.

LET’S SEE….

That’s $585 X 180= $105,300

per year. (Hold on! My calculator needs new batteries).

What about those special

education teachers and the ones with Master’s degrees? Well, we could pay them minimum wage ($7.75), and just to be fair, round it off to $8.00 an

hour. That would be $8 X 6 1/2 hours X 30 children X 180 days = $280,800 per year.

Wait a minute — there’s

something wrong here! There sure is!

The average teacher’s salary

(nation wide) is $50,000. $50,000/180 days

= $277.77/per day/30

students=$9.25/6.5 hours = $1.42 per hour per student–a very inexpensive baby-sitter and they even EDUCATE your kids!) WHAT A DEAL!!!!

Kurt Bangle said:
Let me get this straight. You are trying to say that a teachers YEARLY salary of $43,260.61 of what they actually get paid.

I work a full year; they do not. Duh.

Many teachers have second jobs over their long break. So when comparing compensation, the salary portion should be accounted for over the school year.

Most people work full years.

Kurt Bangle said:
Are you sick of highly paid teachers?

Teachers’ hefty salaries are driving up taxes, and they only work 9 or10 months a year! It’s time we put things in perspective and pay them for what they do – babysit!

We can get that for less than minimum wage.

That’s right. Let’s give them $3.00 an hour and only the hours they worked; not any of that silly planning time, or any time they spend before or after school. That would be $19.50 a day (7:45 to 3:00 PM with 45 min. off for lunch and plan– that equals 6 1/2 hours).

Each parent should pay $19.50 a day for these teachers to baby-sit their children. Now how many students do they teach in a day…maybe 30? So that’s $19.50 x 30 = $585.00 a day.

However, remember they only work 180 days a year!!! I am not going to pay them for any vacations.

LET’S SEE….

That’s $585 X 180= $105,300

per year. (Hold on! My calculator needs new batteries).

What about those special

education teachers and the ones with Master’s degrees? Well, we could pay them minimum wage ($7.75), and just to be fair, round it off to $8.00 an

hour. That would be $8 X 6 1/2 hours X 30 children X 180 days = $280,800 per year.

Wait a minute — there’s

something wrong here! There sure is!

The average teacher’s salary

(nation wide) is $50,000. $50,000/180 days

= $277.77/per day/30

students=$9.25/6.5 hours = $1.42 per hour per student–a very inexpensive baby-sitter and they even EDUCATE your kids!) WHAT A DEAL!!!!

You probably shouldn’t claim that they “educate” our kids. In Wisconsin, two-thirds of 8th graders can’t read proficiently: http://www.educationnews.org/ednews_today/108287.html

the numbers are dismal over the whole country too for public schools. As you would expect, everywhere that the schools are controlled by liberals, the results are not good.

damien said:
So, you’re a crap teacher, or would be, if you’re just being facicious. Fair enough, but do you really think all teachers should be striped of their bargaining rights just because you’re a lazy slob. To be far, almost all of the clips Stewart showed are from Fox Business rather than Fox News, and from what I gather (as I said in a comment on an earlier article) I don’t watch network news) Fox Business has taken a rather more Libertarian rather than conservative bent, and as such might be expected to take a more anti-public worker approach. I’m not saying that makes it right, but I think you should be clearer about what you’re attacking.

“striped”??????? Striped????? Did ya mean stripped???? And well….. I am a teacher… and I do very well in my position.,. thank you.

Alz said:
I work a full year; they do not. Duh.

Many teachers have second jobs over their long break. So when comparing compensation, the salary portion should be accounted for over the school year.

Most people work full years.

You don’t understand my point. Your equation was taking 43K and saying its only for 9 months. I get a pay check of 33K as a teacher and that is for a full year. Yes, I do have 3 months break. I have 3 degrees. I drive a used car. I rent a place to live. So I and my co-workers are terrible blood sucking tax wholes.. My day doesn’t end when school gets out nor does it start when the bell rings. And just because there is no school in the summer doesn’t mean we aren’t working to improve our classroom, go over notes. Order new textbooks, read through them and make our plans for the entire year. I don’t know of a single teacher who lives in the upper end of town, drives the best cars, or take the best vacations.

What should we get paid is my last question?

Zoezoezoe said:
IIWI, you sound like a bitter, fired teacher. My husband is a teacher, and he works at least 60 hours a week. There’s the 6 hours he’s actually teaching, the hour of prep time (which, for real teachers, is not used to “get caught up on world events or read breaking news”, for god’s sake; he counsels students, and PREPS for his classes). Then he comes home and has 4 hours of correcting and lesson plans. So, let’s see, that’s about 10 hours a day, or 50 hours a week. On the weekends he typically spends 4-6 hours creating lesson plans and correcting homework. Add another 10 hours a week. 60 hours a week for nine months is 48 hours a week. Far more than you slackers who work for private industry. And you are completely wrong about tenure (gee, what a surprise). All it means is that there must be a REASON to fire you, not because you walked into the building wearing a yellow shirt and your boss hates yellow. Which, for you people who don’t understand capitalism, is perfectly legal in any right-to-work state. And did you fail math or something in third grade? A working month is NOT 30 days long. It is 22 days, because of somethings called WEEKENDS. Which were brought to you by unions. Sheesh. How did you miss that? Private school education?

Wrong and wrong again. I am not bitter and I am not a fired teacher. Read my profile… then try again to make your positon rational.

It all boils down to the reactionaries willingness to beat up on teachers and unions in general while not willing to raise taxes on the rich. This is rich hypocrisy and immorality which will eventually do in most of the rightwingers who don’t get it. You are the zombies.

Alz said:
You probably shouldn’t claim that they “educate” our kids. In Wisconsin, two-thirds of 8th graders can’t read proficiently: http://www.educationnews.org/ednews_today/108287.html

the numbers are dismal over the whole country too for public schools. As you would expect, everywhere that the schools are controlled by liberals, the results are not good.

I am a Republican and I do agree that Unions had their time and place. But our education of our students hasn’t change over the last 100 years. What has happened has been parents have become disconnected from their children. Students come to school and go home without their parents taking interest. Parent-Teacher conferences are a joke, parents no longer come. You can see the correlation between parents that come to the school, talk to their teachers and their students ability to read, write, comprehend, analyze and so on against the parents that show no interest or concern for their child’s education. This is the SAME teacher that has other students pass their tests. So then the teachers must be singling out the good ones and not teaching to others..

Alz said:
You probably shouldn’t claim that they “educate” our kids. In Wisconsin, two-thirds of 8th graders can’t read proficiently: http://www.educationnews.org/ednews_today/108287.html

the numbers are dismal over the whole country too for public schools. As you would expect, everywhere that the schools are controlled by liberals, the results are not good.

Also so you know. Depending on which subject you teach, you will see a student 5-10 hours a WEEK, MAYBE. Parents are with their kids anywhere from 4-6 hours a DAY during the week. How much time does most of those parents spend with their child working on homework?

Kurt Bangle said:
You don’t understand my point. Your equation was taking 43K and saying its only for 9 months. I get a pay check of 33K as a teacher and that is for a full year. Yes, I do have 3 months break. I have 3 degrees. I drive a used car. I rent a place to live. So I and my co-workers are terrible blood sucking tax wholes.. My day doesn’t end when school gets out nor does it start when the bell rings. And just because there is no school in the summer doesn’t mean we aren’t working to improve our classroom, go over notes. Order new textbooks, read through them and make our plans for the entire year. I don’t know of a single teacher who lives in the upper end of town, drives the best cars, or take the best vacations.

What should we get paid is my last question?

Look, it’s for nine months of work. My pay is for twelve months and I can’t squeeze in and extra three months of work with another job.

The issue is not the base salaries but the entire system. People are having to sacrifice and many teachers and administrators seem to have very cozy deals. Not all teachers. Not all administrators. But many and people are tired of it. We can’t afford some of these deals. Why is it so hard for you to get it. Open your mind.

As for what should teachers get paid, the answer is what the market will bear. It’s the only way for the entire system to work for the longest period of time and for the most people. It’s not hard to understand.

kvon said:
Single dumbest person to have ever lived.

Yeah… and I can also make simple comments;
1. Mustache equal to Dali… nice try.
2. Avatar uniquely simple and lacking imagination.
3. KVON…??? Keven?(male) KVON(h)…female? Uncertain of gender????
Any person capable of placing a hat on a monkey can set a comment on line… not many people can actually make their comments sane……
Nice try…. you have palced a hat on a monkey…… No support, no example… KVON….. what the hell does that mean?????

Kurt Bangle said:
Also so you know. Depending on which subject you teach, you will see a student 5-10 hours a WEEK, MAYBE. Parents are with their kids anywhere from 4-6 hours a DAY during the week. How much time does most of those parents spend with their child working on homework?

(Check your grammar!)

I agree about the parents. What do you expect? Society has been teaching people that all behaviors are “equal”, that one should “just do it”, that many people are victims, etc. Like it or not, this liberal thinking has consequence – unfortunately for society, most of these consequences are negative. I had this very conversation with a Chicago Public School teacher yesterday and she agreed for the most part.

You may not believe it but I have nothing against teachers. I had some great ones …and I like to teach people.. What I don’t like are some of the deals and the public sector unions. What kind of system allows the employees to help choose who they are going to be negotiating with?

*placed*… dang typos…..

Alz said:
Look, it’s for nine months of work. My pay is for twelve months and I can’t squeeze in and extra three months of work with another job.

The issue is not the base salaries but the entire system. People are having to sacrifice and many teachers and administrators seem to have very cozy deals. Not all teachers. Not all administrators. But many and people are tired of it. We can’t afford some of these deals. Why is it so hard for you to get it. Open your mind.

As for what should teachers get paid, the answer is what the market will bear. It’s the only way for the entire system to work for the longest period of time and for the most people. It’s not hard to understand.

In the Chicago area, I knew some teachers that had a roofing business for the summer and someone else had a landscaping business. It’s three months off and it’s your choice what you do with the time.

The rest of us see a three month vacation.

Kurt Bangle said:
I am a Republican and I do agree that Unions had their time and place. But our education of our students hasn’t change over the last 100 years. What has happened has been parents have become disconnected from their children. Students come to school and go home without their parents taking interest. Parent-Teacher conferences are a joke, parents no longer come. You can see the correlation between parents that come to the school, talk to their teachers and their students ability to read, write, comprehend, analyze and so on against the parents that show no interest or concern for their child’s education. This is the SAME teacher that has other students pass their tests. So then the teachers must be singling out the good ones and not teaching to others..

The parent issue has a huge societal component. Curricula are designed to separate the child from the parents. The public school system is viewed by liberals as an extension of government and as a way to indoctrinate kids.

Everything is all interconnected. I’m not saying that parents aren’t at fault, but really that the system is designed to pull kids away from parental teachings. We blame the parents, but the system screwed up the parents.

Kurt Bangle said:
You don’t understand my point. Your equation was taking 43K and saying its only for 9 months. I get a pay check of 33K as a teacher and that is for a full year. Yes, I do have 3 months break. I have 3 degrees. I drive a used car. I rent a place to live. So I and my co-workers are terrible blood sucking tax wholes.. My day doesn’t end when school gets out nor does it start when the bell rings. And just because there is no school in the summer doesn’t mean we aren’t working to improve our classroom, go over notes. Order new textbooks, read through them and make our plans for the entire year. I don’t know of a single teacher who lives in the upper end of town, drives the best cars, or take the best vacations.

What should we get paid is my last question?

BTW, I appreciate your civil tone and I am “listening” to your points.

right-is-wrong said:
Should we do the math to determine the average workers salary if they worked 30 days per month, or can we just say you are an idiot

Your comment makes no sense….. re-phrase with a bit of clarity… me and mine have no idea what you are trying to say. OH!, just saying…. “Me and mine” and three teachers in the public school system…

BFD said:
So will you now compare a teachers salary to other career salaries after you subtract weekend, vacations and holidays from them? I can’t wait for that!

Subtract weekend, vactions and holidays…. you just made my point!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Take weekend, vacations and holidays…..(give them to teachers) [days off]] and teachers have a lfe of luxury!!!!! THANK YOU!!!!!!! You have not only supported but justified the lack of teachers’ demands!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Thank you, thank you, thank you!!!!!

And they work 9 months out of the year with plenty of days off during that 9 months, they cannot be fired–no matter how lousy they are at teaching–and their salaries and benefits are paid by people who have just as many–or MORE skills–but earn less. Go figure.

Teacher enjoys long holidays. Believe It Or Not, A School Runs In Graveyard.

http://funnyandspicy.com/believe-it-or-not-a-school-runs-in-graveyard

Alz said:
BTW, I appreciate your civil tone and I am “listening” to your points.

I appreciate your civil comments as well. I agree with many things you say. My side of the situation may be different than what you are experiencing. I live in a some what of a non-liberal state. Most all educators here (my family has 5) make around the same. The people I work with do go out and work summers, many of which do because their pay is too low. They have kids and other bills that unfortunately the 9 months of work doesn’t pay for. The ones that I know of that don’t work in the summers will either go and take college classes to improve their education or work towards a masters. I know teachers that are getting a Masters degree and just clear 50k! Thats a lot of education and work for that salary, probably the lowest Masters degree profession. I do understand and believe that we have create a huge problem in our country with Unions and locking prices in that don’t fit. My issue is that I don’t believe that there are many teachers that are living a cozy lifestyle or getting more than the market for their job. There will need to be major changes to how things are done with our government and budgets to get things worked out. I’m just not sure how much chopping needs to be done in our education system if we are trying to raise scores and lower costs. Cutting costs for a degreed profession will eventually force the smart people into better paying jobs. I know because I had several offers but liked working with students.

Besides all this governmental non-sense I see our problems in our country as the private-sector unions. They are the ones that have forced good jobs overseas. The US has lost its base working class jobs and has forced our country to become a “service” nation. We cannot survive without manufacturing jobs. The next administration needs to focus on three points: FIX THE BUDGET, BRING BACK JOBS, and RECREATE USA PRIDE.

I’m not arguing with teacher pay in general, only that a PE teacher should not be paid as much as a math/science teacher. I don’t know ANY PE teacher who goes home, grades papers, orders books, etc. It is rediculous that the PE teacher gets paid the same. For that matter, a PE teacher shouldn’t even need a 4+ year college degree. Put our money where it makes the most difference.

As a former teacher, I do agree with the Republicans! Let’s privatize education. You will now have to hire your own children’s teacher just like you do your doctor. You will pay her whatever she demands just like your doctor.
If you think she is too expensive you can find another one or homeschool your own d@mn brats!!!!

The word is spelled “facetious.” Perhaps you should have paid attention in school.

Teachers only have two months off in summer, not three, and they work 10 to 12-hour days and weekends. They CAN be fired. Lunch hour? There is no such thing for a teacher. And if you think teachers live a life of luxury, try being one. You’ll change your tune in a hurry.

Do you know any teachers who went into teaching for the money? People go into BANKING for the money.

Teachers, firefighters, and policemen are not responsible for the world’s financial mess. Wall Street is responsible, but it’s pointing the finger at public servants to draw attention away from itself. Public servants are also taxpayers, by the way. FOX says “taxpayers” like teachers don’t pay taxes.

Unions are not to blame for the loss of manufacturing jobs to third-world countries. The Republican Plan: 1) Send manufacturing jobs to countries that neither pay nor protect their workers well, like China and the Ivory Coast. 2) Convince the American public of the inferiority of its schools, and cripple those schools at every opportunity, so that each successive generation of middle- and lower-class students will be less well-educated; always blame the teachers for this. Send Republican kids to private schools and figure out how to get the taxpayer to foot the bill – with vouchers! 3) Convince the American people that it’s the unions’ fault our economy tanked, and that companies have to send jobs overseas to be “competitive.” (Don’t mention that if corporations paid foreign workers fair wages and had workplace protections, American products would be “competitive.”) 4) Convince the American people that Republicans will bring jobs back to America, and that getting rid of labor unions and collective bargaining is necessary to accomplish this. 5) If this plan is successful, the cost of overseas shipping will be eliminated, factories newly returned to America will be humming, and we will have manufacturing jobs in America once again — this time, without any pesky labor laws, weekends, sick days, paid holidays, public education of any sort, OSHA, or EPA. Republicans will eliminate all of that, because it costs “the taxpayer” (them) too much money, and because those things are “job killers.” They will be the beneficiaries of a new slavery class, borne of their long-term plan to eliminate the middle class and all other impediments to their ultimate wealth. 6) REPUBLICAN (CORPORATE TOOL) GOAL: There will be haves and have-nots. The middle class will be decimated – powerless, weak, poor, and too fat and stupid to do anything about it.

It is a FACT that the divide between rich and poor is widening, and that is not the fault of the “greedy” or “lazy” American worker nor of the unions. America needs MORE UNIONS, and needs to foster them in third-world nations, so that all workers everywhere have decent pay and living conditions. This is neither a communist nor socialist idea. It’s an American idea – we invented the labor union. If you want to keep celebrating Labor Day, quit pointing fingers at unions, union workers, and particularly public workers, all of whom are also TAXPAYERS. Expend your energy on being part of the solution.

Adding a dollar value to benefits and then adding that on top of the annual salary is a gimmick states use in order to make teachers salaries appear bigger than what they are. Imagine if all businesses did that, everyone else would be making a lot more. When you do your taxes you do not add the value of benefits as salary.
Teachers often work extra hours and those hours are unpaid. Add up all those hours and they work more than 9 months. Teachers often have overcrowded classrooms, in some states, over the inflow of illegal immigrants who still do not speak English so many teachers have to develop extra skills – on their own – to handle non-English speaking children.
In Utah, for example, teachers make very low wages but the state plays the same game adding benefits and claiming higher salaries. Many teachers are losing their homes, short-selling and going bankrupt especially when a spouse loses his or her job. Most teachers in Utah do not start at $50K per year. To get to that level – which includes benefits – teachers have to put 20+ years!!! So, in Utah, $50K per year actually means about $40K all while cost of living continues to grow, property taxes are high, gas and groceries are high and most teachers drive old cars, live in modest homes in modest neighborhoods and many can’t even afford dental insurance. Classes are overcrowded. Yet, superintendents and people in the Board of Education make big salaries, one of them was making over $236,000 per year plus bonuses and perks.

States pay teachers enough to survive but not enough to succeed. Eventually, all good teachers will retire, people will not want to become teachers because they will barely make ends meet even with one or two college degrees and they will use their talents elsewhere, thus leaving school systems with substandard teachers or teachers who will quit after the 1st or 2nd year.

Anyone thinking that teachers make a lot of money and who is employed and has a college degree, ought to spend a year teaching Middle or High School in a challenging area. I think only then they will know what’s like to deal with the problems and what it takes to live on teacher’s salary.

Kurt Bangle said:
I appreciate your civil comments as well. I agree with many things you say. My side of the situation may be different than what you are experiencing. I live in a some what of a non-liberal state. Most all educators here (my family has 5) make around the same. The people I work with do go out and work summers, many of which do because their pay is too low. They have kids and other bills that unfortunately the 9 months of work doesn’t pay for. The ones that I know of that don’t work in the summers will either go and take college classes to improve their education or work towards a masters. I know teachers that are getting a Masters degree and just clear 50k! Thats a lot of education and work for that salary, probably the lowest Masters degree profession. I do understand and believe that we have create a huge problem in our country with Unions and locking prices in that don’t fit. My issue is that I don’t believe that there are many teachers that are living a cozy lifestyle or getting more than the market for their job. There will need to be major changes to how things are done with our government and budgets to get things worked out. I’m just not sure how much chopping needs to be done in our education system if we are trying to raise scores and lower costs. Cutting costs for a degreed profession will eventually force the smart people into better paying jobs. I know because I had several offers but liked working with students.

Besides all this governmental non-sense I see our problems in our country as the private-sector unions. They are the ones that have forced good jobs overseas. The US has lost its base working class jobs and has forced our country to become a “service” nation. We cannot survive without manufacturing jobs. The next administration needs to focus on three points: FIX THE BUDGET, BRING BACK JOBS, and RECREATE USA PRIDE.

With all due respect…how do you propose “bringing back” manufacturing jobs, when corporations are flocking overseas to places like China where:

“In 2007, factories that supplied more than a dozen corporations, including Wal-Mart, Disney and Dell, were accused of unfair labor practices, including using child labor, forcing employees to work 16-hour days on fast-moving assembly lines, and paying workers less than minimum wage. (Minimum wage in this part of China is about 55 cents an hour.)”
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/01/05/business/worldbusiness/05sweatshop.html

NOW, if you suggested TARIFFS, DUTIES and PROTECTIONISM put in place, like the kinds Ronald Reagan did, that penalized American Companies for outsourcing, you would have a point. In fact, Congress should legislate a bill that would punish American Companies who outsource….

Wait…they already tried–

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/anti-outsourcing-bill-fails-senate-test-vote-2010-09-28-1255330

–Cobra

I simply challenge anyone of you teacher bashers to come and TRY to do my job for one month. If you survive, I will gladly hand over my “luxurious” paycheck to you with no questions asked.

When, WHEN, you fail and crawl away crying that you cannot handle the work load….you simply shut up and go away.

Any takers?

Cobra said:
With all due respect…how do you propose “bringing back” manufacturing jobs, when corporations are flocking overseas to places like China where:

“In 2007, factories that supplied more than a dozen corporations, including Wal-Mart, Disney and Dell, were accused of unfair labor practices, including using child labor, forcing employees to work 16-hour days on fast-moving assembly lines, and paying workers less than minimum wage. (Minimum wage in this part of China is about 55 cents an hour.)”
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/01/05/business/worldbusiness/05sweatshop.html

NOW, if you suggested TARIFFS, DUTIES and PROTECTIONISM put in place, like the kinds Ronald Reagan did, that penalized American Companies for outsourcing, you would have a point. In fact, Congress should legislate a bill that would punish American Companies who outsource….

Wait…they already tried–

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/anti-outsourcing-bill-fails-senate-test-vote-2010-09-28-1255330

–Cobra

The liberals are making the country less attractive to invest in. This didn’t start with Obama, but it goes back many decades. Unions issues, high taxes, BS EPS regs, etc did it.

Plus, the rest of the world is not sitting still. They want investment and they want success. Liberals don’t like success so people and money are fleeing.

Look at the effects of many decades of liberalism on Detroit: 16 pictures: http://www.guardian.co.uk/artanddesign/gallery/2011/jan/02/photography-detroit#/?picture=370173054&index=0

Once the teachers unions are eviscerated who will be next let’s see…how about the sanitation workers union and then we can go after the airline mechanic’s union and on and on. So then the people will be stupid for lack of quality education but capable of picking up garbage and airplane parts from all the crashes that will result from substandard maintenance…

We need to get a grip on all these exorbitant income and benefits of course we should start with the lowest common denominator. The ones that are just making it in this society of ours or trying to get a little ahead that’s who we should go after. While we are at it let’s make sure they can’t complain and get rid of that collective bargaining nuisance.

Really why should we go after anyone making over 100k per year? After all they earned it with hard work and shouldn’t be expected to make any sacrifices. They need it to get their massages and manicures, and you can’t expect them to shop at Walmat with all those overpaid people that shop there.

We sure have gotten our priorities lined up right don’t we? Yeah right!

OBVIOUS WE BE DIVIDED; AS ALWAYS BLINDED BY OUR LEFT vs RIGHT VIEW.
HOW ABOUT A NEW APPROACH? SINCE PSS IS NOT WORKING; how about:

Utilizing the ‘BEST’ Teachers via a centralized national closed circuit broadcast?
Then one would only need babysitters to monitor each classroom
Move unruly students to a strictly structered venue

The VAST COST SAVINGS and ADVANTAGES are Enormous!
“JUST a THOUGHT”

gene said:
OBVIOUS WE BE DIVIDED; AS ALWAYS BLINDED BY OUR LEFT vs RIGHT VIEW.
HOW ABOUT A NEW APPROACH? SINCE PSS IS NOT WORKING; how about:

Utilizing the ‘BEST’ Teachers via a centralized national closed circuit broadcast?
Then one would only need babysitters to monitor each classroom
Move unruly students to a strictly structered venue

The VAST COST SAVINGS and ADVANTAGES are Enormous!
“JUST a THOUGHT”

When you typed that out did you really think about it? Did you honestly think that was a good plan and a good idea? If so then this is what is wrong with our country.

What advantages would this offer? I see only disadvantages.

Rockycomet said:
Once the teachers unions are eviscerated who will be next let’s see…how about the sanitation workers union and then we can go after the airline mechanic’s union and on and on. So then the people will be stupid for lack of quality education but capable of picking up garbage and airplane parts from all the crashes that will result from substandard maintenance…

We need to get a grip on all these exorbitant income and benefits of course we should start with the lowest common denominator. The ones that are just making it in this society of ours or trying to get a little ahead that’s who we should go after. While we are at it let’s make sure they can’t complain and get rid of that collective bargaining nuisance.

Really why should we go after anyone making over 100k per year? After all they earned it with hard work and shouldn’t be expected to make any sacrifices. They need it to get their massages and manicures, and you can’t expect them to shop at Walmat with all those overpaid people that shop there.

We sure have gotten our priorities lined up right don’t we? Yeah right!

I thought liberals wanted the minimum wage to be something like $100,000 per year!

The problem with unions is they circumvent the market beyond what is reasonable. Pubic sector unions should just plain go. It’s a terrible system where the employees can have a big say in who they are going to negotiate with. Most people get screwed because too much money and benefits are promised – as we all can see.

How is this fair: In Illinois we owe the 100 top administrators over $885 million in pensions. Yes just 100 people. The math cannot work. (See http://www.championnews.net/article.php?sid=1023 There are names listed too.)

Liberalism is unsustainable.

I believe, in all fairness to the citizens of America, we should list the gross income amount reported to the IRS each year by every tax payer in America and place it on a special register or chart allowing it to be viewed on the internet. This way, no one can sway another with miss-information or rhetoric trying to obtain special advantages while in negotiations or communication in the Senate or House of Representatives. This would also be very accurate information for State, County and Cities to deal fairly with one another and people hired to work for these Government agencies. Anyone who is against this idea could possibly feel it would prevent him from using miss-information or rhetoric to gain unfair advantage for him and/or his colleagues. This would be transparencies at its best.
The best non-personal way of handling the above suggestion would be to list, on a register or chart to be posted on the internet all incomes between 0 to $50,000.00 annually, how many incomes are between $50,000.00 and $100,000.00, how many incomes are between $100,000.00 and $250,000.00, how many incomes are between $250,000.00 and $500,000.00, how many incomes are between $500,000.00 and $2,000.000.00, how many incomes are between 2,000,000.00 and $1,000,000,000.00. Plus how many are above $1,000,000,000.00 annually. This information could be beneficial for many small businesses since many of them are catering to various clienteles in need of merchandise that they may offer. Governments are a business and would benefit also, College students could set their sights on where they want to be in the future. Many benefits are here but may scare those set in their ways.
Besides posting the annual amounts, we could post the trade or position held in each category.
People are more reasonable when true facts are presented.

Alz -Well in Love & War-You seem to be bent on making it a lib/con issue when in reality it’s a matter of sustainability of a quality American living standard regardless of your political views. Having a 100k a year is a dream for most Americans. The majority will only see 5 digits by retirement and not necessarily at the top. Thanks for pointing out some of those 6 figure plus income types who feel they shouldn’t be obligated to contribute more in taxation because that’s just unfair. Top administrators not low level teachers whose blood, sweat, and tears go toward the education of our present and future generations. Some of whom must put up with the most unruly students ever. Teachers aren’t dodging spitballs anymore there dodging bullets and knives. Conservatism is unsustainable as well given that they are quick to commit our young men to senseless wars while helping big business to profit from those ventures. Trickledown theory of finance only happens in words but is stopped at the pockets of the rich. The problem for them with unions is that they are the only advocates for the little person who doesn’t have the money to lobby our do nothing congress for fair treatment. With money you go to the hill make some contributions and you get your interest taken care off but don’t expect them to make an additional tax sacrifice. Like I said we have our priorities out of balance and your perspective is playing into the wrong hands.

uggugg-Anyone employed by the Gov’t already has a similar system that they go by. If you are a civilain you have GS (gov’t service) levels of pay and military grades are designated E for enlisted and O for officers. Free market employment traditionally does not because that would impose on freedom and privacy matters. It would keep many from bargaining their skills for the best

returns possible.

gene said:
OBVIOUS WE BE DIVIDED; AS ALWAYS BLINDED BY OUR LEFT vs RIGHT VIEW.
HOW ABOUT A NEW APPROACH? SINCE PSS IS NOT WORKING; how about:

Utilizing the ‘BEST’ Teachers via a centralized national closed circuit broadcast?
Then one would only need babysitters to monitor each classroom
Move unruly students to a strictly structered venue

The VAST COST SAVINGS and ADVANTAGES are Enormous!
“JUST a THOUGHT”

Gene- I believe some colleges have that format available but the method is not wide spread nor validated. With the advent of electronic communication it is only a matter of time before some form of what you envision will come about. The future may even do away with school attendance and have class on your computer from home. The problem there is with most families there is no one home to look after the kids given that our present society requires a two income existence. It wasn’t long ago that business trips required people to travel to meetings. Many found they could have conference calls with multiple location attendees and save a bundle in travel costs.

BruinAlum77 said:
Let’s see, after national vacations, paid holidays, sick days and weekends, you work how many days? Maybe 220-240? Oh wait, let’s look at the actual hours you work, and deduct your coffee breaks, lunch and the massive amount of time you spend trolling around the internet, making personal calls and texting. If you are anything like the average American worker http://www.hrmguide.com/performance/wasting-time.htm “August 27 2007 – The third annual survey of over 2000 employees across all job levels by Salary.com found that over 63 per cent of respondents admitted to wasting time at work and the average amount was 1.7 hours out of a typical 8.5 hour day.” So to be fair, you work maybe 7.5 months a year, but you waste 20% of that time screwing around. In other words, you work 6 months out of the year, doing what? Something that helps build the future of our country? Or are you just selling health insurance and profiting off sick and dying people? It’s funny how when we take your absurd logic and turn it back on you, it doesn’t sound so good, does it? Now, let’s drop this ridiculous line of argument and get down to reality. My mother was a teacher. I know how hard it was for her. I also remember her telling me how once in a while some giant teenager would come back to her kindergarten class, give her a hug and thank her for what she did for him as a child. I sincerely hope that you make the world better by what you do and that people come back to see you after many years to thank you for helping them become successful people. But your contributions to this discussion only add to the hatred and intolerance of this issue. Thanks.

Thanks for the heartfelt conclusion. I am a teacher, and with all due respect to your mother, the students I teach are the poorest of the poor. I left a management position at that great devil Wal-Mart to do what I am wired to do… educate. I really, really, really love when people hide behind a dead profile link then go off on a “holier-than-thou” rant… and never even bother to check my profile. Because you did not bother to do your homework, just about everything you said against me and my position was erroneous. And I have had more than one student come up to me and express appreciation for what I am doing. Again…. before you fire your intellectual bullets… maybe you should check to see what target you are aiming at. Have a great day. And give my thanks to your mother… she and I have a lot in common.

IIWII said:
I really, really, really love when people hide behind a dead profile link then go off on a “holier-than-thou” rant… and never even bother to check my profile. Because you did not bother to do your homework, just about everything you said against me and my position was erroneous.

The idea that teachers only work 6 months a year because you choose not to count weekends and vacation time is as illogical as not counting all the days off for and hours wasted by private sector workers.

So, it really doesn’t matter what your profile says, since anonymous posting allows us to take on any character or identity we choose. There are three possibilities:

1) You are a teacher and you wrote that “economic” analysis about total days worked as a sarcastic response to the anti-teacher fervor of the right wing

2) You are a teacher and wrote an illogical and false analysis because you honestly believe in conservative dogma.

3) You are just another troll pretending to be a teacher, like Dick Morris pretends to be a Democrat on Fox.

BruinAlum77 said:
The idea that teachers only work 6 months a year because you choose not to count weekends and vacation time is as illogical as not counting all the days off for and hours wasted by private sector workers. So, it really doesn’t matter what your profile says, since anonymous posting allows us to take on any character or identity we choose. There are three possibilities: 1) You are a teacher and you wrote that “economic” analysis about total days worked as a sarcastic response to the anti-teacher fervor of the right wing 2) You are a teacher and wrote an illogical and false analysis because you honestly believe in conservative dogma. 3) You are just another troll pretending to be a teacher, like Dick Morris pretends to be a Democrat on Fox.

And with all of that bellowing from you… no one here has a clue who you are. If you dig deep enough and search… you will find me. I am a teacher. I love what I do and my students will fight the devil for me. Here’s an idea! You and your beliefs… I’ll sponsor you to come and speak before my students. Come out here. I’ll pay your way. Ask my students anything you want and see what they have to say first hand. Let’s take this personal disagreement out of the equation. You come to my world and meet my students. Take my challenge and visit the Rez. You can sit where-ever you are and feel snug and safe… while I look out my window everyday and see poverty, opression and anger… and I defy you to face my students and say to them what you think of me. Northern Cheyenne Reservation, Montana. Bust your buttons from the safety of your home… I have actually taken up the cause and put my life where my principles are. When can I pick you up at Billings? Give me the day… I will make your vist to my school happen. Come on out here and tell my students what you have been saying to me and see if they agree. Just saying……
Put your life where your mouth is………….. few can say they have done that.

BruinAlum77 said:
The idea that teachers only work 6 months a year because you choose not to count weekends and vacation time is as illogical as not counting all the days off for and hours wasted by private sector workers. So, it really doesn’t matter what your profile says, since anonymous posting allows us to take on any character or identity we choose. There are three possibilities: 1) You are a teacher and you wrote that “economic” analysis about total days worked as a sarcastic response to the anti-teacher fervor of the right wing 2) You are a teacher and wrote an illogical and false analysis because you honestly believe in conservative dogma. 3) You are just another troll pretending to be a teacher, like Dick Morris pretends to be a Democrat on Fox.

Oh, sorry…. I had to log on under another email because my last several posts have been held back… this is IIWII, just so you know.

itsme said:
Oh, sorry…. I had to log on under another email because my last several posts have been held back… this is IIWII, just so you know.

There is a fourth possibility: I love what I do, I am good at what I do, and you are wrong on all counts. Sooooo, when ya flying out to Billings??????

Alz said:
How is this fair: In Illinois we owe the 100 top administrators over $885 million in pensions. Yes just 100 people. The math cannot work. (See http://www.championnews.net/article.php?sid=1023 There are names listed too.) Liberalism is unsustainable.

Talk about pulling figures out of your behind–thanks for the table with no frame of reference whatsoever! What position do these people hold? What is the CURRENT pension figures for people in the same positions? How often do people actually retire? Is it reasonable to assume that every one of these people will stay where they are and retire at this amount? This table is full of one-sided and manipulated information designed to fortify a pre-conceived notion, which means at best it’s misleading, at worst it’s an out-and-out lie.

Alz said:
So Jonny is being disingenuous. We’re not paying the bank salaries – oh, we are. And who has been pushing it all? Liberals. I was just reading a story about Rahm Emanual’s buddies in Chicago who supported him for election to mayor – VERY HEAVY in the financial industry. As for public sector union jobs, Jonny should be smart enough to know that the teacher’s making a low 5 figures aren’t the issue…just like the lower end banker isn’t th issue in the financial industry. Somehow, Jonny and other liberals know that the lower end bankers aren’t an issue so why is he focusing on the teachers that aren’t an issue?? Ahh, he’s a liberal – so the truth does not matter. I’ll give an example in Illinois. Guess what Illinois taxpayers owe the top 100 Teacher’s Administrators in Illinois for pensions??????? Remember, I’m talking about the top 100 paid administrators – just 100 people. Over $885 MILLION DOLLARS. Seehttp://www.championnews.net/article.php?sid=1023 There is a salary list too. You will be amazed at what some teachers make. Jonny is supposed to be smart…how come he misses these things?

ah, the same misleading statistics in yet another post–I guess this made the daily “talking points” newsletter?

srgntpep said:
Talk about pulling figures out of your behind–thanks for the table with no frame of reference whatsoever! What position do these people hold? What is the CURRENT pension figures for people in the same positions? How often do people actually retire? Is it reasonable to assume that every one of these people will stay where they are and retire at this amount? This table is full of one-sided and manipulated information designed to fortify a pre-conceived notion, which means at best it’s misleading, at worst it’s an out-and-out lie.

The current #’s do not matter. Whether it’s $885 million or $900 million or $857 million, you can see that the number won’t change much. So someone retires “early”, but then someone else comes on the list.

The point is how can the taxpayers cover $885 million dollars for just 100 people? The answer is they can’t.

During my year teaching career, I have often heard the remarks about having summers off and only ‘working’ 185 days a year.

I really hope someday, the public can truly see what teachers do each day. For example, when are teachers supposed to learn about the new programs, standards, and curriculum mandated by our government? It certainly cannot take place in class while the students are in attendance. Instead it is done on our personal time. We are mandated to attend workshops and take graduate level classes designed to develop that knowledge so we may better implement these innovations. As stated prior, this is not during our contractual time, but on our own time over the summer and on weekends.

Please give thought to all the reports, legal documents, data and student work that needs to be reviewed and assessed? The perception is that we simply grade papers by stamping a ‘B’ at the top of the paper. I people to look deeper in to what classroom assessment is truly like in our classrooms today. Imagine your job evaluation…now mulitply that by 27 students by 8 subjects.

When are the materials for those lessons gathered and when are the PowerPoint presentations put together to help students follow along during instruction? It is done after they leave, between the hours of 4:30 pm and 7:00 pm. Yes, some teachers choose to take their work home with them so they can at least be close to their family while working. However, for those of you who work from home, you understand that “working from home” doesn’t always translate into “spending quality time with the family”.

For me personally, I have no family since my divorce. While I neglected my family obligations for the sake of ‘my students’, I convinced myself that coming home nightly by 8 pm was only temporary and would soon dissipate once I got a handle on my professional life. Now, here I am 15 years later, and I still spend my weekends writing lesson plans and identifying ways differentiate my classroom instruction. For those of you outside the educational world, Differentiated Instruction or ‘DI’ for short refers to the practice of teaching the same concept several different ways so that every student in a class can understand. Simply put, each day I will teach a concept such as ‘graphing equations’ or ‘The Revolutionary War’ 7 different ways to 7 different groups of students (usually 4-5 students in each group). By doing that for 8 subjects as stated before, it’s quite similar to preparing 7 different dinners for 7 groups of 4 people, 8 different times, within 6 hours…Monday through Friday.

With regard to our salaries, I saw an earlier post about ‘TheChampion.org’ website in Illinois…please know that those salaries also include the TRS (pension) portion and any paid extra-curricular activities such as after-school clubs, coaching etc. While I assume it is obvious to most, these responsibilities are carried out after the normal hours of school operation. Teachers aren’t always required to participate in such activities, yet many do so simply to make extra money and to provide opportunities for students.

Finally, putting into perspective what a typical $45K salary may look like after teaching more than a decade, I thought I would list my financial breakdown for this school year below:

First Check (paid in the middle of the month)
Beginning Balance = $1400.00
Credit Card #1 = 475.00
Internet (no cable) = 64.95
Credit Card #2 = 205.00
Car/Property Insurance = 112.83
Heating/Cooking Gas = 45.00 (budget plan)
Cell Phone = 85.00
Water Bill 20.00
Ending Balance = $392.27

Second Check (paid at the end of the month)
Beginning Balance = $1400.00
Child Support = 300.00
Car Payment = 389.45
Electric Bill = 35.00 (budget plan)
Rent = 530
Ending Balance= $145.36

Living Expenses
Beginning Balance=$537.82
Gas ($60 x 4 weeks)=240.00
Groceries ($65 x 4 weeks)=260.00
Savings=25.00

Final Balance = $12.82

To close, my purpose in writing response is not to argue any point on either side of a much-debated issue. It is merely to provide insight as to what one teacher’s life is like, given that there are thousands of us who genuinely are trying to make a difference.
Thank you for your time in reading this post and I wish each one you the best during this challenging and uncertain time in our country.

My apologies for the typo’s and missed words…as an educator, I should have proofread my work.! =)

GodsPlan said:
During my year teaching career, I have often heard the remarks about having summers off and only ‘working’ 185 days a year. I really hope someday, the public can truly see what teachers do each day. For example, when are teachers supposed to learn about the new programs, standards, and curriculum mandated by our government? It certainly cannot take place in class while the students are in attendance. Instead it is done on our personal time. We are mandated to attend workshops and take graduate level classes designed to develop that knowledge so we may better implement these innovations. As stated prior, this is not during our contractual time, but on our own time over the summer and on weekends. Please give thought to all the reports, legal documents, data and student work that needs to be reviewed and assessed? The perception is that we simply grade papers by stamping a ‘B’ at the top of the paper. I people to look deeper in to what classroom assessment is truly like in our classrooms today. Imagine your job evaluation…now multiply that by 27 students by 8 subjects. When are the materials for those lessons gathered and when are the PowerPoint presentations put together to help students follow along during instruction? It is done after they leave, between the hours of 4:30 pm and 7:00 pm. Yes, some teachers choose to take their work home with them so they can at least be close to their family while working. However, for those of you who work from home, you understand that “working from home” doesn’t always translate into “spending quality time with the family”. For me personally, I have no family since my divorce. While I neglected my family obligations for the sake of ‘my students’, I convinced myself that coming home nightly by 8 pm was only temporary and would soon dissipate once I got a handle on my professional life. Now, here I am 15 years later, and I still spend my weekends writing lesson plans and identifying ways differentiate my classroom instruction. For those of you outside the educational world, Differentiated Instruction or ‘DI’ for short refers to the practice of teaching the same concept several different ways so that every student in a class can understand. Simply put, each day I will teach a concept such as ‘graphing equations’ or ‘The Revolutionary War’ 7 different ways to 7 different groups of students (usually 4-5 students in each group). By doing that for 8 subjects as stated before, it’s quite similar to preparing 7 different dinners for 7 groups of 4 people, 8 different times, within 6 hours…Monday through Friday. With regard to our salaries, I saw an earlier post about ‘TheChampion.org’ website in Illinois…please know that those salaries also include the TRS (pension) portion and any paid extra-curricular activities such as after-school clubs, coaching etc. While I assume it is obvious to most, these responsibilities are carried out after the normal hours of school operation. Teachers aren’t always required to participate in such activities, yet many do so simply to make extra money and to provide opportunities for students. Finally, putting into perspective what a typical $45K salary may look like after teaching more than a decade, I thought I would list my financial breakdown for this school year below: First Check (paid in the middle of the month)Beginning Balance = $1400.00Credit Card #1 = 475.00Internet (no cable) = 64.95Credit Card #2 = 205.00Car/Property Insurance = 112.83Heating/Cooking Gas = 45.00 (budget plan)Cell Phone = 85.00Water Bill 20.00Ending Balance = $392.27 Second Check (paid at the end of the month)Beginning Balance = $1400.00Child Support = 300.00Car Payment = 389.45Electric Bill = 35.00 (budget plan)Rent = 530Ending Balance= $145.36 Living ExpensesBeginning Balance=$537.82Gas ($60 x 4 weeks)=240.00Groceries ($65 x 4 weeks)=260.00Savings=25.00 Final Balance = $12.82 To close, my purpose in writing response is not to argue any point on either side of a much-debated issue. It is merely to provide insight as to what one teacher’s life is like, given that there are thousands of us who genuinely are trying to make a difference.Thank you for your time in reading this post and I wish each one you the best during this challenging and uncertain time in our country.

We are cut from the same cloth. I am 53. I spent decades in management. Not happy. I went back to college and earned my teaching degree. I kicked the doors down out here to get this position. I teach on an Indian Rez in Montana. I could have taken other positions but this is what I needed to do, go in where there is little hope and few chances… and I teach my living heart out. I took a several thousands of dollars cut in pay. My wife is a teacher back in Illinois. We have been married 33 years… and before I took this position the longest we had been apart was 6 days. It has now been 7 months. I talk to her every night (Skype) and we sync up movies (Netflix to DVD) and chat on headphones…. I miss her terribly. I have chosen to do something with my life to make up for the years I just plugged along. Yep, the pay is not great. Yes, I work long hours after school is out. Yes, I sit in a lonely apartment listening to “Still Beating” by Josh Ritter… but neither my wife nor I would give up our time in the classroom with our students. We will be together during the summer, and for Christmas… those times I give thanks for having the chance to be home with my lovely MM… and those are the small perks educators have. Chunks of time scattered amongst months of work, work, work. “I know the dog days, of the summer….”
PS… I ran your post/quote through word and fixed the typos for ya… the educator in me….

GodsPlan said:
My apologies for the typo’s and missed words…as an educator, I should have proofread my work.! =)

We need more educators like you on the Rez… what do ya teach?

gene said:
OBVIOUS WE BE DIVIDED; AS ALWAYS BLINDED BY OUR LEFT vs RIGHT VIEW.
HOW ABOUT A NEW APPROACH? SINCE PSS IS NOT WORKING; how about:
Utilizing the ‘BEST’ Teachers via a centralized national closed circuit broadcast?
Then one would only need babysitters to monitor each classroom
Move unruly students to a strictly structered venue
The VAST COST SAVINGS and ADVANTAGES are Enormous!
“JUST a THOUGHT”

Rockycomet said:
Gene- I believe some colleges have that format available but the method is not wide spread nor validated. With the advent of electronic communication it is only a matter of time before some form of what you envision will come about. The future may even do away with school attendance and have class on your computer from home. The problem there is with most families there is no one home to look after the kids given that our present society requires a two income existence. It wasn’t long ago that business trips required people to travel to meetings. Many found they could have conference calls with multiple location attendees and save a bundle in travel costs.
——————————————————————————————————————————————————-

Just to expand on my previous post the idea of having no classroom education does lend to severe social consequences. It would diminish a child’s interaction with classmates in their formulating years and reduce their social skills. There is no substitute for a teacher present to help a child’s development. We would have a major society restructuring before that format could be adopted on a large scale. Life in general in that format would be somewhat cold and distant for everyone and is certainly not a preferable means of existence. With the reduction of teachers required our society would need to absorb those positions in some viable way and we are not prepared to undergo that type of change as yet. Given the potential for our future who’s to know fully what may come about.

I hate to say it-but when you figure out all the time teachers get off every year-Christmas, spring break, holidays (snow days in some places) and summer-and the fact that they most schools are about 8AM-3PM-which usually includes a free period and a lunch -the salaries don’t sound so bad to me. I don’t know about all schools-but where I live most schools have only a half-day on Fridays -so teacher’s can do all their “teacher workshops” and other activities.

As for the person who has $800 a month in credit card debt and a hefty car payment-maybe there’s a little bit of over-active spending going on there? I can only imagine how much debt (must be tens of thousands of dollars) a person would have to incur to have cc payments that large. As for a car payment-what is that -with $60/week for gas (yes it’s higher at the moment but is that the figure for these past few weeks or annual average?) is that a big fancy SUV?

It’s a bad economy-people just have to suck it up if they want to survive. My job was on reduced hours for over a year before we finally recovered and went back to 40 hours per week and we could go back to reductions any day. I say-if you have a job right now-count yourself lucky.

Doodle-Perhaps you haven’t read many of the previous posts. I’m not a teacher but have several friends who are. The time you claim they have as free time is disingenuous. Most teachers don’t work 8 to 5 as you say. A good majority of dedicated teachers who see their job as a calling to provide our societies children a leg up with the best possible education will and do work 12hr days. Some of those holidays are spent preparing for the upcoming class requirements. Seriously you would count lunch as a benefit? Perhaps you would find the time for restroom use a benefit also! If in your area teachers are accommodated with half day Friday workshops why would you complain about an educator being updated to maintain proficiency and insure quality education? It is after all part of the job. Do you expect them to attend those workshops on their time? I’m sure with your dedication when your job reduced hours you must have declined and said that you would work those hours at no pay. After all that would benefit your employer’s well being as opposed to the benefit of societies children. How can you comment on someone’s living expenses given the cost of living as it is? Perhaps your area has a cheaper cost of living. A dependable car purchased new is a hefty payment anywhere! My Camry cost me more than $60 a week in gas given my travel requirements when I was working. I’ve been out of work for two and half years so I know your plight with the reduced ours and it didn’t happen under Obama’s term. Yes right now one should count themselves lucky if they currently have a job, if our leadership of the recent past had been doing their job properly we wouldn’t be in this position suffering a bad economy and I wouldn’t be out of work. The point of the article above is that there is a disproportioned attitude toward the income of the average teacher and the rich who don’t want to make the sacrifice of paying any additional tax during this bad economy. If in fact you believe a teacher’s job doesn’t sound so bad try becoming one, walk a mile in their shoes and see how quickly your opinion would change. If it turns out as you think then enjoy your knew cozy job!

Boy Rocky-do you really see your glass as half-empty-r maybe not even less than half? I too have friends that are teachers & when I bring up the same point -they do tell me that some teachers definitely have more free time than other teachers. And some of it may be dedication (or some simply consider it a job & stick to the basics) or some simply may be more organized than others. I happen to have one in the family who is far less organized than most-and although she always says she’s busy and doesn’t have time in her schedule-she somehow does have time to read about several novels every single month &
she is also an unofficial expert on TV, TV ratings and show cancellations. Now figure that one out because the rest us in the family cannot. However-all of the teachers I know (many from the gym) have LOTS of free time and they enjoy it over the breaks. I could never be a teacher because I don’t have the patience-so I certainly don’t have any complaints about those who do. (Was I complaining about the quality of education? Because I actually think some of the schools are a little overboard-I don’t have kids-but the ones I know have so much homework they just can’t get it all done.) I was just pointing out that most of us would love to have that much time off and not have it adversely affect our income. (Sure-I can take extra time off when I need it-completely unpaid.) I do however know what sorts of crazy things have been discovered when some of the area school districts were in such bad shape that they had to be taken over and audited by another agency (at least one was taken over by and ran by the state for a while) and during that process-all sorts of crazy things were exposed. Like in one district-somehow every single teacher had a district paid cell phone & when the bills were audited-it was discovered that most were using it in place of a personal cell phone. (I myself am anti-cell-spend less than $10 monthly on prepaid & my life is just fine waiting til I’m home to talk to somebody) And as for the car-I completely disagree. The only time I’ve ever had a payment much over $200 is the one time I splurged and bought a sports car without a down payment. Other than that I put down a decent amount that I can usually get by driving the car for a couple of years after I’ve paid it off-and if you keep your car in good shape (and don’t keep trading up) -you should be able to do that. Oh-and by the way-yes I DO actually work a few unpaid hours here and there. I work for a very small family owned company-which I like very much (despite the extremely limited PTO, lack of dental plan and 401K, etc) and I want them to be around so I can keep working there. See-where I live most people wind up with 10 and 11 hour days after working 8 hours then commuting and they all have to go to bed by 10 so they can get up at the crack of dawn and spend an hour and a half driving 30 miles. Strangely-most of the teachers I know-actually work in a district not too far from home-so they aren’t dealing with that either. I guess my point is that it seems like every group has their “pet-peeve” complaints and when you really look examine all the evidence-the cons probably really don’t outwieigh the pros. The bottom line is-if you don’t like your job do something about it-go to a private school or whatever-but don’t complain to get what you want-that doesn’t do anyone any good and it pollutes our environment with negative energy.

Oh and one final note-anyone in any profession that has not yet been outsourced should try and live for the positive-and as far as I know-they haven’t yet figured out a way to outsource teachers. Everyone says the economy is bad because of the housing crunch-but the truth is the economy is bad because there just aren’t enough jobs to go around -1 due to outsourcing & 2 due to technology. Therefore- when you have a job in a profession that isn’t becoming extinct-no matter what the bad points are-just enjoy the good ones and try not to let the negative get the best of you.

Outsourcing teachers? Thanks, you just told Rick Scott(FL. Gov.) his next move. I can see it now, a bunch of American kids staring into their skype vision, at their teacher Mr. Patel in India.

Doodle-First off despite the shortcoming I’ve been experiencing I can assure you my glass remains half full and want to know who took my other half. I do agree with you on many points you made, but don’t type cast all teachers given the examples you made. There are and always will be those few who will abuse a given system for their own benefit. Gym teachers as you said may not have the same job commitment as say a Math or Science teacher, but then some schools will and do give them additional responsibilities that goes unnoticed. Sure we would all like to be in a position to have more time off to enjoy. They have shown that Americans as a whole have fewer holidays off than in most other countries. The lack of jobs should be attributed to mismanagement of our economy by gov’t and large corporations.

In the end because the guy or gal next to me has it just a little better than me doesn’t mean I should criticize their opportunity for doing right by their effort (despite the abusers) when there are those who get far, far more should be protected. I guess my point really comes back to the attitude that there is a dangerous precedent being made in expecting middle class sacrifice while the more well to do are unwilling to make any at all given the economic conditions our country is in. Thank you for the pleasant exchange.

Alz said:
Remember, I’m talking about the top 100 paid administrators

Administrators are not teachers, and the administrators don’t belong to unions.

How much is Walker cutting administrators salaries and benefits? Not one iota.

Dubya likes that Jon Stewart…

He’s got such a flair for exposing those Hypocrites at Fox (faux ‘ewes’)

as horrible & hypocritical as they are, he always manages to put a funny *spin* on it…

yes sir, Dubya likes that Jon Stewart, heheheh…

WOW!!! There sure are a lot of Teacher haters out there! What a sad world that we live in where the respect for highly educated and caring professionals that love, nurture and TEACH our nations youth (OUR VERY OWN PRECIOUS CHILDREN) have to hear their beloved career and themselves get thrashed! I am disgusted to hear so much teacher bashing especially with the “bashers” using IGNORANCE as their guide! ( FYI…Teachers Unions also “bargain for class sizes and safety issues as well..Unions are NOT all the same and they have indeed changed over the yrs…collective bargaining in itself is NOT the enemy….greed in general is our FOE!) I don’t know about you but….I thank God everyday, for the TEACHERS I had in my life! They taught me a lot more than the basic curriculum standards. I was taught to research issues & to think on my own, to respect myself and others and to believe in the human spirit! I am not sure what kind of teachers that they had but maybe they need to take a trip to their local schools and sit in on some classes and “Experience” a day on the life of a teacher. BTW, We as parents also need to step up and get involved in our kids education as well not just leave the entire educational responsibility on the teachers shoulders. We parents are our childrens first teacher and we need to continue to support and encourage ANYONE that is involved in the lifelong process that we call “Learning”! Come on people, it is time to come together and stop pointing fingers at the teachers and take an active role in our kids education as well. We are ALL in this together! We cannot put all of the “failing kids scores ” blame on the teachers. They get them for a little less than an hour a day and what we do to help our kids enhance what they have learned at school is a HUGE advantage for our kids…Schools and homes MUST have a bridge between them if we want our children to succeed! Kids will always fail if not encouraged and nurtured to make “good choices” as they are growing up! (Prime EX” Kids mind…Hmmmm video games or HW? Which should I do?) It is high time we work WITH our schools and teachers NOT AGAINST them! :) Fr it really does take a village to raise a child and education is NOT an EXCEPTION! God Bless our teachers & families! Keep fighting the good fight!

Boy oh Boy I wish I teaching really was as cushy as Doodle thinks….especially on some of those 12 or 13 hours days! I don’t know what district he lives in or what state but our schools here (Michigan) don’t give teachers cell phones, or perks at all etc. Our teachers here work their buns off and often don’t leave school til well after 5 or 6pm (some even coach and mentor struggling kids UNPAID 3 to 4 days a week ….this is volunteered time because they care about kids). Not to mention, they must be at school at 730am (kids come in at 7:45 in the Middle Schools) so some teachers actually get in anywhere between 7 and 7:30 to set up , help kids that struggle whose parents can’t pick them up if AFTER school so they do early tutoring instead (more UN PAID Time) then turn around and stay after for the kids that CAN stay!

With all due respect….I can’t help but think,Wow what world do you live in Doodle!? :(

I guess I am just really sad to hear that teachers where you live are so devalued in the community because some folks believe that they apparently aren’t worthy of decent/good pay. I suppose I could see why people might think that they do not deserve the pay that they earn… Especially after all of that education & higher degrees that they have worked so hard to earn to make them qualified to teach our nations youth!
Not sure if you know this but teachers must go to college for several years (usually over 4 yrs just for the initial BA alone) and then must continue to do so FOREVER in order to keep teaching….this doesn’t even include all of the EXTRA training for new concepts and curriculum to be learned each year…which by the way, some of that training and preparation goes on during the summer months as well! Those “simple” degrees that most teachers attain do include a masters degree that they must pay for themselves in order to stay “highly qualified” & retain their teaching certificate! Sadly to add insult to injury, most of what I am hearing from those folks that bash the teachers seems to be a whole lot of misinformation as well!
So, just curious are you planning to home school your kids when you have them? Why not give it a whirl eh…it IS just that easy right? :) ……………………I have to say that I am very thankful and grateful for ALL of the teachers that I have had over the years!

BTW….Kudos to you Rocky!!! :) Great job on your posts…you hit the nail on the head in almost every aspect!

Doodle….it would be really cool if you could go and spend some time in the classes that your friends teach! :) There is a lot to be said for actual hands on experience…it might just change your perspective a bit too! :)

Well, I’m a parent with two children 6th and 3rd graders in Ohio, and while teachers provide a essential service,..

come on,.. teaching isn’t mining coal, running into a burning building, engaging in a firefight with the Taliban, nor is it, a walking on water holy mission. Get over yourselves, if you have to glorify teachers with this much sugary syrup to get folks to forget one simple thing,..

Our States can’t afford the status qou, cuts must be made, and teachers as well as cops, (My families tradition) as well as road crews ..etc. etc… have to give a little. The response from the unions and their supporters has been wildly outrageous distortions of fact, as well as the moronic demonizatization of Walker as some kind of fascist out to murder people..

really?

A dictater?

Did you folks think Obama was a fascist when he nationalized GM, or decided to ram through Obama care against 60% public opposition?

You can’t have it both ways, unless you just wanna admit, it’s not about truth, but about raw partisan power, and the lefts inability to allow democracy to function, unless they get 100% of everything they want. You can’t get working poor families are sick of the continous whining from teachers they have it so tough…

Try getting by with 20,000 a year then tell them how tough it is for you to pay a pittence more for your pension. All they’ll get is social security, if the left hasn’t destroyed it by then.

The CB thing, 25 states don’t have it, nor do federal employees, oh boo flippin hoo… your RIGHTS are being trampled on, that’s why Obama tomorrow will propose giving CB to all federal employees, right?

right?

Or is he just another Koch lover?

For supposedly educated people the teachers, students and assorted union workers are in the gutter crude, vulgar and mean as a Snickers deprived Michael Moore.

Show us the sophisticated education professionals and act with some class.. or give up any pretense you’re anything more than selfishly arrogant children screaming I hate you I hate you I hate you over and over…

it’s be more discriptive, and honest.

FYI….Our school districts union where I live did just that…. they bargained a contract that DOES in fact give back as EVERYONE should and both sides, the Board and union did a great job in negotiating those financial aspects as well as issues resulting in safer conditions for our kids while trying to keep the class sizes down!!
It is best to get your facts straight first..NOT ALL UNIONS are bullys… NOT ALL TEACHERS are full blown Democrats….Not ALL TEACHERS are bad and need to be demonized and FINALLY …..No ONE person or ONE organization speaks for EVERYONE when they make an ignorant statement!
Come on now, please tell me that you are more educated than to ASSume that teachers are whining but rather standing up to the BULLY’s that attack them just because they chose to pick a profession that is able to earn a decent living to provide for their families. They too are taxpayers!! They are WEALTHY and never went into education to TRY to become wealthy by any means!!
Please tell me that you really don’t think that someone that chose a serving compassionate profession that is HELPING to make our world a BETTER place while EDUCATING our youth to read, write,research and have an opinion or to take a stand in issues that matter to them are just a bunch of “selfishly arrogant children screaming I hate you I hate you ” as you said, type people! Do you REALLY believe that? If so, then I hope you choose to home school your children because there isn’t a teacher out there that will be able to live up to YOUR expectations no matter how good they are in educating your kids. Maybe you can do a better job teaching them yourself! I say good luck Charlie…it sure seems as though you think you have all of the answers. In the meantime, it would be best if you did because then you won’t spoil the attitudes of the other families that support our education system and work in conjunction to HELP our kids rather than to HARM it by spewing false allegations and demonizing the very people in the community that actually LOVE your kids and want the best for them. Shame on you! :(
That is a sad sad perspective that you have based on the Few and certainly NOT the majority!! Teachers have worked in college as many other professionals & have earned their positions as educators. NO one is saying that EVERYONE doesn’t need to make sacrifices…..Our school teachers here surely have and will continue to do so just like everyone else! Remember….Collective bargaining is NOT the enemy Mark….Greed is our Foe!! Corporate America and its fat cats created most of this mess and had a lot of help from our greedy narrow minded politicians! PS this isn’t 1960 Mark….Not ALL unions are bully’s! With all due respect….It’s time to do your HW and see who the REAL CULPRITS are in this countries mess! :)

BTW,
Be careful what you wish for when you want ALL unions busted …if the Govt passes the EFM (Emergency Financial Manager) Bill in Michigan and in other states, it won’t matter anyway because your vote and mine will NOT matter anyway! Do a little research and you’ll see what I mean!

FYI….Our school districts union where I live did just that…. they bargained a contract that DOES in fact give back as EVERYONE should and both sides, the Board and union did a great job in negotiating those financial aspects as well as issues resulting in safer conditions for our kids while trying to keep the class sizes down!!
It is best to get your facts straight first..NOT ALL UNIONS are bullys… NOT ALL TEACHERS are full blown Democrats….Not ALL TEACHERS are bad and need to be demonized and FINALLY …..No ONE person or ONE organization speaks for EVERYONE when they make an ignorant statement!
Come on now, please tell me that you are more educated than to ASSume that teachers are whining but rather standing up to the BULLY’s that attack them just because they chose to pick a profession that is able to earn a decent living to provide for their families. They too are taxpayers!! They are NOT WEALTHY and never went into education to TRY to become wealthy by any means!!
Please tell me that you really don’t think that someone that chose a serving compassionate profession that is HELPING to make our world a BETTER place while EDUCATING our youth to read, write,research and have an opinion or to take a stand in issues that matter to them are just a bunch of “selfishly arrogant children screaming I hate you I hate you ” as you said, type people! Do you REALLY believe that? If so, then I hope you choose to home school your children because there isn’t a teacher out there that will be able to live up to YOUR expectations no matter how good they are in educating your kids. Maybe you can do a better job teaching them yourself! I say good luck Charlie…it sure seems as though you think you have all of the answers. In the meantime, it would be best if you did because then you won’t spoil the attitudes of the other families that support our education system and work in conjunction to HELP our kids rather than to HARM it by spewing false allegations and demonizing the very people in the community that actually LOVE your kids and want the best for them. Shame on you! :(
That is a sad sad perspective that you have based on the Few and certainly NOT the majority!! Teachers have worked in college as many other professionals & have earned their positions as educators. NO one is saying that EVERYONE doesn’t need to make sacrifices…..Our school teachers here surely have and will continue to do so just like everyone else! Remember….Collective bargaining is NOT the enemy Mark….Greed is our Foe!! Corporate America and its fat cats created most of this mess and had a lot of help from our greedy narrow minded politicians! PS this isn’t 1960 Mark….Not ALL unions are bully’s! With all due respect….It’s time to do your HW and see who the REAL CULPRITS are in this countries mess! :)

BTW,
Be careful what you wish for when you want ALL unions busted …if the Govt passes the EFM (Emergency Financial Manager) Bill in Michigan and in other states, it won’t matter anyway because your vote and mine will NOT matter anyway! Do a little research and you’ll see what I mean!

Alz said:
So Jonny is being disingenuous. We’re not paying the bank salaries – oh, we are. And who has been pushing it all? Liberals.

I was just reading a story about Rahm Emanual’s buddies in Chicago who supported him for election to mayor – VERY HEAVY in the financial industry.

As for public sector union jobs, Jonny should be smart enough to know that the teacher’s making a low 5 figures aren’t the issue…just like the lower end banker isn’t th issue in the financial industry.

Somehow, Jonny and other liberals know that the lower end bankers aren’t an issue so why is he focusing on the teachers that aren’t an issue??

Ahh, he’s a liberal – so the truth does not matter.

I’ll give an example in Illinois. Guess what Illinois taxpayers owe the top 100 Teacher’s Administrators in Illinois for pensions???????

Remember, I’m talking about the top 100 paid administrators – just 100 people.

Over $885 MILLION DOLLARS. See
http://www.championnews.net/article.php?sid=1023

There is a salary list too. You will be amazed at what some teachers make. Jonny is supposed to be smart…how come he misses these things?

BS. Of course you know this. In addition, these are the highest tax paying salaries. Unlike the Koch Brothers whom have made a record $11 Billion extracting fosil fuel/energy out of Wisconsin. If you remove the Bush Tax Gifts of over a Trillion dollars to the likes of the Koch’s – Then perhaps teachers and state workers could earn a decent salary without having to pay the Koch’s for the honor of being dishonored with their OWN TAX DOLLARS AGAINST THEM. Stop being a Koch Whore. Americans, even uneducated ones that support the moronic right – know that teachers are not the problem. The Corporate Welfare Program is. That is what you are supporting. It seams you didn’t want that for the poor – so why should the rich be given welfare benefits?

Darr247 said:
Administrators are not teachers, and the administrators don’t belong to unions.

How much is Walker cutting administrators salaries and benefits? Not one iota.

Don’t confuse Republicans with facts. They’re liberal in bias.

Mark Edwards said:
Well, I’m a parent with two children 6th and 3rd graders in Ohio, and while teachers provide a essential service,..

come on,.. teaching isn’t mining coal, running into a burning building, engaging in a firefight with the Taliban, nor is it, a walking on water holy mission. Get over yourselves, if you have to glorify teachers with this much sugary syrup to get folks to forget one simple thing,..

Our States can’t afford the status qou, cuts must be made, and teachers as well as cops, (My families tradition) as well as road crews ..etc. etc… have to give a little. The response from the unions and their supporters has been wildly outrageous distortions of fact, as well as the moronic demonizatization of Walker as some kind of fascist out to murder people..

really?

A dictater?

Did you folks think Obama was a fascist when he nationalized GM, or decided to ram through Obama care against 60% public opposition?

You can’t have it both ways, unless you just wanna admit, it’s not about truth, but about raw partisan power, and the lefts inability to allow democracy to function, unless they get 100% of everything they want. You can’t get working poor families are sick of the continous whining from teachers they have it so tough…

Try getting by with 20,000 a year then tell them how tough it is for you to pay a pittence more for your pension. All they’ll get is social security, if the left hasn’t destroyed it by then.

The CB thing, 25 states don’t have it, nor do federal employees, oh boo flippin hoo… your RIGHTS are being trampled on, that’s why Obama tomorrow will propose giving CB to all federal employees, right?

right?

Or is he just another Koch lover?

For supposedly educated people the teachers, students and assorted union workers are in the gutter crude, vulgar and mean as a Snickers deprived Michael Moore.

Show us the sophisticated education professionals and act with some class.. or give up any pretense you’re anything more than selfishly arrogant children screaming I hate you I hate you I hate you over and over…

it’s be more discriptive, and honest.

Your state and Boehner CAN afford Tax Gifts to the top 1.5% whom pay little or no taxes as it is. Like Walker in Wisconsin, the shortfall is because they give their donors the biggest tax breaks $140 miilion and then have a shortfall of $137million. Wisconsin is about breaking unions. Guess What Wisconsin Police and Fireman – he skipped you – this time – but as he weakens the middle class and poor – they’ll come back for you. Don’t believe a word that liar has to say. It’s about busting unions – he needed you this time – he will not the next time RECALL AND REPEAL. By the way, Where are the jobs Boehner???

Marbear said:
WOW!!! There sure are a lot of Teacher haters out there! What a sad world that we live in where the respect for highly educated and caring professionals that love, nurture and TEACH our nations youth (OUR VERY OWN PRECIOUS CHILDREN) have to hear their beloved career and themselves get thrashed! I am disgusted to hear so much teacher bashing especially with the “bashers” using IGNORANCE as their guide! ( FYI…Teachers Unions also “bargain for class sizes and safety issues as well..Unions are NOT all the same and they have indeed changed over the yrs…collective bargaining in itself is NOT the enemy….greed in general is our FOE!) I don’t know about you but….I thank God everyday, for the TEACHERS I had in my life! They taught me a lot more than the basic curriculum standards. I was taught to research issues & to think on my own, to respect myself and others and to believe in the human spirit! I am not sure what kind of teachers that they had but maybe they need to take a trip to their local schools and sit in on some classes and “Experience” a day on the life of a teacher. BTW, We as parents also need to step up and get involved in our kids education as well not just leave the entire educational responsibility on the teachers shoulders. We parents are our childrens first teacher and we need to continue to support and encourage ANYONE that is involved in the lifelong process that we call “Learning”! Come on people, it is time to come together and stop pointing fingers at the teachers and take an active role in our kids education as well. We are ALL in this together! We cannot put all of the “failing kids scores ” blame on the teachers. They get them for a little less than an hour a day and what we do to help our kids enhance what they have learned at school is a HUGE advantage for our kids…Schools and homes MUST have a bridge between them if we want our children to succeed! Kids will always fail if not encouraged and nurtured to make “good choices” as they are growing up! (Prime EX” Kids mind…Hmmmm video games or HW? Which should I do?) It is high time we work WITH our schools and teachers NOT AGAINST them! :) Fr it really does take a village to raise a child and education is NOT an EXCEPTION! God Bless our teachers & families! Keep fighting the good fight!

Republicans have been attacking the middle class and poor since Reagan. Giving the Trillion Dollar Gifts to the Koch Brothers and their ilk. Blaming middle America for Bush’s folly – Trillions in his illegal wars to protect the oil line for the Koch Brothers, Saudi Royal Family and Murdoch’s of the world. If the 1.5% that has been the beneficiary of the biggest tax gifts in history – our economy would still be thriving (assuming we never allowed the banks, oil, real estate and wall street to REGULATE THEMSELVES. It’s like asking a bank robber to be trust worthy! Teachers aren’t the problems. Koch Brothers and Republican Corporate Citizens are. They won the right to buy elections – and in turn – pay no taxes. With their tax income removed – who pays? We do. We’re all Wisconsin. If a teacher can find a way to make $1 million in this country, God Bless them. They deserve it. These idiots on the right are proof of why we need a better education, but they’ve replaced education with blind faith ignorance. Jesus Camp attendees. Incredible.

IIWII said:
Nice points for contention. A few points of missed truth:
1. Student teachers do not usually get paid at all. Nothing. Student teachers do their student teaching as part of the college requirement.
2. They forgot to add the retirement payments tax payers pay into teacher funds. The retirement payment is also a benefit.
3. It is NOT 9 months of work for a teacher. It is 6 months. Most school districts that do not do year round education have a school schedule of 185 days. That carries over for a nine month period but actually only equals (do the math, 30 days avg. per month divided into 185 days of scheduled school) 6 months.
Do teachers have it easy? No. But if you really, really want to be fair, you have to take the average salary, add ALL the benefits then multiply the money X2 since they only work 6 months of the year by total days. Suddenly the 85K turns into 170K… and many, many, many teachers have a second job on weekends and in the summer. If teachers really want to get mad they should find the person who made them go into the teaching profession and hold that person accountable.
Just saying…

You know nothing about teaching. You are using false assumptions and you are missing that these are also tax paying citizens. Unlike the 2/3rds Corporations that do not in Wisconsin, the new Corporations that will pay none over the next two years and the “Tax Gifts” given by the likes of Walker to his supporters that created the shortfall to begin with. Where is the Corporate Citizen’s “Sacrifice” that Sister Sarah Palin wants the hard working middle class to make (and whom are paying percentage wise a hell of a lot more than the corporate citizen)? Stop giving Corporate Welfare to the Koch Brothers – they can’t extract fossil fuels from India – that are in Wisconsin. WE’RE ALL WISCONSIN.

IIWII said:
We were not talking hours… we were talking days. And if the truth be told… school days are not 8 hours long. Teachers usually have 5-6 classes of less than an hour each. AND they have a prep period where they do not teach anything. Under your math, it is 185 days x 6 hours / 24 = 46.25 24 hour periods. And that is the math if you want to do it your way.

What are you doing about weekends and holidays sparky?

IIWII said:
Wellllllll, during my prep period I read breaking news, get caught up on world events, get in touch with other teachers and exchange ideas and thoughts… pretty much the same thing I would do out of school.

Do the Koch Heads pay you by the letter for your idiocy? I have to know how much “incomeathome.com” really pays morons such as yourself. I don’t make that charge lightly, I’ve read enough of your ignorance to comfortably call you a moron. Still, what do the Koch Whores pay for you teabagers to post their idiocy? 6 pack of Old Milwaukee and cheese? Your education system has failed you – or you have been home schooled or spent too much time in Jesus Camp. I’m thinking all three, but please…enlighten us.

WCinWI said:
Actually the average salary for a teacher just starting out with no masters degree in the state of WI is around $100,000. If you have your masters, add another $15-20,000 onto your actual salary. I’d say that’s a nice pay scale.

Also, the AFSCME union head for the state of WI makes more than our Governor. The union leader makes around $165-170,000 on salary alone.

http://maciverinstitute.com/2011/02/labor-leaders-living-large/

Collective bargaining for the state of WI also doesn’t include work conditions like classroom size, a major talking point of those that are pro-collective bargaining.

http://maciverinstitute.com/2011/02/administrators-refute-weacs-class-size-claims/

Again, quoting lies from Republican sources does not make your case. It’s like saying, “look what James O’Keffe uncovered” and having Sean Hannity play it up, then Limbaugh ranting about it. Still all lies.

WCinWI said:
Here’s also a way to check out the salaries of WI residents, as its public info:

http://www.postcrescent.com/article/99999999/APC0110/80221166

Republican BS/Propaganda site for Koch Whores and Koch Heads (aka Union Busters). PS. If teachers were making $150K a year – they’d deserve it. The fact that they don’t is criminal. Now the Koch Brothers not paying taxes in Wisconsin while making a record $11 Billion – that should warrant jail time for Walker and the Koch’s.

If Walker wanted to be fiscally responsible – he wouldn’t have given $140 million in tax gifts creating a $137 shortfall. Even a republictard like you can do that math. Or can you?

http://youtu.be/AUpO1QFMDtM

Check out what Michigan’s Governor is proposing in the EFM bill he and is cabinet created!

Do you enjoy your riht to vote and particiapte in the political process regardless if you are a Democrat or Republican??

Marbear-here’s a repost you might enjoy if you haven’t already seen it.

Over Paid Teachers
by Jesse A. Magan on Tuesday, March 1, 2011
Are you sick of high paid teachers? Teachers’ hefty salaries are driving up taxes, and they only work 9 or 10 months a year! It’s time we put things in perspective and pay them for what they do – baby sit! We can get that for less than minimum wage. That’s right. Let’s give them $3.00 an hour and only the hours they worked; not any of that silly planning time, or any time they spend before or after school. That would be $19.50 a day (7:45 to 3:00 PM with 45 min. off for lunch and plan — that equals 6 1/2 hours). Each parent should pay $19.50 a day for these teachers to baby-sit their children. Now how many do they teach in a day…maybe 30? So that’s $19.50 x 30 = $585.00 a day. However, remember they only work 180 days a year!!! I am not going to pay them for any vacations. LET’S SEE…. That’s $585 X 180= $105,300 per year. (Hold on! My calculator needs new batteries). What about those special education teachers and the ones with Master’s degrees? Well, we could pay them minimum wage ($7.75), and just to be fair, round it off to $8.00 an hour. That would be $8 X 6 1/2 hours X 30 children x 180 days = $280,800 per year.
Wait a minute — there’s something wrong here! There sure is! The average teacher’s salary (nationwide) is $50,000. $50,000/180 days = $277.77/per day/30 students=$9.25/6.5 hours = $1.42 per hour per student–a very inexpensive baby-sitter and they even EDUCATE your kids!:)
WHAT A DEAL!!!!

Enough said!

Actually, I am sick of high paid teachers, and their sense of entitlement. Teachers are public employees, and the taxpayers foot the bill for their salaries, so no, they are not entitled to more than what they already have–free pensions and healthcare and $50,000 salaries, a total of nearly $100,000 year in benefits, of which they only pay taxes on half. Man, I wish I could pay $5/doctor’s visit and taxes on only half of my income. I hope Walker and Kasich blast union to smithereens! Public sector employees should not be unionized, even FDR said that–wait ignore that last comment, because unless it justifies a bigger sense of entitlement, we are not allowed to use facts.

Mark said: I’m a parent with two children 6th and 3rd graders
.
It would strike me that if you want your children educated you would want someone with superior qualifications who’s well paid to look after them and not a marginal, disgruntled and underpaid individual. The most precious possession you have and you would compromise them! No it isn’t like coal mining, running into a building, or engaging in a firefight with the Taliban, it is however the holiest mission a parent could undertake in sacrificing anything and everything for the benefit of their children! To consider that there are parents who would marginalize what is offered for them is beyond my comprehension. If you don’t think teachers should be glorified then at least glorify you two children.

No one is demonizing Walker but himself through his own actions.
Dictator- somebody who is regarded as behaving in an autocratic or domineering way!
So yes he is behaving that way!

Some of you statements or facts are questionable to say the least! You mention Koch but haven’t said a word about how they could help Wisconsin in this trying time considering how much they make of the back of the people that are expected to make sacrifices. The Koch brothers who will benefit most from Walkers actions as they are taking place.

The CB thing 25 states and the fed don’t have it, yeah so nobody should have it? No advocate for the general populace but money if you’re rich will get you anything you want like Governors, Senators, Representatives, Judges, even an entire state gov’t. Your belief that what Walker is doing is allowing democracy to work and that liberals are impeding that progress could not be more bizarre in concept.

You should by your summarization give up the pretense of being anything more than misguided and playing into the wrong hands…….that Sir is more descriptive and honest.

victoria- So what your saying is “I don’t have it that good so neither should they!” You probably don’t have kids and therefore nothing invested.

James Gregory Backus said:
What are you doing about weekends and holidays sparky?

Me? weekends and holidays? I am sitting back, watching some baseball, having a beer or three, passing time, fishing, kicking back, giving Netflix a workout, marking time… ya see, I have a lot of time on weekends and holidays…’cause “sparky” I am a public school teacher…

James Gregory Backus said:
You know nothing about teaching. You are using false assumptions and you are missing that these are also tax paying citizens. Unlike the 2/3rds Corporations that do not in Wisconsin, the new Corporations that will pay none over the next two years and the “Tax Gifts” given by the likes of Walker to his supporters that created the shortfall to begin with. Where is the Corporate Citizen’s “Sacrifice” that Sister Sarah Palin wants the hard working middle class to make (and whom are paying percentage wise a hell of a lot more than the corporate citizen)? Stop giving Corporate Welfare to the Koch Brothers – they can’t extract fossil fuels from India – that are in Wisconsin. WE’RE ALL WISCONSIN.

I know a lot about teaching. I am a teacher. If you are NOT a teacher…. move on, union shill….

James Gregory Backus said:
Do the Koch Heads pay you by the letter for your idiocy? I have to know how much “incomeathome.com” really pays morons such as yourself. I don’t make that charge lightly, I’ve read enough of your ignorance to comfortably call you a moron. Still, what do the Koch Whores pay for you teabagers to post their idiocy? 6 pack of Old Milwaukee and cheese? Your education system has failed you – or you have been home schooled or spent too much time in Jesus Camp. I’m thinking all three, but please…enlighten us.

Man!!!!! You put boff yer feets in yer mouff!!!!! Paid by who???? kekekekekekekeke…. Nope, I teach public school. And your rant tells me you have passed through those same schools and had teachers less adequate than me. Nice try…. you missed the mark on about, oh, 23 comments. And just so ya know, I am more a Guinness man. I was not home schooled… and I am athiest. So, seeing how you ranted and raged without knowing a darn bit about me…..I can assume you are union thug.

Mark Edwards said:
Well, I’m a parent with two children 6th and 3rd graders in Ohio, and while teachers provide a essential service,.. come on,.. teaching isn’t mining coal, running into a burning building, engaging in a firefight with the Taliban, nor is it, a walking on water holy mission. Get over yourselves, if you have to glorify teachers with this much sugary syrup to get folks to forget one simple thing,.. Our States can’t afford the status qou, cuts must be made, and teachers as well as cops, (My families tradition) as well as road crews ..etc. etc… have to give a little. The response from the unions and their supporters has been wildly outrageous distortions of fact, as well as the moronic demonizatization of Walker as some kind of fascist out to murder people.. really? A dictater? Did you folks think Obama was a fascist when he nationalized GM, or decided to ram through Obama care against 60% public opposition? You can’t have it both ways, unless you just wanna admit, it’s not about truth, but about raw partisan power, and the lefts inability to allow democracy to function, unless they get 100% of everything they want. You can’t get working poor families are sick of the continous whining from teachers they have it so tough… Try getting by with 20,000 a year then tell them how tough it is for you to pay a pittence more for your pension. All they’ll get is social security, if the left hasn’t destroyed it by then. The CB thing, 25 states don’t have it, nor do federal employees, oh boo flippin hoo… your RIGHTS are being trampled on, that’s why Obama tomorrow will propose giving CB to all federal employees, right? right? Or is he just another Koch lover? For supposedly educated people the teachers, students and assorted union workers are in the gutter crude, vulgar and mean as a Snickers deprived Michael Moore. Show us the sophisticated education professionals and act with some class.. or give up any pretense you’re anything more than selfishly arrogant children screaming I hate you I hate you I hate you over and over… it’s be more discriptive, and honest.

Yep. I am a public school teacher… you hit the nail.

Any working person who is in favor of doing away with collective bargaining, which is essentially their right to organize, is a clueless idiot. We should have stronger worker rights for everyone, not just public employees. There should also be laws limiting personal greed, like salary caps for CEOs and Wall Street tycoons. America used to be a worker paradise, until the workers became brainwashed by Reagan and everything went downhill from there.

Jon Stewart, for telling the truth as it is, should be getting an annual salary of 1 Billion dollars per year. You got to give it to Fox Now’s Roger Ailes though, he knows when to lay low and when to give everyone the hose job. When Allianz Global from Germany hears how faithful all of their cohorts are including Fox News in the USA, I believe Christmas Bonuses are in order however; that is assuming the earth doesn’t tilt anymore on its axis before Christmas.

Jon Stewart; this episode should be put on TV and played over and over and over and over and over, again, and again, and again, and again and again until the whole wide world is talking about it. I don’t think you understand the true impact it will have on worldwide truth, understanding acceptance along with steering the world into a better place for everyone. All of this through true understanding and acceptance.