Democrats never fail to place someone in the White House who completely lives up to their official mascot, a JACKASS.

Obama was born in Hawaii, but that doesn’t mean he should not show his REAL birth certificate. The American people are getting tired of his and his shills excuses.

Trump and Wisconsin Governor Walker don’t back down!

It’s bold and historic!

put simply? Obama created this mess for himself. All of his college papers are off limits? Really? Why? No birth certificate? Why?

Now, do I believe he was born in the US? Honestly, I have wrestled with this. I want to believe but it is extremely hard. I wish it wasn’t. But again, he created the mess. And he alone can make it go away.

He’s a really smart guy. You can tell because he said so.

Donald Trump and Orly Taitz 2012! I’ve been saying it all along.

gordonbloyershow said:
Obama was born in Hawaii, but that doesn’t mean he should not show his REAL birth certificate. The American people are getting tired of his and his shills excuses.

It’s proven by experts at factcheck.org and every other legitimate site. In both Hawaii Newspapers, etc. He should’nt appease the wackos.

If I were Trump I’d personally call Barack out on the birth certificate, college credentials cover up.

He should be the host of ” Saturday Night Live ” and challenge Obama to ‘ show me yours and I’ll show you mine.

Every Republican candidate ought to carry and proudly show and discuss their own birth certificates at each and every stop along the campaign trail. At the same time encouraging the democratic candidates to follow suite if they’ve got nothing to hide.

glenn113 said:
It’s proven by experts at factcheck.org and every other legitimate site. In both Hawaii Newspapers, etc. He should’nt appease the wackos.

factcheck.org is a liberal group sponsored by the Annenberg Foundation.

Trump, most of the GOP whackos and most who post here are just plain stupid. We’re in 3 wars and the country is screwed. We could use some outside help.

PS: I bet Barack smoked a half a pack and Michelle ate a whole strawberry cheesecake by herself today. They can run ( away ) from the truth, but they can no longer hide. Besides, don’t they realize it will set them free?

I mean sure they’ll have to move to France or Venezuela, but hey it was fun ( for them anyway ) while it lasted.

huntingtonboy said:
Trump, most of the GOP whackos and most who post here are just plain stupid. We’re in 3 wars and the country is screwed. We could use some outside help.

huh? Are you saying it is a good thing if he was born outside of the US?

Trump has enough money, can he please start his own network? And stay there? He’s not interesting.

gordonbloyershow said:
Obama was born in Hawaii, but that doesn’t mean he should not show his REAL birth certificate. The American people are getting tired of his and his shills excuses.

It’s past your bedtime, you fat, bucktoothed, old fart. No go crawl under your blanky with your bottle of vodka and have wet dreams about birth certificates.

LOL

It starting

This is going to be the most HILARIOUS campaign. I CAN’T WAIT until Trump uses his LITTLE CATCHPHRASE out on the trail, and watching the Trumpettes GO WILD

Will provide LOLS for miles.

And the press is trying to compare him to Palin. AS IF

Trump is NOT AFRAID to go on each and every television interview that would have him.
Imagine the impending LOLs. CAN’T WAIT

Here are a few things that go through an honest persons mind when told that not even the Governor of Hawaii can be privy to the original birth record of the sitting POTUS.

The question is why would our president withold consent?
Obama witholds his consent because….. That is what someone who despises the Constitution would do.
Obama witholds his consent because….. That is what someone who has contempt for Americans would do.
Obama witholds his consent because….. That is what a Democrat would do.
Obama witholds his consent because….. The dear old family friend and Governor means nothing to him.
Obama witholds his consent because….. That is what an enemy to the truth would do.
Obama witholds his consent because….. That’s what someone who has something to hide would do.
Obama witholds his consent because….. That’s what one does to punish his enemies (the American people)….would do.
Obama witholds his consent because….. That’s what someone who is protecting other dishonest people would do.
Obama witholds his consent because….. (Go ahead fill in the blank, but none of it is honest admit it.)

Oh but that is just Crazy Talk.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xryXpK042pQ

Zoe

juan said:
factcheck.org is a liberal group sponsored by the Annenberg Foundation.

OMG!! You are right! Look at the RADICAL LINKS HERE!!

http://www.annenbergfoundation.org/about/

And I quote:

“Established in 1989 by publisher, ambassador and philanthropist Walter H. Annenberg.:

And who is the Annenber…and who ARE HIS RADICAL LEFTIST ASSOCIATES????

Look the the two people in the picture on THIS PAGE:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walter_Annenberg

(Well we DO know that one sold weapons to Iran….)

Ok, silly people. Calm down and take your meds.

glenn113 said:
It’s proven by experts at factcheck.org and every other legitimate site. In both Hawaii Newspapers, etc. He should’nt appease the wackos.

The two Hawaii newspaper thingy could actually turn out to be a canard.

Grandparents lived in Hawaii at the time and all newspapers will list a simple birth announcement, such as wa the case with young Barackio, as a courtesy.

My Mom , in New Jersey had done the same thing with each of her six grandchildren, four of which live in other states.

\
Try calling your local papers to inquire about placing a birth announcement and you’ll see the Barack Houdini Obama mystery of the ” how the hell did his birth announcement get in two different Hawaian newspapers back then, like they knew he was going to lie and run for president someday even though he was really born in Kenya ” solved right before your very eyes. ewwwwwww ( scary ghost sound )

WHarropson said:
Here are a few things that go through an honest persons mind when told that not even the Governor of Hawaii can be privy to the original birth record of the sitting POTUS.

Yeah, you see, that is the thing about privacy laws. They are there to keep people from violating your privacy. Like, for example, if the next President is a Reublican born in say, Maryland (for example), you really don’t want the Governor of Maryland sniffing around the new President’s personal records (especially if that person were a Democrat).

Don’t like Obama all you want. It is totally your right. Just don’t pretend that his privacy is somehow different than a President from your team.

Barack Must Go said:
The two Hawaii newspaper thingy could actually turn out to be a canard. Grandparents lived in Hawaii at the time and all newspapers will list a simple birth announcement, such as wa the case with young Barackio, as a courtesy. My Mom , in New Jersey had done the same thing with each of her six grandchildren, four of which live in other states. \Try calling your local papers to inquire about placing a birth announcement and you’ll see the Barack Houdini Obama mystery of the ” how the hell did his birth announcement get in two different Hawaian newspapers back then, like they knew he was going to lie and run for president someday even though he was really born in Kenya ” solved right before your very eyes. ewwwwwww ( scary ghost sound )

This is the kind of crap I love. It goes to show no matter what the evidence is, you people will attempt to discount it. He could have a video of Obama coming out of his mother’s lady parts and being caught by Ronald Reagan holding a dated newspaper and the Constitution and you;d doubt it.

Crazy people. All of you.

ALL BIRTHERS ARE NOT PRO-LIFERS

FACT

gordonbloyershow said:
Obama was born in Hawaii, but that doesn’t mean he should not show his REAL birth certificate. The American people are getting tired of his and his shills excuses.

He doesn’t show it for a reason. Too keep this birther issue alive so dumbass teabaggers play into it.

Thanks for putting the wrapper up there, Frances. :)

catfishjuggling said:
This is the kind of crap I love. It goes to show no matter what the evidence is, you people will attempt to discount it. He could have a video of Obama coming out of his mother’s lady parts and being caught by Ronald Reagan holding a dated newspaper and the Constitution and you;d doubt it. Crazy people. All of you.

Crazy is as crazy does you know and I get the sense you are actually crying right now?

Please, just calm down, take a few deep breaths, come up from the cellar and go sit in the closet where you’ve erected your secret shrine to president Obama, light a few candles and a stick of that patchouli incenseyou love so much. Before you know it your mind will be clear, and your soul rejuvinated.

Barack Must Go said:
Crazy is as crazy does you know and I get the sense you are actually crying right now? Please, just calm down, take a few deep breaths, come up from the cellar and go sit in the closet where you’ve erected your secret shrine to president Obama, light a few candles and a stick of that patchouli incenseyou love so much. Before you know it your mind will be clear, and your soul rejuvinated.

Sorry. I would like to see him go. But facts are facts. He presented his birth certificate. All the word gynastics around the facts or ad hominem attacks on people with whom you disagree won’t change them.

I am actually firmly in the Mitch Daniels camp in 2012. The man is the real deal in fiscal game and he has called for a truce in the culture war bs (which is the main reason I stopped voting Republican after years of doing so). I’m actually more upset about you nutcase because you’re going to make the next election about stupid crap like this instead of what matters.

So go ahead and live in your crazyville. Dream that anyone in reality is an Obama mark. Whatever,

Hell, Gordon Bloyer and I agree on two things:

Obama was born in Hawaii and Mitch Daniels would be a good President.

Maybe there is hope for us all.

He’s a moooooslim knee-grow….. He’s not one of us!!!!!!!

PS….. Dragger-baggers, 1 in 6 Americans, yes AMERICANS, is now Hispanic (and this % is only growing). This combined with all the other minorities you offend…. Exactly how do you plan on winning national elections in the future?

So the guy that opened Al Capone’s vaults and got beat up by skinheads is interviewing a guy with sideways hair and bankrupted two casinos, only on Fox weekend, I think I would rather watch Lock Up.

This is a classic. Trump says well the Honululu Newspaper didn’t publish his birth until after he was born? Well, Trump. I would hope so.

Barack Must Go said:
If I were Trump I’d personally call Barack out on the birth certificate, college credentials cover up.

He should be the host of ” Saturday Night Live ” and challenge Obama to ‘ show me yours and I’ll show you mine.

Every Republican candidate ought to carry and proudly show and discuss their own birth certificates at each and every stop along the campaign trail. At the same time encouraging the democratic candidates to follow suite if they’ve got nothing to hide.

I think Obama was born here, but I think the real birth certificate has something embarrassing on it. One theory is that it has “white/Caucasian” checked and/or his name is listed as Barry.

One of the other things that Trump points out is how little we really know about Obama. The media ignored the questions. But with Palin, they sent a phalanx of investigators and lawyers to dig into her past.

As much as I wanted this to go away, Obama should have put this to rest years ago by releasing it. Do we really know if Obama is telling the truth?

catfishjuggling said:
This is the kind of crap I love. It goes to show no matter what the evidence is, you people will attempt to discount it. He could have a video of Obama coming out of his mother’s lady parts and being caught by Ronald Reagan holding a dated newspaper and the Constitution and you;d doubt it.

Crazy people. All of you.

Seems the only evidence people are asking for is a birth certificate.  If it’s not unreasonable to ask to see one’s birth certificate to obtain a passport, certainly it can’t be unreasonable to ask to see the birth certificate of someone who is trying to obtain the office of the President of the United States.

Dem4Ever said:
Seems the only evidence people are asking for is a birth certificate. If it’s not unreasonable to ask to see one’s birth certificate to obtain a passport, certainly it can’t be unreasonable to ask to see the birth certificate of someone who is trying to obtain the office of the President of the United States.

His birth certificate can be seen right on the internet for those smart enough to find it. It’s the same kind of birth certificate you or I have. So get over it.

Dem4Ever said:
Seems the only evidence people are asking for is a birth certificate.  If it’s not unreasonable to ask to see one’s birth certificate to obtain a passport, certainly it can’t be unreasonable to ask to see the birth certificate of someone who is trying to obtain the office of the President of the United States.

I’m pretty sure the President has a passport.

There are a couple of million reasons BHO does not want something published about him.

Those two million reasons are called US Dollars…the ones he has spent keep this “information” sealed.

And Geraldo….this guy is a joke. I am over him… Actually, I have been over him for years. FOX needs to replace him and get an honest to goodness liberal in there not a RINO posing as one.

glenn113 said:
It’s proven by experts at factcheck.org and every other legitimate site. In both Hawaii Newspapers, etc. He should’nt appease the wackos.

The fact is, it doesn’t matter if he was born in the U.S., his mother was a citizen and that is all that is needed. That doesn’t give him an excuse for not showing his birth certificate.

Dem4Ever said:
Seems the only evidence people are asking for is a birth certificate.  If it’s not unreasonable to ask to see one’s birth certificate to obtain a passport, certainly it can’t be unreasonable to ask to see the birth certificate of someone who is trying to obtain the office of the President of the United States.

Here is the certificate of live birth that as a matter of law constitutes proof of Obama’s Hawaiian birth. http://static.politifact.com.s3.amazonaws.com/graphics/birthCertObama.jpg If you question that fact, you question Hawaiian law, the doctrine of full faith and credit, and the 10th Amendment. By asking for more proof than is required by law, to wit: the long form birth certificate, you seek to violate Obama’s right to privacy. No way Obama should be giving in on this issue.

gordonbloyershow said:
The fact is, it doesn’t matter if he was born in the U.S., his mother was a citizen and that is all that is needed. That doesn’t give him an excuse for not showing his birth certificate.

How do you figure? Obama has complied with the law, and provided legal proof of his birth, according to the State of Hawaii. You seek more than is required by law in direct violation of Obama’s right to privacy.

louda said:
He doesn’t show it for a reason. Too keep this birther issue alive so dumbass teabaggers play into it.

LOL, that game is over. He was born in Hawaii. His mother was a citizen so it really doesn’t matter. The law now and then makes him a citizen no matter where he was born. That is no longer the point. He won’t release it, THAT is the point. He won’t release his grades. The little boy is a phony and he is covering up something. THAT is the POINT. I don’t care if he ever releases it. It just makes him look like a liar and a fool.

gordonbloyershow said:
LOL, that game is over. He was born in Hawaii. His mother was a citizen so it really doesn’t matter. The law now and then makes him a citizen no matter where he was born. That is no longer the point. He won’t release it, THAT is the point. He won’t release his grades. The little boy is a phony and he is covering up something. THAT is the POINT. I don’t care if he ever releases it. It just makes him look like a liar and a fool.

Your spending too much time watching TMZ. In fact people do have a right to privacy. In this case, under Hawaiian law, Obama has no obligation to release his long form birth certificate. You condemn Obama merely because he chooses to exercise his constitutional right to privacy. Like a policeman who believes that exercising 5th amendment rights constitutes proof of some kind of guilt.

I love how mediaite is obsessed with this story; I so remember when the media was screaming for more papers from W regarding the National Guard – W had no right to privacy, and even though he released all his papers, the media still wasn’t happy and wanted to see more so they just made stuff up, falsified government documents and then had a news expose about them. To this day, that idiot Rather believes his falsified documents tell the truth….and yet, nothing, we can’t ask the same level of disclosure from hehimselftheone becuase he is their obamasiah.

it is disgusting.

Go Trump, start laughiing in all of their faces….

and and who is Stephen Lerner and why hasn’t mediaite done a single story on him yet? Eh?

Bias, liberal bias.

Donald Trump is a desperate nobody who is earning a whopping 1% of the republican primary vote in the latest Gallup poll.

possibly said:
Donald Trump is a desperate nobody who is earning a whopping 1% of the republican primary vote in the latest Gallup poll.

Well Trump is about self promotion and he is getting a ton of hits on his name, which is how he makes money. But Trump knows that 51% of the republicans are birthers, so he is going after the birther block, with Huck. All he needs is a few percentage points and he can milk this promotional stunt for months.

valkyrie101 said:
people do have a right to privacy. In this case, under Hawaiian law, Obama has no obligation to release his long form birth certificate. You condemn Obama merely because he chooses to exercise his constitutional right to privacy. Like a policeman who believes that exercising 5th amendment rights constitutes proof of some kind of guilt.

People have NO right to refuse to prove their compliance with the US Constitution when claiming to be legally qualified for the Presidency. How idiotic. And your reference to the 5th Amendment is equally as idiotic…………..OF COURSE the guilty aren’t forced to testify against themselves, and the innocent have nothing to hide.

You Dims are so dizzy from having to spin everything that ends up as a news topic that it’s no wonder you’re so……….well…………..dim. Maybe a more appropriate term for your party is DizzyCrat, rather than Demoncrit.

Frikkin awesome. A guy with tons of clout and nothing to lose takes on the birth thing. Been waiting for it.

valkyrie101 said:
Your spending too much time watching TMZ. In fact people do have a right to privacy. In this case, under Hawaiian law, Obama has no obligation to release his long form birth certificate. You condemn Obama merely because he chooses to exercise his constitutional right to privacy. Like a policeman who believes that exercising 5th amendment rights constitutes proof of some kind of guilt.

YOU are an idiot. I don’t condemn Obama for anything. I am pointing out he is making a stupid political decision. He thinks this is helping make his opponents look like idiots but that is turning around. The American people have to show their birth certificates all the time. They understand that if you want to be president, YOU have NO privacy.
Even the Gov. of Hawaii tried to put this to rest. Even and idiot like Chris Matthews is tired of defending an indefenceable position.
Show the document and get it over with.
Many polititions have been FORCED to give up private documents. Divorce papers, college term papers, tax records and on and on. If you don’t you will pay.
Like I said I don’t care what he does but tide has turned on his stonewalling.

valkyrie101 said:
Your spending too much time watching TMZ.

LOL. Hmmm? I don’t know what TMZ is and I have never watched it. You need help.

gordonbloyershow said:
I am pointing out he is making a stupid political decision. He thinks this is helping make his opponents look like idiots but that is turning around.

Correct. It did help at first, but by now, most people are thinking, “just show us the goddam thing”.

Also, “candidate” Trump would have standing. Fun times!

Maybe Trump is just “screwing” with the President. After all, this bloated, shuffling old fool who shames the University of Pennsylvania every time he mentions it, loves to screw foreign bodies.
Ivana, Marla, Melania….they all end in the letter “a” (ObamA), and two of those are very definitely NOT American born…. (Ivana and Melania, in case you were wondering which two).
Trump’s name is mud with this new game he’s playing. He’s always been a scam artist, but this new ploy takes it to a whole new level.
Screw you, Trump.

TruGal said:
After all, this bloated, shuffling old fool who shames the University of Pennsylvania every time he mentions it, loves to screw foreign bodies.

Ah yes, if you have nothing intelligent to say, attack the messenger. What a dolt.

catfishjuggling said:
I am actually firmly in the Mitch Daniels camp in 2012. The man is the real deal in fiscal game and he has called for a truce in the culture war bs (which is the main reason I stopped voting Republican after years of doing so).

I agree, except that I vote Republican in spite of my disagreement with many of them on social issues. I believe that fiscal issues are more important on a national level. And I think that’s where the GOP is shooting itself in the foot: It’s doubtful that they can win a general election with a socially conservative candidate.

There’s nothing wrong with being socially conservative, but the federal government should stay out of social issues for the most part. Leave it to the states. Then people can choose to live in states that have social policies with which they agree, without having policies with which they disagree being forced upon them.

Keep up the great work Donald, if for nothing else , then the daily Tingles head explosion.

Obama chose to let this continue , blame him.

It’s no secret he to told Gov Abercrombie NOT to release it , for political points.

He’s not releasing the original birth certificate because it will show that he was adopted by Lolo Soetoro, which would probably make him an Indonesian citizen. As for what he did release: very easily forgeable.

Magister said:
I’m pretty sure the President has a passport.

Surely, you know you don’t have to be a US citizen to obtain a passport.

catfishjuggling said:
Sorry. I would like to see him go. But facts are facts. He presented his birth certificate. All the word gynastics around the facts or ad hominem attacks on people with whom you disagree won’t change them. I am actually firmly in the Mitch Daniels camp in 2012. The man is the real deal in fiscal game and he has called for a truce in the culture war bs (which is the main reason I stopped voting Republican after years of doing so). I’m actually more upset about you nutcase because you’re going to make the next election about stupid crap like this instead of what matters. So go ahead and live in your crazyville. Dream that anyone in reality is an Obama mark. Whatever, Hell, Gordon Bloyer and I agree on two things: Obama was born in Hawaii and Mitch Daniels would be a good President. Maybe there is hope for us all.

Is this the first time you’ve admitted to being a card carrying democrat here at Mediaite? I’ve only been here a few days, during that time you’ve done nothing but vilify Republicans / conservatives, while at the same time professing ( swearing ) thatyou are one.

I bet you’re that guy / gal that calls into C-Span on the Republican line, only then you proceed to bash us and profess your undying love of Barack Obama…….right?

gordonbloyershow said:
The fact is, it doesn’t matter if he was born in the U.S., his mother was a citizen and that is all that is needed. That doesn’t give him an excuse for not showing his birth certificate.

I thought both parents had to be US Citizens who had resided in the US for at least 5 years before the birth. I’m not sure and too lazy this Sunday morning to look it up.

the real john t said:
His birth certificate can be seen right on the internet for those smart enough to find it. It’s the same kind of birth certificate you or I have. So get over it.

Sorry to disappoint you but, a certificate of live birth is NOT a birth certificate, nor is a certificate of live birth accepted by the Department of State for the purposes of obtaining a passport. So maybe you are the one who should “get over it”.

Dem4Ever said:
Seems the only evidence people are asking for is a birth certificate.  If it’s not unreasonable to ask to see one’s birth certificate to obtain a passport, certainly it can’t be unreasonable to ask to see the birth certificate of someone who is trying to obtain the office of the President of the United States.

He provided a birth certificate.

Here is it right here:

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html

The end,

valkyrie101 said:
Here is the certificate of live birth that as a matter of law constitutes proof of Obama’s Hawaiian birth. http://static.politifact.com.s3.amazonaws.com/graphics/birthCertObama.jpg If you question that fact, you question Hawaiian law, the doctrine of full faith and credit, and the 10th Amendment. By asking for more proof than is required by law, to wit: the long form birth certificate, you seek to violate Obama’s right to privacy. No way Obama should be giving in on this issue.

This is not about Hawaiian law.  It is about US constitutional law.  This is about Obama’s birth certificate and a certificate of live birth is not a birth certificate.  If he tried to pull this with the Department of State they would deny him even a passport.  Clearly, it’s not too much to ask to see his birth certificate.  If he is just embarrassed about something on his birth certificate then he can turn it over to the Supreme Court and let them see it and issue a report.

Barack Must Go said:
Is this the first time you’ve admitted to being a card carrying democrat here at Mediaite? I’ve only been here a few days, during that time you’ve done nothing but vilify Republicans / conservatives, while at the same time professing ( swearing ) thatyou are one.

I bet you’re that guy / gal that calls into C-Span on the Republican line, only then you proceed to bash us and profess your undying love of Barack Obama…….right?

Yes. You busted me. I am a guy who has voted for both Republicans and Democrats.

I am a horrible person.

Dem4Ever said:
Sorry to disappoint you but, a certificate of live birth is NOT a birth certificate, nor is a certificate of live birth accepted by the Department of State for the purposes of obtaining a passport. So maybe you are the one who should “get over it”.

Yes. It is.

Then end,

catfishjuggling said:
Yes. You busted me. I am a guy who has voted for both Republicans and Democrats.

I am a horrible person.

I think is is perfect commentary about the stupid tribal state of some the comment on here that in a post where I said I was in the Mitch Daniels camp for 2012 (who the lat time I checked was the Republican Governor of Indiana), I am accused of being a Democratic hack. Nice.

I would like to see someone else as President. But if the Republicans keep being a party of conspiracy theories and professional grievances (WAH! They are holding us down–lefty media) and don’t get back to being a party of idea and solutions then not only will vote for the Democrat this year (so will most of America).

Live in your dreamland wherein that makes me a hack. Whatever.

But facts are facts, He has produced a birth certificate.

catfishjuggling said:
He provided a birth certificate. Here is it right here: http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html The end,

Easy to forge. He is a Chicago Democrat after all.

He was adopted by Lolo Soetoro, which is why his mom asked the State Department to remove him from her passport, which is why he was registered in his Indonesian school as “Barry Soetoro”.

Nowhere near the end.

catfishjuggling said:
I would like to see someone else as President. But if the Republicans keep being a party of conspiracy theories and professional grievances (WAH! They are holding us down–lefty media) and don’t get back to being a party of idea and solutions then not only will vote for the Democrat this year (so will most of America).

Cue catfishjuggling’s claim that he” be called a Rino in 3…..2………OW8

Davo said:
People have NO right to refuse to prove their compliance with the US Constitution when claiming to be legally qualified for the Presidency. How idiotic. And your reference to the 5th Amendment is equally as idiotic…………..OF COURSE the guilty aren’t forced to testify against themselves, and the innocent have nothing to hide.
You Dims are so dizzy from having to spin everything that ends up as a news topic that it’s no wonder you’re so……….well…………..dim. Maybe a more appropriate term for your party is DizzyCrat, rather than Demoncrit.

Your problem is that you refuse to accept Hawaiian law which definitively certified that Obama was born there. Thus, you refuse to give full faith and credit to Hawaii, and seek to question the rights reserved to Hawaii by the 10th Amendment. Obama has, of course, fully complied with Federal law too, which routinely accepts as proof of natural born citizenship the short form birth certificate that Obama provided. Why should Obama be required to provide more than the law requires?

just wow said:
Cue catfishjuggling’s claim that he” be called a Rino in 3…..2………OW8

HA !

Dem4Ever said:
This is not about Hawaiian law.  It is about US constitutional law.  This is about Obama’s birth certificate and a certificate of live birth is not a birth certificate.  If he tried to pull this with the Department of State they would deny him even a passport.  Clearly, it’s not too much to ask to see his birth certificate.  If he is just embarrassed about something on his birth certificate then he can turn it over to the Supreme Court and let them see it and issue a report.

This is about the 10th Amendment, and Hawaii’s right to determine who was born there or not. In fact, Obama provided certification of his birth as provided by, and deemed sufficient by, the State of Hawaii. Rejection of that certification by any state would constitute a failure to grant full faith and credit to Hawaiian law.

Barack Must Go said:
If I were Trump I’d personally call Barack out on the birth certificate, college credentials cover up. He should be the host of ” Saturday Night Live ” and challenge Obama to ‘ show me yours and I’ll show you mine. Every Republican candidate ought to carry and proudly show and discuss their own birth certificates at each and every stop along the campaign trail. At the same time encouraging the democratic candidates to follow suite if they’ve got nothing to hide.

I challenge Obama to have Trump release all those old radio interviews with Howard Stern! There are some classics in those…

huntingtonboy said:
Trump, most of the GOP whackos and most who post here are just plain stupid. We’re in 3 wars and the country is screwed. We could use some outside help.

Agree. Let the GOP put on their combat boots and go at Libyia alone. We’ll hold their coats.http://www.nhgazette.com/chickenhawks/

http://www.nhgazette.com/chickenhawks/

valkyrie101 said:
Your problem is that you refuse to accept Hawaiian law which definitively certified that Obama was born there. Thus, you refuse to give full faith and credit to Hawaii, and seek to question the rights reserved to Hawaii by the 10th Amendment.

Where was the 10th amendment when the governor of Hawaii so much as admitted that the birth certificate has NOT been produced, by promising to produce it himself? Of course, he later recanted saying that Obama wouldn’t let him. Darn the luck.

Face it, Dim, this President is a scam from the get-go. He has a scripted history and was put into power by dark and shadowy forces as a figurehead for their evil. How else can so much damage be done to America in such a short amount of time by a President with no known associates from his past, no qualifications other than social agitator, and no time “on-the-job” serving anything remotely resembling our American culture? The only ‘hints’ at who he is are bad ones………………Jeremiah Wright, Bill Ayers, George Soros, Van Jones, Cass Sunstein, et al.

Face it, Dim, you voted for and must continue to support a LIE. And you did it because you have nothing but emotionalism that drives your thoughts…………..no logic or common sense.

valkyrie101 said:
This is about the 10th Amendment, and Hawaii’s right to determine who was born there or not. In fact, Obama provided certification of his birth as provided by, and deemed sufficient by, the State of Hawaii. Rejection of that certification by any state would constitute a failure to grant full faith and credit to Hawaiian law.

It doesn’t matter if he was born in Hawaii. I think he was. When Lolo Soetoro adopted him he became an Indonesian citizen. That is why his mom removed him from her passport. That is why he won’t release the original birth certificate because when you’re adopted, your new parent or parents are listed as your birth parents. I should know. I adopted two kids myself.

Bill Huggins said:
LOL It starting This is going to be the most HILARIOUS campaign. I CAN’T WAIT until Trump uses his LITTLE CATCHPHRASE out on the trail, and watching the Trumpettes GO WILD Will provide LOLS for miles. And the press is trying to compare him to Palin. AS IF Trump is NOT AFRAID to go on each and every television interview that would have him.Imagine the impending LOLs. CAN’T WAIT

Wasn’t it Trump that use to go around bragging about every girl he would meet he would have a condom with him 24/7. Because all the girls chasing him around, etc……. I wonder which rock Trump is going to run to hide under…lol

Twinsdad46 said:
Easy to forge. He is a Chicago Democrat after all. He was adopted by Lolo Soetoro, which is why his mom asked the State Department to remove him from her passport, which is why he was registered in his Indonesian school as “Barry Soetoro”. Nowhere near the end.

This is what I am saying about you nutcases.

He forged this?

Then freaking charge him with a crime?

So in your nutcase brain he was such an evil mind that he thought to forge a fake certificate of live birth? But he was too stupid to forge a “long form?”

You are just ridiculous.

And this is why it doesn’t matter what he does, you won’t believe him.

Here is what rational people say: “I dont support the President. I think he is doing a bad job. I will not vote for him.” These are statements that are in reality. Here is what crazy people say: “He hasn’t produced his birth certificate.”

my mom has never seen her original birth certificate – it is sealed, and she has to obtain a lawyer to view it. She was adopted and the original BC was sealed, and she was issued a new one that has my grandparents listed as her parents. She found out at 45 that she was actually adopted. She obtained a passport and all of her documents using her official BC, but not her REAL birth certificate.

So, I think if Obama was adopted by Lolo Soetoro, which I think is a safe assumption based on his name at school being Barry Soetoro, and that they moved to Indonesia. If his mom was Stanley Ann Soetoro, Barry may have had the same name to travel out of the country with his parents…? So, if he was adopted, his birth certificate might have been changed to Barry Soetoro. If he was born and named Barack Hussien Obama II, and then adopted, that BC might be sealed…? He could have changed his name back to BHO when he got older, which is how he got his COLB.

My point about my mom, though, is that it is possible for BO to get his COLB and passport without ever seeing his REAL birth certificate – my mom did. My mom’s COLB doesn’t represent her real birth at all. She has no actual real proof of where she was born, or who the doctor was.

I also never believed the BO COLB because it appeared on Daily Kos first. It is easily faked, as we have seen repeatedly on the internet.

I still don’t think he was born in Kenya, I don’t believe his mother would have traveled there to give birth. But, I do think it is weird he just won’t release it. As I have said before, I think it has to do with his adoption, or how it lists his parents relationship, or religion or his name, or something. It’s just weird he won’t release it. Especially now that this issue is growing, and getting louder. And the polls are showing more people doubt his eligibility.

just wow said:
Cue catfishjuggling’s claim that he” be called a Rino in 3…..2………OW8

Now that is comedy. Well done (As he begins his slow clap….)

glenn113 said:
I challenge Obama to have Trump release all those old radio interviews with Howard Stern! There are some classics in those…

” Media ( really doesn’t ) Matters ” is already on it.

Barack Must Go said:
The two Hawaii newspaper thingy could actually turn out to be a canard. Grandparents lived in Hawaii at the time and all newspapers will list a simple birth announcement, such as wa the case with young Barackio, as a courtesy. My Mom , in New Jersey had done the same thing with each of her six grandchildren, four of which live in other states. \Try calling your local papers to inquire about placing a birth announcement and you’ll see the Barack Houdini Obama mystery of the ” how the hell did his birth announcement get in two different Hawaian newspapers back then, like they knew he was going to lie and run for president someday even though he was really born in Kenya ” solved right before your very eyes. ewwwwwww ( scary ghost sound )

Fact is, is that the Honolulu newspapers released the birth announcements on their own. Not at anyone else’s request. So, all the newspapers in Honolulu had this conspiracy going that this baby is going to run for President one day……….This whole birther thing was kinda funny in the beginning but now it’s just wacked. Go ask that Colonel who went to the hoosegow and is now wearing a carrot suite for believing the same garbage. Or he will be soon.

catfishjuggling said:
This is what I am saying about you nutcases. He forged this? Then freaking charge him with a crime? So in your nutcase brain he was such an evil mind that he thought to forge a fake certificate of live birth? But he was too stupid to forge a “long form?” You are just ridiculous. And this is why it doesn’t matter what he does, you won’t believe him. Here is what rational people say: “I dont support the President. I think he is doing a bad job. I will not vote for him.” These are statements that are in reality. Here is what crazy people say: “He hasn’t produced his birth certificate.”

The article is about his birth certificate, not his job performance, so that’s why I commented on it.

I am not a prosecutor. I can’t charge anyone with a crime.

catfishjuggling said:
Now that is comedy. Well done (As he begins his slow clap….)

You are the countdown King .

huntingtonboy said:
Trump, most of the GOP whackos and most who post here are just plain stupid. We’re in 3 wars and the country is screwed. We could use some outside help.

Yep, 3 wars. The POTUS faid to end one as promised. escalated the 2nd war and started the third war. If republicans are whackos that must make O-Bomb-A chief whacko…LOL

Twinsdad46 said:
It doesn’t matter if he was born in Hawaii. I think he was. When Lolo Soetoro adopted him he became an Indonesian citizen. That is why his mom removed him from her passport. That is why he won’t release the original birth certificate because when you’re adopted, your new parent or parents are listed as your birth parents. I should know. I adopted two kids myself.

This is is actually pretty easy.

No.

http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/8/1481.html

obtaining naturalization in a foreign state upon his own application or upon an application filed by a duly authorized agent, after having attained the age of eighteen years

You can’t give up your nationality until you’re 18. There is a very simple reason for this. If my child were kindnapped and taken to Brazil against his will by his mother, he is still American.

Sorry. Try again.

sarainitaly said:
I do think it is weird he just won’t release it. As I have said before, I think it has to do with his adoption, or how it lists his parents relationship, or religion or his name, or something. It’s just weird he won’t release it. Especially now that this issue is growing, and getting louder. And the polls are showing more people doubt his eligibility.

“”The nature of the evidence is irrelevant. It’s the seriousness of the charge.”- – Nancy Pelosi

“In this case, it’s BOTH.” – - Davo

Dem4Ever said:
Yep, 3 wars. The POTUS faid to end one as promised. escalated the 2nd war and started the third war. If republicans are whackos that must make O-Bomb-A chief whacko…LOL

dems in charge: war is noble & good, casualties are to be expected.
repubs in charge: war is evil, brown people are dying for America’s oil & greed

This is how they think, act and truly believe.

valkyrie101 said:
Your spending too much time watching TMZ. In fact people do have a right to privacy. In this case, under Hawaiian law, Obama has no obligation to release his long form birth certificate. You condemn Obama merely because he chooses to exercise his constitutional right to privacy. Like a policeman who believes that exercising 5th amendment rights constitutes proof of some kind of guilt.

Correct. Now if Obama pleads the 5th, 78 times like Tricky Ricky Scott did down here in FL at a deposition into the largest medicare fraud case taking advantage of the seniors, which was the largest in U.S. history. Then I’d say Obama has something to hide.

catfishjuggling said:
Yes. You busted me. I am a guy who has voted for both Republicans and Democrats. I am a horrible person.

…..and there is nothing wrong with doing so, this still is America, so far.

What is not OK is omitting that fact, ( you know the one where you are currently a, somewhat confused, card carrying democrat, probably even voted for Obama ) then subjecting the rest of us to your Dr. Jekll & Mr. Hyde, love…hate act regarding the Republican ideology / party, as well as fellow conservative ( which you clearly are not ) posters.

Aside from that, I’m pretty much cool with everything else you’ve been saying since I’ve been at this sight.

glenn113 said:
Correct. Now if Obama pleads the 5th, 78 times like Tricky Ricky Scott did down here in FL at a deposition into the largest medicare fraud case taking advantage of the seniors, which was the largest in U.S. history. Then I’d say Obama has something to hide.

Sad fact is, Obama could slit the throats of 5 people in front of you and 10 TV cameras and you simply wouldn’t believe it.

Barack Must Go said:
…..and there is nothing wrong with doing so, this still is America, so far. What is not OK is omitting that fact, ( you know the one where you are currently a, somewhat confused, card carrying democrat, probably even voted for Obama ) then subjecting the rest of us to your Dr. Jekll & Mr. Hyde, love…hate act regarding the Republican ideology / party, as well as fellow conservative ( which you clearly are not ) posters. Aside from that, I’m pretty much cool with everything else you’ve been saying since I’ve been at this sight.

I didn’t realize one needed to provide a curriculum vitae to post here. But, given this crowd, even if I posted one I am sure no one would believe it. Apparently your comments are only believed if you blindly follow your party instead of voting your conscience? Duly noted.

timzank said:
dems in charge: war is noble & good, casualties are to be expected.repubs in charge: war is evil, brown people are dying for America’s oil & greed This is how they think, act and truly believe.

There is not one person here honestly, with a psycho like Gaddafi and his sons, saying they are going to massacre every man, women and child to their last drop of blood and hunt them down in their houses that would not have taken action. He immediatly had the means to do it and it would have been done in 12 hrs. had not the U.S., U.N. made it a point to not let that happen. That’s a fact that nobody here will disagree with if you’re honest. Now what’s going on after that is a matter of opinion and ideology.

catfishjuggling said:
This is is actually pretty easy. No. http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/8/1481.html obtaining naturalization in a foreign state upon his own application or upon an application filed by a duly authorized agent, after having attained the age of eighteen years You can’t give up your nationality until you’re 18. There is a very simple reason for this. If my child were kindnapped and taken to Brazil against his will by his mother, he is still American. Sorry. Try again.

Bad analogy. Your wife I assume is American. Lolo Soetoro was not. When you’re adopted by a foreigner in a foreign country, guess what. You lose your birth citizenship. If you didn’t, then none of those foreign kids who get adopted by Americans would be American citizens.

If you’re right, then why did Stanley Anne Dunham remove 0bama (or whatever his name is) from her US passport and why was he listed as “Barry Soetoro” in his Indonesian school records? These are two very simple questions. Please address them.

timzank said:
Sad fact is, Obama could slit the throats of 5 people in front of you and 10 TV cameras and you simply wouldn’t believe it.</blockquote
Not true. I am deeply troubled with Obama and this whole G.E. corporate tax thing. If all is true and he new all the stuff going on I will call him out and no longer support him. I don't want a plutocrat as a President and if that is what Obama is I will not support him at all.

Twinsdad46 said:
It doesn’t matter if he was born in Hawaii. I think he was. When Lolo Soetoro adopted him he became an Indonesian citizen. That is why his mom removed him from her passport. That is why he won’t release the original birth certificate because when you’re adopted, your new parent or parents are listed as your birth parents. I should know. I adopted two kids myself.

The only issue relates to whether Obama was born in the U.S. or not. If you admit that, then there is no reason for Obama to release any additional information. Obama has the right to privacy.

glenn113 said:

I won’t walk in lockstep with Obama just because I voted for him. If he needs to be called out on something he should be. Too bad the dittoheads aren’t the same with their hero.

Twinsdad46 said:
Bad analogy. Your wife I assume is American. Lolo Soetoro was not. When you’re adopted by a foreigner in a foreign country, guess what. You lose your birth citizenship. If you didn’t, then none of those foreign kids who get adopted by Americans would be American citizens. If you’re right, then why did Stanley Anne Dunham remove 0bama (or whatever his name is) from her US passport and why was he listed as “Barry Soetoro” in his Indonesian school records? These are two very simple questions. Please address them.

No you don’t . His mother is still American. Even if she gave it up it doesn’t change his status.

Again, doesn’t matter. You nutcases make up your own facts as you go.

glenn113 said:
There is not one person here honestly, with a psycho like Gaddafi and his sons, saying they are going to massacre every man, women and child to their last drop of blood and hunt them down in their houses that would not have taken action. He immediatly had the means to do it and it would have been done in 12 hrs. had not the U.S., U.N. made it a point to not let that happen. That’s a fact that nobody here will disagree with if you’re honest. Now what’s going on after that is a matter of opinion and ideology.

War is never ever good. Ask my 87 year Dad who was a WWII Marine veteran who fought in Iwo Jima and Okinawa. I try to ask him stories, etc about the war. In fact a few times I did. He won’t talk about it and still won’t to this day.

lol@ all the stupid white people on here that choose to keep being birthers and blaming Obama for it…..Obama told me to tell you all to kiss his mau mau kenyan black ass, he aint showin you shit. youre making fools out of yourselves and PRESIDENT Obama laughs himself to sleep every nite right after hes done spanking Michelle…..GET A LIFE BAGGERS, Obama aint going anywhere, deal with it

Sorry. I glossed over your last point about the school registration.

My answer is it doesn’t matter. He was 6 years old. The law is pretty clear.

Doesn’t matter. But keep flinging more poo. Something has to stick eventually, right?

glenn113 said:
War is never ever good. Ask my 87 year Dad who was a WWII Marine veteran who fought in Iwo Jima and Okinawa. I try to ask him stories, etc about the war. In fact a few times I did. He won’t talk about it and still won’t to this day.

All he has ever said is that war is sometimes necessary but never ever good or glorious.

We don’t have no Birth Certificates either. But if we did, we would show em to you. Right guys?, guys? Okay, who swiped my wallet?

catfishjuggling said:
Sorry. I glossed over your last point about the school registration. My answer is it doesn’t matter. He was 6 years old. The law is pretty clear. Doesn’t matter. But keep flinging more poo. Something has to stick eventually, right?

You still don’t get it. When a foreigner adopts you in a foreign country, you lose your birth citizenship. Why is that hard to understand?

ProObamaAgenda said:
lol@ all the stupid white people on here that choose to keep being birthers and blaming Obama for it…..Obama told me to tell you all to kiss his mau mau kenyan black ass, he aint showin you shit. youre making fools out of yourselves and PRESIDENT Obama laughs himself to sleep every nite right after hes done spanking Michelle…..GET A LIFE BAGGERS, Obama aint going anywhere, deal with it

I agree. I just like going on this birther board for entertainment on a Sunday morning once in awhile.

Davo said:
Where was the 10th amendment when the governor of Hawaii so much as admitted that the birth certificate has NOT been produced, by promising to produce it himself? Of course, he later recanted saying that Obama wouldn’t let him. Darn the luck.

Hawaiian law, like most other states, does not require a long form birth certificate to certify a person’s birth. The short form that Obama provided constitutes proof, as a matter of law, that Obama was born in Hawaii. Why should Obama provide more than the law requires? Sure, inquiring minds may want to know, but the long form birth certificate, under Hawaiian law, is private.

Twinsdad46 said:
You still don’t get it. When a foreigner adopts you in a foreign country, you lose your birth citizenship. Why is that hard to understand?

NOT WHEN HE IS MARRIED TO YOUR MOTHER WHO IS A FREAKING AMERICAN!

catfishjuggling said:
NOT WHEN HE IS MARRIED TO YOUR MOTHER WHO IS A FREAKING AMERICAN!

Again. I realize I am quoting something CRAZY here like the law and all, but:

obtaining naturalization in a foreign state upon his own application or upon an application filed by a duly authorized agent, after having attained the age of eighteen years

EVEN IF HE WERE ADOPTED BY TWO FOREIGNER NATIONALS, he would still hold his citizenship until he renounced it at 18.

THAT IS THE LAW!

catfishjuggling said:
Now that is comedy. Well done (As he begins his slow clap….)

No likey ?
_____

Dr. Jules Hilbert: Are you the king of anything?

catfishjuggling: Like what?

Dr. Jules Hilbert: Anything. King of the lanes at the local bowling alley.

catfishjuggling: King of the lanes?

Dr. Jules Hilbert: King of the lanes, king of the trolls,

catfishjuggling: King of the Trolls?

Dr. Jules Hilbert: Yes, uh uh uh a clandestine land found underneath your floor boards.

catfishjuggling: No. How about King of Countdowns ?

Dr. Jules Hilbert: Huh .

Better ?

Davo said:
Face it, Dim, you voted for and must continue to support a LIE. And you did it because you have nothing but emotionalism that drives your thoughts…………..no logic or common sense.

Only a fool would conclude that Obama was not born in the U.S. That is why this issue is so good because it easily seperates the fools from rational people. Here is reality: One candidate was born outside of the U.S. in the last presidential election. You voted for him.

You guys keep ignoring the elephant in the room, it’s not about where he was born, it’s about “why has this guy hidden so much from us”?

That’s what’s gonna pummel him, he’s been secretive and behind closed doors with everything from day one.

It’s not “birthers” or t-party folks anymore…it’s mainstream Americans, who after 2.5 years have seen this guy hide & lie & side step about everything. It worked at first to make repubs look foolish, now it’s been too long, he looks guilty now just for hiding it, and that’s all we need boys and girls!

valkyrie101 said:
Only a fool would conclude that Obama was not born in the U.S. That is why this issue is so good because it easily seperates the fools from rational people. Here is reality: One candidate was born outside of the U.S. in the last presidential election. You voted for him.

You don’t get it..it doesn’t matter if he was born here or on the moon, he’s hiding something. People don’t like that.

I just realized something else. When Soetoro adopted 0bama, his name was changed from Barack 0bama to Barry Soetoro. Did 0bama (or whatever his name is) have his name legally changed back to to his birth name at some point? If not, he ran for the Presidency using a false name.

Twinsdad46 said:
I just realized something else. When Soetoro adopted 0bama, his name was changed from Barack 0bama to Barry Soetoro. Did 0bama (or whatever his name is) have his name legally changed back to to his birth name at some point? If not, he ran for the Presidency using a false name.

Yeah. That is it. Just keep moving the goalposts.

just wow said:
No likey ?_____ Dr. Jules Hilbert: Are you the king of anything? catfishjuggling: Like what? Dr. Jules Hilbert: Anything. King of the lanes at the local bowling alley. catfishjuggling: King of the lanes? Dr. Jules Hilbert: King of the lanes, king of the trolls, catfishjuggling: King of the Trolls? Dr. Jules Hilbert: Yes, uh uh uh a clandestine land found underneath your floor boards. catfishjuggling: No. How about King of Countdowns ? Dr. Jules Hilbert: Huh . Better ?

With all due respect to Sting, I am actually the KIng of Pain.

timzank said:
You don’t get it..it doesn’t matter if he was born here or on the moon, he’s hiding something. People don’t like that.

Most people do not agree that the exercise of privacy rights constitues dishonest conduct. Sure, 51% of republicans do, but then, not one of them voted for Obama in the first place.

catfishjuggling said:
Again. I realize I am quoting something CRAZY here like the law and all, but: obtaining naturalization in a foreign state upon his own application or upon an application filed by a duly authorized agent, after having attained the age of eighteen years EVEN IF HE WERE ADOPTED BY TWO FOREIGNER NATIONALS, he would still hold his citizenship until he renounced it at 18. THAT IS THE LAW!

That’s insane. Let’s use another example. Say a Canadian couple adopted a child born in the US. You really think that that child would not become a Canadian citizen upon adoption. Why in the world would any couple adopt a child if they could not transfer their citizenship to the child? That’s nuts. But let’s say that that child would become a dual US/Canadian citizen upon adoption. Can dual citizens be President. I certainly hope not.

Again, if he wan’t an Indonesian citizen, why did Dunham remove him from her US passport?

catfishjuggling said:
Yeah. That is it. Just keep moving the goalposts.

You didn’t answer the question. Did 0bama have his name legally changed back to his birth name when got back to the US?

glenn113 said:
Fact is, is that the Honolulu newspapers released the birth announcements on their own. Not at anyone else’s request. So, all the newspapers in Honolulu had this conspiracy going that this baby is going to run for President one day……….This whole birther thing was kinda funny in the beginning but now it’s just wacked. Go ask that Colonel who went to the hoosegow and is now wearing a carrot suite for believing the same garbage. Or he will be soon.

According to whom. Nobody in the Hawaian state government can find the original birth certificate for Barack, nobody recalls him being around the neighborhood at the time, but these two left wing newspapers can now state ( or was it not the newspapers, but the vast left wing conspirators ) unquivocally this ( automatic birth announcements ) was done, never by request of a grandparent, but only as a standard operating ( not today, but way back then ) proceedure, and only for babies actually having been born in the state of Hawaii.

Remember, there is no mention of hospital where baby Barackio’s birth supposedly occurred. Has anyone, that you’ve heard of, looked into the validity of Obama’s claims based on other live births, at the time, automatically being listed in both these newspapers simultaniously? Not to mention whether pertinent information such as hospital, parents, etc, were included, automatically or otherwise on the others.

Every time these legitimate questions regarding just who the hell is living in our White House, while the president continues to stonwall, just leaves more questions than answers and make no mistake, We the People will get to the bottom of this, sadly it more than likely be until after we remove Barack from office next year.

valkyrie101 said:
Most people do not agree that the exercise of privacy rights constitues dishonest conduct. Sure, 51% of republicans do, but then, not one of them voted for Obama in the first place.

Agree. Any of the birthers simply should ask that Colonel who is in or will be in the hoosegow wearing a carrot suit soon.
I’m sure he could give the birthers alot of advice.

May be insane, but it’s the law. No. He didn’t change his name anywhere except for in the crazy land that is your head.

Next.

@just wow. BTw, thank you for making me laugh. You are right about one thing. I gotta go troll somewhere else. This place is no fun anymore.

Barack Must Go said:
According to whom. Nobody in the Hawaian state government can find the original birth certificate for Barack, nobody recalls him being around the neighborhood at the time, but these two left wing newspapers can now state ( or was it not the newspapers, but the vast left wing conspirators ) unquivocally this ( automatic birth announcements ) was done, never by request of a grandparent, but only as a standard operating ( not today, but way back then ) proceedure, and only for babies actually having been born in the state of Hawaii. Remember, there is no mention of hospital where baby Barackio’s birth supposedly occurred. Has anyone, that you’ve heard of, looked into the validity of Obama’s claims based on other live births, at the time, automatically being listed in both these newspapers simultaniously? Not to mention whether pertinent information such as hospital, parents, etc, were included, automatically or otherwise on the others. Every time these legitimate questions regarding just who the hell is living in our White House, while the president continues to stonwall, just leaves more questions than answers and make no mistake, We the People will get to the bottom of this, sadly it more than likely be until after we remove Barack from office next year.

Yes, absolutely. Ask that Army Colonel.

Barack Must Go said:
Is this the first time you’ve admitted to being a card carrying democrat here at Mediaite?

Catfishjuggling is a lib / prog through and through, and not a particularly bright one at that. Can’t seem to remember from post to post which lies he’s told.

catfishjuggling said:
@just wow. BTw, thank you for making me laugh. You are right about one thing. I gotta go troll somewhere else. This place is no fun anymore.

Me too. I like the laughs on a Sunday morning once in awhile. Talk to you guys later.

valkyrie101 said:
This is about the 10th Amendment, and Hawaii’s right to determine who was born there or not.

Yeah, go ask Arizona how that Tenth Amendment thing works out these days.

Obama has telegraphed weakness throughout his term in office…it’s all downhill from here…Trump senses this weakness and is self-promoting his Brand and having lots of fun asking a simple question that everyone ELSE has to answer. No stopping the egoist Trump now….Obama is a laughingstock by 51%+ of Americans.

Another good question Trump could ask is why did Barry Soetoro (Obama’s real name) attend school in Indonesia and have his nationality listed as “Indonesian” and his religion listed as “Islam”??

Just askin’…….Come on Trump ask it!

Forgot the link to Barry’s registration at the Indonesian school..below…

http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthers/occidental.asp

I guess Trump must be laying the groundwork for when he has to fill out those financial disclosure forms. He’s trying to hit Obama now because those disclosures are not going to sit well with the American people.

flagringo said:
Forgot the link to Barry’s registration at the Indonesian school..below…

http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthers/occidental.asp

hahaha crazy old birther man LOL

Trump is not going to make it that far…he’ll bow out after New Hampshire or even before the primaries….It’s all about Brand and furthering his Ego. He’s having fun and can brag all over Palm Beach

Twinsdad46 said:
Again, if he wan’t an Indonesian citizen, why did Dunham remove him from her US passport?

Because Obama got his own passport?

Dem4Ever said:
a certificate of live birth is not a birth certificate

LOL

flagringo said:
Forgot the link to Barry’s registration at the Indonesian school..below… http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthers/occidental.asp

This is a coded message to the 3 or 4 other sane people here.

Everyone else read this:

Birth Certfiicate, Kenyan, Socialist, McDonald’s

OK….sane people…now that we’re back. Do you think this guy actually bothered to READ his own link? Man, I have never laughed so hard in my life when I clicked through, Say what you want about birthers. They are awesome.

OK: everyone else:

Rev. Wright, Bill Ayers, New Black Panthers, the cast of Glee.

All the back and forth conspiracy theories surrounding the birth certificate may be entertaining for five minutes, but you soon realize that it’s a relatively trivial issue that doesn’t directly lead anywhere.

The President is secure in his office and there’s nothing about the birth certificate by itself that’s going to change this fact. Right now, pretty much every “birther” is dismissed like a “truther” and that’s not going to change, even though a huckster has figured-out that it’s a field he can call all his own.

Of course, I guess if P.T. Trump and his new friends were to make enough noise, perhaps the issue could lead to a wide-ranging, far-reaching investigation and maybe that could dig up something completely unrelated, but in the end, all it will really do is guarantee that all future administrations will get bogged down.

Twinsdad46 said:
It doesn’t matter if he was born in Hawaii. I think he was. When Lolo Soetoro adopted him he became an Indonesian citizen. That is why his mom removed him from her passport. That is why he won’t release the original birth certificate because when you’re adopted, your new parent or parents are listed as your birth parents. I should know. I adopted two kids myself.

In adoption cases governed by the inter-state adoption compact, what you say is correct. However, nothing like that applies to U.S. citizens adopted by third parties in foreign countries. So it is unlikely that subsequent adoption information would be added to the birth registry. The most likely reason that Barach was removed from his mother’s passport is because he got his own U.S. passport.

If you don’t give Obama the benefit of the doubt, you’re CRAZY!!!!!!11!!!

jjay7381 said:
I guess Trump must be laying the groundwork for when he has to fill out those financial disclosure forms.

Frikkin awesom!

Yeah, but .. Well, my dad can beat up your dad!

No. If you refuse to believe facts when presented you are.

flagringo said:
Obama has telegraphed weakness throughout his term in office…it’s all downhill from here…Trump senses this weakness and is self-promoting his Brand and having lots of fun asking a simple question that everyone ELSE has to answer. No stopping the egoist Trump now….Obama is a laughingstock by 51%+ of Americans.

Another good question Trump could ask is why did Barry Soetoro (Obama’s real name) attend school in Indonesia and have his nationality listed as “Indonesian” and his religion listed as “Islam”??

Just askin’…….Come on Trump ask it!

uhhhhhh dumbass, the 51% you speak of is 51% of republicans NOT AMERICANS….ignorance amongst you wingnuts is really getting out of hand…..its time for an intervention…..brain dead asswipes like you should terminate your internet connection so you dont accidentally expose your stupidity to the whole world

If Obimbo has his own American passport, he would have been required to supply a valid birth-certificate. If that be the case, producing a valid birth-certificate to prove legal citizenship should not be a problem, should it? Again….produce a legitimate birth-certificate, and end the issue! Before this interloper is allowed to run for a second term, he must be properly vetted, which means producing all the validation needed to qualify. I have called all of my representatives, asking them to demand full vetting.

The Donald is on to something and it is making all the libs come out with all kinds of lies to protect Barry but it ain’t working.

catfishjuggling said:
No. If you refuse to believe facts when presented you are.

You and Barry have presented none, son- just your lib lies.

Magister said:
Right now, pretty much every “birther” is dismissed like a “truther” and that’s not going to change

Way more people than you may think have doubts about his eligibility, but know it’s a dead horse. With Trump bringing it up again, it’s gained a whole new life, and it’s gaining momentum. Sure, it was funny at first, to mock birthers, but now everyday people who never gave it a second thought are thinking, wtf man, what’s he hiding?

gordonbloyershow said:
LOL, that game is over. He was born in Hawaii. His mother was a citizen so it really doesn’t matter. The law now and then makes him a citizen no matter where he was born. That is no longer the point. He won’t release it, THAT is the point. He won’t release his grades. The little boy is a phony and he is covering up something. THAT is the POINT. I don’t care if he ever releases it. It just makes him look like a liar and a fool.

Thanks. Read this link and that is that. Thanks.http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthers/occidental.asp

http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthers/occidental.asp

valkyrie101 said:
The only issue relates to whether Obama was born in the U.S. or not. If you admit that, then there is no reason for Obama to release any additional information. Obama has the right to privacy.

Actually, Obama cedes the right to privacy when he runs for public office. As a person who thrusts himself into the public spotlight he has no reasonable expectation of privacy.

valkyrie101 said:
Hawaiian law, like most other states, does not require a long form birth certificate to certify a person’s birth. The short form that Obama provided constitutes proof, as a matter of law, that Obama was born in Hawaii. Why should Obama provide more than the law requires? Sure, inquiring minds may want to know, but the long form birth certificate, under Hawaiian law, is private.

Please cite that law and show how a Constitutional requirement for holding the office of the President of the United States is overruled by that law?

valkyrie101 said:
LOL

You seem to have a problem with the fact that the US Department of State agrees with me and not you…oh well.

RichS said:
Please cite that law and show how a Constitutional requirement for holding the office of the President of the United States is overruled by that law?

He can’t, there isn’t one……………..his Hawaiian schtick is the only thing he has. Dims will use whatever pathetic excuse from the dark side they can find to “justify” the unjustifiable and “legitimize” the illegitimate. Val just happens to have less brainpower than your average Dim.

If we have to show our birth certificate in order to obtain a passport then we should have to show our birth certificate to obtain the office of the President of the United States.

RichS said:
I thought both parents had to be US Citizens who had resided in the US for at least 5 years before the birth. I’m not sure and too lazy this Sunday morning to look it up.

Not true. The whole argument is stupid. The provision of the law that applied even before the current law allows the baby of a citizen five years to return to live in the U.S. to become a citizen. So even IF Obama was born in Kenya he was returned to the U.S. immediatiatly.

Obama is just being advised by very stupid people and the idiots that defend him here are fools.

My guess is that for some reason the birth certificate says he is Muslim. Most people would understand that no matter what it says that would not make him a Muslim.

valkyrie101 said:
The only issue relates to whether Obama was born in the U.S. or not. If you admit that, then there is no reason for Obama to release any additional information. Obama has the right to privacy.

The jails all across these United States are filled with people who also felt that they had a right to the kind of privacy you proclaim, when a police officer pulled them over and asked to see some identification and they refused.  Please, stop the hate and STOP breaking the law you claim to hold so dearly.

notsofast said:
The Donald is on to something and it is making all the libs come out with all kinds of lies to protect Barry but it ain’t working.

I can’t wait for the good ole days. Remember the old Donald Trump, Howard Stern radio interviews. Memories……d’oh

Questions raised by Mr. Trump extend far beyond the incriminating refusal of Mr. Obama to release all records pertaining to his birth. Mr. Obama has also refused to make available to the public virtually all school and university records and documentation. The author of this column seems to think it is “crazy” for someone not to believe something without conclusive evidence. Those who defend Mr. Obama’s secrecy about his life seem to believe that ridiculing skeptics, slandering their character, impugning their motives, and other rhetorical ploys can substitute for the actual facts of the matter. But the dispute is about facts and can only be settled by facts. The facts are available – but Mr. Obama refuses to provide them. He is stonewalling not just the birth certificate but virtually all records documenting his life from birth onwards. There is no reasonable explanation for such astonishing secrecy about his past except that he is determined to keep something important hidden from the American people. Until we know what he is hiding from us we cannot be certain what it is – but that he is hiding something, and that he thinks it deserves hiding, is obvious to any sensible person.

There is nothing in the least “crazy” about demanding to see the proof of Mr. Obama’s claims. Indeed, what is really “crazy” is that anyone could imagine themselves to know what they have no possible way of knowing unless the evidence is supplied. Until Americans see for themselves what is on Mr. Obama’s original birth certificate and what is contained in the other records he refuses to release, there is no way to know what they contain. To call Americans who are simply asking for the facts “crazy” and to slander and smear them for making simple and obvious requests for information is absurd. Like Mr. Obama’s stonewalling, such verbal tactics display consciousness of guilt – the fear that there just might be something incriminating in the withheld records after all. Trying to discourage and drive off skeptics and others who want to know the facts about Mr. Obama suggests that those who engage in such ad hominem attacks would prefer that the facts, whatever they are, not be made public. We need the facts. All serious people, regardless of their politics, should speak out and demand the facts. It is the truth we need, not opinions, not theories, not slanders, not character assassination, not ridicule, not personal invective. Just the truth. To know the truth we must have the facts. Nothing van settle the questions raised but the facts. For Mr. Obama to continue to withhold the facts strongly suggests that he is hiding something. If he is not hiding something he has nothing to fear from making the facts public – indeed, he will be in a stronger position than ever if he can prove that skeptics were wrong. But if he continues to keep the facts from Americans he will continue to be judged guilty of something, even though there is no way to know what it is.

This just goes to show how ignorant whoopee, gereldo, and the other libs on that show are on the birth certificate issue. It also shows that the dipstick interviewing Trump hasn’t done a bit of research on the matter. First, gereldo would have known that a copy was not online if he and his staff, if he has any, had bothered to look. Mclame’s birth was at issue the last election because he was born on a military base in Panama, nothing but a bs form and hopey goo from the Lame Stream Media for berry. There is something that the berry administration and the media are scared of. If you pluck a turd out of the toilet it doesn’t get a birth certificate and as dumb as dems are they might just elect it..

catfishjuggling said:
EVEN IF HE WERE ADOPTED BY TWO FOREIGNER NATIONALS, he would still hold his citizenship until he renounced it at 18.
THAT IS THE LAW!

You are correct.

timzank said:
You guys keep ignoring the elephant in the room, it’s not about where he was born, it’s about “why has this guy hidden so much from us”? That’s what’s gonna pummel him, he’s been secretive and behind closed doors with everything from day one. It’s not “birthers” or t-party folks anymore…it’s mainstream Americans, who after 2.5 years have seen this guy hide & lie & side step about everything. It worked at first to make repubs look foolish, now it’s been too long, he looks guilty now just for hiding it, and that’s all we need boys and girls!

YOU are CORRECT sir.

jjay7381 said:
I guess Trump must be laying the groundwork for when he has to fill out those financial disclosure forms. He’s trying to hit Obama now because those disclosures are not going to sit well with the American people.

LOL, all you clowns here won’t even give your real name. That is why you support Obama hiding his grades and birth certificate.

glenn113 said:
I can’t wait for the good ole days. Remember the old Donald Trump, Howard Stern radio interviews. Memories……d’oh

So, your advice to Obama supporters is to threaten to bring up old dirt. Not to put this to rest or anything, but to scour Trumps closet for skeletons. How typically progressive of you.

Judging from the comments the lefties see this as a huge issue and always swarm to protect Obama on this and the right smells a rat not because of color but because the issue continues to have a bunch of hair around it and Obama appears to be open to covering up rather than address the issue.

With a large percentage of Americans smelling a rat according to the polls this is a huge issue which the Repubs can latch onto.

Trump is going down the right track addressing the racial issue by mentioning Schwarzenegger. He should go a bit further though by saying that in the event Schwarzenegger said all these rumors about him being born in Austria and untrue and that he was born in Hawaii people would not believe him unless he can show a proper Hawaiian birth certificate. Nothing to do with race, steroids or Austrian Accent.

I encourage Republicans to make the election about this issue, please, us democrats would like to win the house back :)

Oh my. That crazy (IRS Federal Tax attorney, the one who discovered the 105 Billion dollar boondoggle that the Democrats tucked into Obamacare in order to cement it into place before the 2012 election) Michelle Bachmann. She sure is a big joke, any sensible person will marginalize and not take Bachmann seriously. Ha Ha Ha. After all the smart elitists that have been running up the 14 trillion dollar unfunded deficit and bankrupting this country are so much better and so much smarter than the rest of us. And look at our inner cities. After 50 years of pouring almost exactly the same amount of money (actually 15 Trillion dollars) into those cities, why look at them. Now there is intelligent and responsible governing for you. Ha Ha Ha, Michele Bachmann sure is crazy.

Dem4Ever said:
Sorry to disappoint you but, a certificate of live birth is NOT a birth certificate, nor is a certificate of live birth accepted by the Department of State for the purposes of obtaining a passport. So maybe you are the one who should “get over it”.

Really? I wonder why they accepted mine for my passport.

No one President or candidate for President has ever had their citizenship questioned like this.

TheEagle said:
No one President or candidate for President has ever had their citizenship questioned like this.

It was never an issue. Everyone else has a past, people who remember them, etc. Obama doesn’t seem to have a past.

TheEagle said:
No one President or candidate for President has ever had their citizenship questioned like this.

I believe a white VP had to show his BC because there was thought that he was born in Canada.

TheEagle said:

No one President or candidate for President has ever had their citizenship questioned like this.

Interesting and fruitful for speculation as to motives as the above surely is, there is no way to get from it to the facts of the matter. Facts are facts regardless of motives and opinions and reasons for wanting to know the facts.

The inability to distinguish theories and opinions from facts is further evidence that America’s schools are not doing a satisfactory job educating students in the basic principles of science. We have a lot of citizens on our hands who do not know the difference between an opinion and a fact – or perhaps who think their opinions are facts.

The controversy about Mr. Obama’s background and record, beginning but by no means ending with his hidden birth certificate, is a dispute about facts. Disputes about facts are only resolved by facts. They cannot be settled by investigations into the motives of those who seek the facts. They cannot be resolved by identifying and advertising the personal qualities and defects of those who want the facts. They cannot be laughed, sneered, slandered, mocked, or ridiculed away. Calling someone who wants the facts “crazy” does not and cannot change the facts – not even if the person asking for the facts actually happens to be insane. The facts are still the facts, no matter who asks for them or why they want them.

Questions of fact are settled by facts or not at all. There are ample facts in existence. It is alleged that a record exists that proves Mr. Obama’s citizenship and eligibility beyond any possible doubt. Mr. Obama refuses to make this document available. He has yet to provide an explanation for this strange behavior.

Other questions of fact pertain to what is contained in his elementary, high school, college and law school records and other standard documents. These, too, Mr. Obama has declined to make available – again with no explanation whatever as to his reason(s).

Mr. Trump has merely given voice to what countless Americans already believe, that unless Mr. Obama had something to hide, he would not be hiding all his records from Americans.

Opinions differ as to what he might be hiding from us. Until we have the facts, i.e. the records, we simply cannot know what it is he does not want us to know. All we can be reasonably certain of is that there is SOMETHING he does not want us to know about him.

All Americans should demand that Mr. Obama come clean and provide all records requested. There is no justification whatever for continuing to hide facts about his past from the American people.

TheEagle said:
Really? I wonder why they accepted mine for my passport.

No one President or candidate for President has ever had their citizenship questioned like this.

First: The Department of State does not accept certificates of live birth when verifying citizenship for the purpose of issuing passports. You are lying out of both sides of your…mouth.

Second: The birth certificate question was raised as recently as John McCain’s first run at the presidency. He IMMEDIATELY provided his birth certificate and 100% of every other document that was requested.

You need a good strong history lesson fella.

Snowspot said:
I encourage Republicans to make the election about this issue, please, us democrats would like to win the house back :)

Fortunately, the jokes over. Bad poll numbers and three wars will do that to a peace prize recipient, and most people are tired of watching this bum keep up the charade.

I clicked on the snopes.com page, and I would recommend that everyone here do the same. Seriously. Read the whole thing.
If you Google “Obama birth announcements” you can see the two listings in the Hawaii papers. The Obama announcement looks the same as everyone else’s: parent’s names and address, gender of child, DOB. It doesn’t seem to make sense (at least to me) that they would list a foreign birth in their local birth listings. There didn’t seem to be enough room at the time, plus I would think that if a prominent citizen gave birth in another country, it would be listed separately.

There also seems to be the assumption here that Lolo Soetoro legally adopted Barack and legally changed his name. Fine. Prove it. (Doesn’t matter anyway, since BO was an American citizen born to an American citizen, and – as a minor – couldn’t lose or renounce his citizenship.)

I think that when Lolo filled out the school application he wanted to make himself look good and make Barack’s transition to life in Indonesia a bit easier by referring to him as “Barry” (he was called that anyway) and listing his religion as Islam. Looking back, the adult Barack probably wishes he hadn’t, but I’m betting he wasn’t worrying about running for President at the time.
Personally, I don’t need to see Obama’s or anyone else’s college records. I don’t need to know whether or not he got an D in biology as a Sophomore, OK?

The COLB is a legal document, and can be used as legal proof of citizenship. Plenty of states (including my own) now issue it or some kind of short-form BC, instead of a copy of the long-form. I obtained a U.S. Passport showing the short-form BC, and I’m pretty sure many others have as well.
I’ve been saying for a while that Barack Obama can’t be an idiot and a genius at the same time; either he’s legitimately eligible to be President or he’s managed to fool everyone at the State Department, The Secret Service, the FBI, the CIA, and lord knows how many other agencies. Otherwise he and his family wouldn’t have gotten to within a mile of the While House, much less move in. Still, I think that Barack Obama could walk around naked with nothing but his original long-form BC taped to his chest, and that 51% of Republicans who are birthers now will remain birthers because they just don’t like the guy (because he’s a liberal Democrat, not no much because he’s Black). That’s just the way it is.

The drip, drip, drip of doubt over this “Obama created” birth certificate crisis is quickly turning into his own watergate. His fate is sealed unless he fesses up to his arrogance and deception. And don’t you dare even think about blaming this on Bush…we’re sick of your excuses.

caconservative said:
If Obimbo has his own American passport, he would have been required to supply a valid birth-certificate.

Yes, you are correct. And he did. Its called, under Hawaii law, a certificate of live birth. http://static.politifact.com.s3.amazonaws.com/graphics/birthCertObama.jpg

“The only people who don’t want to disclose the truth are people with something to hide.” ~ Obama

The glove fits..this time!

RichS said:
Actually, Obama cedes the right to privacy when he runs for public office. As a person who thrusts himself into the public spotlight he has no reasonable expectation of privacy.

Not so. Otherwise, why are medical records still private? Obama complied with Hawaii law which issues a certificate of live birth as definitive proof of Hawaii birth. Here it is here: http://static.politifact.com.s3.amazonaws.com/graphics/birthCertObama.jpg

Colorado_Conservative said:
“The only people who don’t want to disclose the truth are people with something to hide.” ~ Obama The glove fits..this time!

You make a good argument for video cameras in every house.

Mr.Papshmer said:
Fortunately, the jokes over. Bad poll numbers and three wars will do that to a peace prize recipient, and most people are tired of watching this bum keep up the charade.

Problem is, the republicans have no candidates.

That’s supposed to read “not so much because he’s Black.” Sorry.

To those who insist that a COLB is not acceptable as proof in order to get a passport, a question:
Why, then, would states bother issuing them? As souveniers? What would be the point?

Lulany said:
I clicked on the snopes.com page blah, blah ..

Just imagine, if Obama had put this to rest a long time ago, you and others here wouldn’t have to type up such long winded opinions.

My own opinion is that it’s the school records, not the birth thing, that he doesn’t want us to see, and as long as people are talking about birth certificates, they’re not talking about college papers. If he was the smartest kid in the world, you’d think he’d be proud to show off. I believe that he either a) authored some _very_ radical and anti-American papers, or b) for one reason or another, enrolled as a foreign student. Maybe both.

Souvenirs.

I”m figuring Tim Pawlenty might outlast everybody. He seems to have the least amount of baggage. We’ll see.

valkyrie101 said:
Problem is, the republicans have no candidates.

And in March of 07, it was a given that Hillary would be our next president.

gordonbloyershow said:
LOL, all you clowns here won’t even give your real name. That is why you support Obama hiding his grades and birth certificate.

Hey Gordo the only reason you use your “own name” is in a futile attempt to promote your no ratings “show”
You bloated Limbaugh wannabe, (you’re just as fat and ugly as that pig) go bathe yourself in crude oil.

Mr.Papshmer said:
Just imagine, if Obama had put this to rest a long time ago, you and others here wouldn’t have to type up such long winded opinions. My own opinion is that it’s the school records, not the birth thing, that he doesn’t want us to see, and as long as people are talking about birth certificates, they’re not talking about college papers. If he was the smartest kid in the world, you’d think he’d be proud to show off. I believe that he either a) authored some _very_ radical and anti-American papers, or b) for one reason or another, enrolled as a foreign student. Maybe both.

I’m not the first to write a long post and I won’t be the last. Feel free to not read it if it’s not to your liking. Doesn’t bother me.
If Obama was writing anti-American papers while in college, I’m willing to bet good money that the news would have leaked by now. Same with the “foreign student” issue.

Dem4Ever said:
First: The Department of State does not accept certificates of live birth when verifying citizenship for the purpose of issuing passports. You are lying out of both sides of your…mouth. Second: The birth certificate question was raised as recently as John McCain’s first run at the presidency. He IMMEDIATELY provided his birth certificate and 100% of every other document that was requested. You need a good strong history lesson fella.

No you’re the one who is lying. I got my passport using a certificate of live birth.

And the question with McCain had to do with him being born on a US military base in the Panama Canal zone.

Please, PULEEEEEEEEEZEE.. would one of you posting all the excuse regarding Obamma’s place of birth answer just one simple question.. That being, can you provide one simple rational reason why the President of the USA feels compelled to hide ALL his records, why upon becoming President he immediately signed an executive order hiding them??
Please just one rational reason…

Given that Taitz is bat-shit crazy that’s quite an accomplishment.

dug bru said:
Please, PULEEEEEEEEEZEE.. would one of you posting all the excuse regarding Obamma’s place of birth answer just one simple question.. That being, can you provide one simple rational reason why the President of the USA feels compelled to hide ALL his records, why upon becoming President he immediately signed an executive order hiding them??Please just one rational reason…

Privacy. Same reason Bush, Clinton, the first Bush resisted, and President Palin will do it too. This ain’t unique.

Next.

TheEagle said:
No you’re the one who is lying. I got my passport using a certificate of live birth. And the question with McCain had to do with him being born on a US military base in the Panama Canal zone.

I also got my passport with a certificate of live birth. I lost my birth certificate last time I moved. Also, all thee of kids were sent certificate of live birth. Used them to enroll them in school and get them all passports.

And they (and I) both cam eout of American baby parts on US soil.

Dream on all you want birthers. Certificate of Live Birth IS a birth certificate.

dug bru said:
Please, PULEEEEEEEEEZEE.. would one of you posting all the excuse regarding Obamma’s place of birth answer just one simple question.. That being, can you provide one simple rational reason why the President of the USA feels compelled to hide ALL his records, why upon becoming President he immediately signed an executive order hiding them??
Please just one rational reason…

1. He was exercising his Right to Privacy as guaranteed in the United States Constitution.
2. Because no other president has ever been asked to prove he was a citizen or anything else.
3. He is America’s First Black President. That’s all any American needs to know about him.
4. Because people who ask questions like the above are racist, ignorant, crazy, and evil.
5. There is nothing in the records that makes any difference, so why NOT keep them secret?
6. It is perfectly obvious that he is telling the truth so there is no need for verification.
7. He was following in the footsteps of Jesus and is asking Americans: But who do YOU say that I am?
8. Just to mess with our heads.
9. It doesn’t really matter what may be in the records since he is already sitting in the White House. Deal with it.
10. There are too many far more important things to deal with than whatever is in his records.
11. Nobody would believe the truth even if the records were made public, so there is no use making them public.
12. So that everybody could have a good laugh at people with tinfoil hats who refuse to believe something until they see the proof.
13. It’s a trick to make people who doubt him look stupid when he finally releases the records like pulling a rabbit from a hat. (Note: for trick to work as planned, must produce records.)
14. To give us something to talk about.
15. Because he doesn’t want people to feel inferior, as they surely would if they actually knew all he had accomplished and how high his test scores are.
16. Because he is a Progressive and Progressives are above the law by virtue of their Good Intentions.
17. Because he doesn’t have to.
18. Because nobody has said “pretty please.”

CATFISH…

Privacy. Same reason Bush, Clinton, the first Bush resisted, and President Palin will do it too. This ain’t unique
———–

SORRY . that does not cut it. Plus ur not being truthfull at all..

1st I asked for one RATIONAL reason.. you provided the type of excuse a 6 year old gives .. “why do I have to do that? my brother didn’t ” etc etc.

2ndly GW Bush’s GPA etc is available, as was Gore’s and Kerry’s.

Obamma is hoiding everything.

Obamma passsed an executive order to hide all his history, did the other presidents you cite do that??

Please at least try to be truthful… NEXT

dug bru said:
Please, PULEEEEEEEEEZEE.. would one of you posting all the excuse regarding Obamma’s place of birth answer just one simple question.. That being, can you provide one simple rational reason why the President of the USA feels compelled to hide ALL his records, why upon becoming President he immediately signed an executive order hiding them??
Please just one rational reason…

It would be political damaging to him if the truth was revealed?
It could cause chaos in America if it was proven he doesn’t meet the constitutional requirements to be POTUS?
All the bills he signed would be voided?
He would be imprisoned for fraud and treason?
All the birthers would look like geniuses and the lame stream media like idiots for not properly vetting him in the first place?
I can up with all kinds of reasons why Obama continues to spend millions fighting from revealing who he really is!!!

Teleologicus says .. blah blah blah .. as I said RATIONAL..

Are your feet sore???

They must be from dancing on the head of the pin like you are..

Oh yeah here just to help you …

Pretty pretty Please Mr. Obamma tell us the truth about yourself.. release your BC and your transcripts..

There feel better ..??

NEXT

dug bru said:
CATFISH… Privacy. Same reason Bush, Clinton, the first Bush resisted, and President Palin will do it too. This ain’t unique———– SORRY . that does not cut it. Plus ur not being truthfull at all.. 1st I asked for one RATIONAL reason.. you provided the type of excuse a 6 year old gives .. “why do I have to do that? my brother didn’t ” etc etc. 2ndly GW Bush’s GPA etc is available, as was Gore’s and Kerry’s. Obamma is hoiding everything. Obamma passsed an executive order to hide all his history, did the other presidents you cite do that?? Please at least try to be truthful… NEXT

McCain didn’t provide his records either. Nor did Biden. Or Palin.

I think all four should have.

Next.

Orly Taitz must be smiling…as she figures out how to pay her fines.

About Obama signing an Executive order “hiding all his records”:
I’ll admit that my eyes began to glaze over about halfway through reading Executive Order #13489, but it seemed to me to be mostly about Presidential Records (y’know, records kept while in office), and Executive Privilege. I didn’t see anything about sealing of records before gaining the Presidency. I don’t see how that would be legal.
I can certainly understand the curiosity, but even public figures deserve some measure of privacy when it comes to medical or school records. Military records, not so much in my opinion. Even so, I still believe that in this day and age, if there is something truly sinister about just about anyone in the public eye, it’ll surface sooner or later. People have had five years to come up with something about Obama that sticks, and so far no luck. (OK, Obamacare. LOL)

Colorado_Conservative said:
It would be political damaging to him if the truth was revealed?
It could cause chaos in America if it was proven he doesn’t meet the constitutional requirements to be POTUS?
All the bills he signed would be voided?
He would be imprisoned for fraud and treason?
All the birthers would look like geniuses and the lame stream media like idiots for not properly vetting him in the first place?
I can up with all kinds of reasons why Obama continues to spend millions fighting from revealing who he really is!!!

It would be the end of times man!!! I’m tellin ya, leave it alone!!

Mr.Papshmer said:
And in March of 07, it was a given that Hillary would be our next president.

Well yea. And who is the republican Hillary?

catfishjuggling said:
McCain didn’t provide his records either. Nor did Biden. Or Palin. I think all four should have. Next.

McCain did provide his BC.. why do you feel compelled to lie… Oh yeah cuz you do not have that one rational reason..

As for the others .. did anyone question their birth as Obama has been .. I don’t remember that being an issue with them. Obamma could have easily difused the questions about his BC, but he chose not to.. Therefore he has created an issue out of something that if what you say is true would have ended 2-3 years ago .. still it festers because Mr. Obamma is hiding . NEXT

dug bru said:
Teleologicus says .. blah blah blah .. as I said RATIONAL..

Are your feet sore???

They must be from dancing on the head of the pin like you are..

Oh yeah here just to help you …

Pretty pretty Please Mr. Obamma tell us the truth about yourself.. release your BC and your transcripts..

There feel better ..??

NEXT

That was a joke, I say, that was a JOKE, son!

Yet everything I listed has actually been asserted by those who would defend Mr. Obama’s self-incriminating secrecy about his life, from his birth certificate onwards.

We won’t know what he is keeping secret until we know what he is keeping secret. That an American president should feel it necessary to keep so much secret from Americans tells me all I need to know. I don’t think the details, which sooner or later will become known, are as important as the fraud that this massive iron curtain of secrecy represents.

Whoever and whatever Mr. Obama is, he is not what he wants Americans to think he is. Otherwise there would be no need for such extraordinary secrecy about his past.

dug bru said:
McCain did provide his BC.. why do you feel compelled to lie… Oh yeah cuz you do not have that one rational reason.. As for the others .. did anyone question their birth as Obama has been .. I don’t remember that being an issue with them. Obamma could have easily difused the questions about his BC, but he chose not to.. Therefore he has created an issue out of something that if what you say is true would have ended 2-3 years ago .. still it festers because Mr. Obamma is hiding . NEXT

I do not feel complled to lie. We weren’t discussing McCain’s birth certificate. I know he produced it.

Also, Obama produced his too. You just refuse to accept it.

We were talking about transcripts. You cited knowing the GPA of Gore, Bush, & Kerry.

I was pointing out that none of the candidates in the last election provided a transcript. I said all should have.

Please explain how I am lying…

Next.

“Extraordinary secrecy about his past”? The guy wrote two books! There are photos of him. His friends from grade school and college have been interviewed. Jeez.

catfishjuggling said:
I do not feel complled to lie. We weren’t discussing McCain’s birth certificate. I know he produced it. Also, Obama produced his too. You just refuse to accept it. We were talking about transcripts. You cited knowing the GPA of Gore, Bush, & Kerry. I was pointing out that none of the candidates in the last election provided a transcript. I said all should have. Please explain how I am lying… Next.

You saiod McCain did not provide his records, that is a LIE, which you now acknowledge.. McCains eligibility was questioned and he ebded that by producing his BC..

Now you lie in this post .. OBama has never produced his BC.. what is posted on line is a Certificate of Live Birth not a BC.

Google it and you can find a Hawian Cof LB for Sun Yat Sen.. al oficial looking and everything, Just like Obama’s

nice try .. NEXT

By the way, I would suggest that anyone so troubled by Obama’s “secret past” should not vote for his re-election in 2012.

Problem solved.

Now let’s all move on.

dug bru said:
You saiod McCain did not provide his records, that is a LIE, which you now acknowledge.. McCains eligibility was questioned and he ebded that by producing his BC.. Now you lie in this post .. OBama has never produced his BC.. what is posted on line is a Certificate of Live Birth not a BC. Google it and you can find a Hawian Cof LB for Sun Yat Sen.. al oficial looking and everything, Just like Obama’s nice try .. NEXT

Okay smart guy.

I typed something that you misunderstood. It happens.

We were discussing the transcripts. The unclarity therein is on me.

Fine.

There are also phony birth certificates for McCain online. I am not sure what your point is.

My point is that Obama provided clarity. You refuse to accept his submission.

My advice would be that you, perhaps, consider voting for one of the other candidiates for President in 2012,

I find it amazing, btw, that if Obama is not an American as is being postulated that the Republican majority House of Representative have not prepared Articles of Impeachment. At a minimum, wouldn’t you say they aren’t doing their duty?

But deep down, you guys know in your hearts that they haven’t because they know he was born in Hawaii.

It’s all about keeping the crazies fired up. And it is why I keep calling it out.

I want rational Republicans back.

catfishjuggling said:
Okay smart guy. I typed something that you misunderstood. It happens. We were discussing the transcripts. The unclarity therein is on me. Fine. There are also phony birth certificates for McCain online. I am not sure what your point is. My point is that Obama provided clarity. You refuse to accept his submission. My advice would be that you, perhaps, consider voting for one of the other candidiates for President in 2012,

Ah you are right Obama provided clarity and the controversy has ended.. Obama has said trust me, and you do so the questioning ends .. thatks for the clarity..

@Dug Bru: You, my good sir, are welcome.

catfishjuggling said:
I find it amazing, btw, that if Obama is not an American as is being postulated that the Republican majority House of Representative have not prepared Articles of Impeachment. At a minimum, wouldn’t you say they aren’t doing their duty? But deep down, you guys know in your hearts that they haven’t because they know he was born in Hawaii. It’s all about keeping the crazies fired up. And it is why I keep calling it out. I want rational Republicans back.

LOL.. that certainly ends debate ..

His BC is just 1 question.. my concern is not where he was born, rather that the Obama momma’s like you do not even question why he hides his history.. have I said in any post that he should be impeached? are you familiar with the term RED HERRING???

I started this string asking for a single RATIONAL reason why he hides his record. That has not been forthcoming. In your case you’ve resorted to lies, and now insults “crazies” again that certainly ends the debate.. Oh wait you haven’t called me a Nazi or Facist yet, OR OMG a racist ..

No. I just call you crazy.

And, again, the reason that he doesn’t do that is he is busy running the government.

And that is why Bush didn’t coming running to a microphone when that bogus CBS piece about his Guard service came out.

And it is why his father didn’t scream and stop when the BS stories about his affairs came out.

It is why Presidents of both parties spend millions of dollars on lawyers.

This really isn’t that hard.

catfishjuggling said:
No. I just call you crazy.

A politician says “trust me”. You accept with blind faith what you’re told, and the guy who doesn’t want to accept on blind faith what a politician tells him is crazy. :)

Like I said before, the jokes over, no one’s laughing anymore. Most people these days are tired of the story, and insulting birthers doesn’t have the same effect that it did when Obama was polling 80% approval. It’s gone on too long, and most people are starting to realize he’s hiding something.

Lulany said:
“Extraordinary secrecy about his past”? The guy wrote two books! There are photos of him. His friends from grade school and college have been interviewed. Jeez.

After reading Cashill’s “Deconstructing Obama” I am confident that William Ayers wrote “Dreams of my Father.” The circumstantial evidence is overwhelming. There is no smoking gun, just a relentless accumulation of similarities of style, language, background, metaphors, adjectives, sentence structure, etc. that will persuade anyone attentive to such things. Obama did not write that book. Ayers wrote it.

Of course for purposes of evidence and truth about Mr. Obama’s past, it doesn’t matter who wrote the book. The point is that whoever wrote it, it contains nothing but what the author claims is the truth. Virtually all of what Americans think they know about Mr. Obama comes from him alone. He may be telling the truth – or he may not be telling the truth. Without independent verification there is no way to know.

It has been remarkably difficult to locate reputable people from Mr. Obama’s past who claim to know him. This includes his college and law school years. That a future president of the United States would have remained as anonymous as he seems to have been throughout his adult years is extraordinarily odd – indeed, unprecedented. Aspiring politicians above all make contacts, press the flesh, give the glad hand, go to great lengths to establish themselves for career purposes.

Yet only a handful of professors and students seem to remember Mr. Obama. He doesn’t seem to have made any friends. If he did, they have chosen to remain silent.

I believe it is fair to say that Americans know less that is certain about Mr. Obama than has ever been known about any American president. This is quite remarkable. Even more remarkable is the taboo in place that tries to keep anyone from asking questions and seeking factual data about him. Our once proud media spend their time and energy investigating and ridiculing Americans who ask reasonable questions and would like to see some evidence of Mr. Obama’s background instead of investigating and reporting the facts about Mr. Obama to Americans. The media have forfeited their watchdog role in favor of propaganda for their chosen leader.

Many people seem to believe that making fun of skeptics, calling them names, sneering and slandering people who are asking for the facts somehow substitutes for the facts or relieves the need for the facts. The author of the present column implies that it is “crazy” for anyone not to believe what Mr. Obama and others have claimed without having seen proof that their claims are true.

There is of course nothing in the least “crazy” about suspending judgment until the facts are available. There are many facts, beginning but not ending with Mr. Obama’s original, long form birth certificate, that he has refused to disclose. He has given no explanation for such refusal to provide simple proof.

We do not know what the facts are about Mr. Obama until we have the facts about Mr. Obama. The facts are available but hidden. He refuses to allow Americans to see and judge for themselves. His defenders claim that it is “crazy” not to trust him and others and that asking to see the records is somehow absurd. What is absurd, however, is the willingness to believe something that one cannot possibly know to be true until the facts are made available to judge.

Mr.Papshmer said:
A politician says “trust me”. You accept with blind faith what you’re told, and the guy who doesn’t want to accept on blind faith what a politician tells him is crazy. :)

Like I said before, the jokes over, no one’s laughing anymore. Most people these days are tired of the story, and insulting birthers doesn’t have the same effect that it did when Obama was polling 80% approval. It’s gone on too long, and most people are starting to realize he’s hiding something.

No, most people think birthers are nut jobs. That’s because they are.

Teleologicus said:
After reading Cashill’s “Deconstructing Obama” I am confident that William Ayers wrote “Dreams of my Father.” The circumstantial evidence is overwhelming. There is no smoking gun, just a relentless accumulation of similarities of style, language, background, metaphors, adjectives, sentence structure, etc. that will persuade anyone attentive to such things. Obama did not write that book. Ayers wrote it.

Of course for purposes of evidence and truth about Mr. Obama’s past, it doesn’t matter who wrote the book. The point is that whoever wrote it, it contains nothing but what the author claims is the truth. Virtually all of what Americans think they know about Mr. Obama comes from him alone. He may be telling the truth – or he may not be telling the truth. Without independent verification there is no way to know.

It has been remarkably difficult to locate reputable people from Mr. Obama’s past who claim to know him. This includes his college and law school years. That a future president of the United States would have remained as anonymous as he seems to have been throughout his adult years is extraordinarily odd – indeed, unprecedented. Aspiring politicians above all make contacts, press the flesh, give the glad hand, go to great lengths to establish themselves for career purposes.

Yet only a handful of professors and students seem to remember Mr. Obama. He doesn’t seem to have made any friends. If he did, they have chosen to remain silent.

I believe it is fair to say that Americans know less that is certain about Mr. Obama than has ever been known about any American president. This is quite remarkable. Even more remarkable is the taboo in place that tries to keep anyone from asking questions and seeking factual data about him. Our once proud media spend their time and energy investigating and ridiculing Americans who ask reasonable questions and would like to see some evidence of Mr. Obama’s background instead of investigating and reporting the facts about Mr. Obama to Americans. The media have forfeited their watchdog role in favor of propaganda for their chosen leader.

Many people seem to believe that making fun of skeptics, calling them names, sneering and slandering people who are asking for the facts somehow substitutes for the facts or relieves the need for the facts. The author of the present column implies that it is “crazy” for anyone not to believe what Mr. Obama and others have claimed without having seen proof that their claims are true.

There is of course nothing in the least “crazy” about suspending judgment until the facts are available. There are many facts, beginning but not ending with Mr. Obama’s original, long form birth certificate, that he has refused to disclose. He has given no explanation for such refusal to provide simple proof.

We do not know what the facts are about Mr. Obama until we have the facts about Mr. Obama. The facts are available but hidden. He refuses to allow Americans to see and judge for themselves. His defenders claim that it is “crazy” not to trust him and others and that asking to see the records is somehow absurd. What is absurd, however, is the willingness to believe something that one cannot possibly know to be true until the facts are made available to judge.

Ayers brought up AGAIN 3 days ago:
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=280073

Garth said:
No, most people think birthers are nut jobs. That’s because they are.

Actually, as people see more and more of how bad Obama is as President, they are starting to wonder about him. He should have nipped this years ago by producing it.

If the man waved his hands and tried to distract me instead of providing a document that proves his citizenship, I would doubt him.

When I see a document that proves his citizenship, I accept it.

When you refuse to accept the fact that he has presented it, you are a crazy perosn. The end.

@Teleologicus: have you read “Dreams From My Father” yourself or are you simply basing your view on what someone else said?

Ah yes, the “I don’t believe in conspiracy theories!” crowd are now… well, the conspiracy theorists.

Garth said:
No, most people think birthers are nut jobs. That’s because they are.

This is the talking point and party line. It does not address the factual questions about Mr. Obama, beginning but not ending with his birth certificate. That so many Americans think it does is a worrisome sign. The most elementary understanding of scientific method distinguishes facts from opinions. It seems that American schools are not making students acquainted with the rudiments of scientific thinking.

So-called birthers may or may not be nut jobs. Most people may or may not think they are nut jobs. None of this has anything in the world to do with the facts about Mr. Obama’s past. What people THINK about people who ask for the facts about Mr. Obama has absolutely nothing to do with the facts themselves. The motives of the people who ask for the facts have nothing whatever to do with the facts. Not even the sanity of those who want to see the facts about Mr. Obama has anything to do with the facts about him.

The facts about Mr. Obama are the facts about Mr. Obama, regardless of who wants to know or why they want to know them.

The only solution to questions about the facts of Mr. Obama’s past is to obtain the facts of Mr. Obama’s past. Making fun of or insulting people who would like the facts says plenty about those who stoop to such tactics but nothing whatever about the facts themselves.

If only this were true we could put this stupidity behind us:

“The facts about Mr. Obama are the facts about Mr. Obama, regardless of who wants to know or why they want to know them. ”

There are PLENTY of reasons to not vote for the guy. This ain’t one of them.

catfishjuggling said:
@Teleologicus: have you read “Dreams From My Father” yourself or are you simply basing your view on what someone else said?

I have not read it. I am basing my opinion on what Cashill sets forth in “Deconstructing Obama.” There is no possible way I could form any conclusions as to its authorship by reading it myself unless I were willing to do what Cashill did, read and study Ayers’ published writings and Obama’s other texts. I am satisfied by Cashill’s many examples of close similarity between Ayers’ other writings and “Dreams of my Father” that Ayers, not Obama, wrote that book. I believe that anyone with an eye or ear for language who reads Cashill will come to the same conclusion. As I mentioned earlier, there is no smoking gun, just an accumulation of resemblances that ultimately compels assent.

Of course the truth of the book does not depend upon its author. Ayers wrote it – but everything in it could still be 100% true. How would we know?

The only reason Ayers’ authorship matters to me is that it shows Mr. Obama lied about his connection with Ayers. That comes as no great surprise. He lied about his connection with Jeremiah Wright. Mr. Obama does not tell the truth.

What I happen to think about the authorship of “Dreams” is of no consequence whatsoever and does not tell us anything about the facts of Mr. Obama’s past that he has for unknown reasons thus far withheld from us.

To resolve questions and doubts about Mr. Obama, including his birth and his life prior to the presidency, we need to have the facts. Nothing else will do. Insulting people who ask for such facts, impugning their motives and their sanity, assassinating their character, is no substitute for the facts. It is quite discouraging that many people seem to believe that calling people names can settle disputes about facts, or that some mysterious deductive process of a priori reasoning is capable of disclosing empirical data.

This is a case for sergeant Joe Friday: Just the facts, m’am. Just the facts.Then, and only then, will Americans know who their president actually is.

Alz said:
Actually, as people see more and more of how bad Obama is as President, they are starting to wonder about him. He should have nipped this years ago by producing it.

46% approval. Hmmm. Maybe you’re wrong. It’s only right-wing-nuts who are ‘starting to wonder about him.’

catfishjuggling said:
If only this were true we could put this stupidity behind us:

“The facts about Mr. Obama are the facts about Mr. Obama, regardless of who wants to know or why they want to know them. ”

There are PLENTY of reasons to not vote for the guy. This ain’t one of them.

I don’t know what the above means. Do you? How do you know that the facts about Mr. Obama are not a reason to vote against him until and unless you know what those facts are? What is “stupid” about wanting to know the facts about Mr. Obama’s past? If you don’t know what those facts are, what makes you think they are not important? Credo quia absurdum est? Credo ut intelligam? In any case, without the facts necessary to render judgment, it is all mere opinion and profession of faith. But matters of fact cannot be settled by professions of faith, no matter how sincere or how fervent. Matters of fact are settled by facts or not at all. The facts are said to be available. Mr. Obama refuses to disclose them. This entitles any reasonable person to make a presumption of guilt until proved otherwise. Mr. Obama can easily dispel any unjust or unfair allegations. All he has to do is to release the facts about his life that many Americans would like to have. That he refuses to do so permits of no benign interpretation but instead shows what the law calls ‘consciousness of guilt.’ He is behaving like a guilty man who knows that he is guilty and who is trying to avoid detection. Unfair? Perhaps. Possibly so. Then prove it! Show us the facts! Clear yourself and your reputation by providing the only thing than can do so, the facts that are being withheld.

Teleologicus said:
This is the talking point and party line. It does not address the factual questions about Mr. Obama, beginning but not ending with his birth certificate. That so many Americans think it does is a worrisome sign. The most elementary understanding of scientific method distinguishes facts from opinions. It seems that American schools are not making students acquainted with the rudiments of scientific thinking.

So-called birthers may or may not be nut jobs. Most people may or may not think they are nut jobs. None of this has anything in the world to do with the facts about Mr. Obama’s past. What people THINK about people who ask for the facts about Mr. Obama has absolutely nothing to do with the facts themselves. The motives of the people who ask for the facts have nothing whatever to do with the facts. Not even the sanity of those who want to see the facts about Mr. Obama has anything to do with the facts about him.

The facts about Mr. Obama are the facts about Mr. Obama, regardless of who wants to know or why they want to know them.

The only solution to questions about the facts of Mr. Obama’s past is to obtain the facts of Mr. Obama’s past. Making fun of or insulting people who would like the facts says plenty about those who stoop to such tactics but nothing whatever about the facts themselves.

Here’s the thing. You are a lunatic.

Teleologicus said:
After reading Cashill’s “Deconstructing Obama” I am confident that William Ayers wrote “Dreams of my Father.” The circumstantial evidence is overwhelming. There is no smoking gun, just a relentless accumulation of similarities of style, language, background, metaphors, adjectives, sentence structure, etc. that will persuade anyone attentive to such things. Obama did not write that book. Ayers wrote it.

“What man would write an entire auto-biography for another man, for no recompense?”, the man asks the wiseman. “None”, says the wiseman.

Just because he’s rich because his dad was rich doesn’t mean he’s not an idiot.

@ Teleologicus: I do like that you’ve not read it but you feel you should comment on it.

I see no need for futher discussion.

Garth said:
Here’s the thing. You are a lunatic.

Whether I am or am not a lunatic has absolutely nothing to do with the facts that Mr. Obama refuses to provide. The above is a classic ad hominem logical fallacy.

The truth about Mr. Obama is the truth about Mr. Obama. Who happens to want the truth, why they want it, what use they make of it – none of that has anything to do with the truth about Mr. Obama.

Controversies about facts are settled by facts, not by personal insults. One cannot sneer or ridicule a dispute about facts away. That is why the questions about Mr. Obama are growing, not diminishing. The more attention people pay to this strange story the stranger it seems. Strangest of all, of course, is Mr. Obama’s stubborn refusal to do the one thing needful to settle the matter, namely to provide all the facts.

I’m now bored with all this.

You guys win.

He is a Kenyan.

Now what?

@ Teleologicus: Controversies about facts are settled by facts

Unless one side refuses to accept the facts. Then it is a bunch of crazy people screaming about a birth certificate that has already been produced.

Teleologicus said:
After reading Cashill’s “Deconstructing Obama” I am confident that William Ayers wrote “Dreams of my Father.” The circumstantial evidence is overwhelming. There is no smoking gun, just a relentless accumulation of similarities of style, language, background, metaphors, adjectives, sentence structure, etc. that will persuade anyone attentive to such things. Obama did not write that book. Ayers wrote it.

Of course for purposes of evidence and truth about Mr. Obama’s past, it doesn’t matter who wrote the book. The point is that whoever wrote it, it contains nothing but what the author claims is the truth. Virtually all of what Americans think they know about Mr. Obama comes from him alone. He may be telling the truth – or he may not be telling the truth. Without independent verification there is no way to know.

It has been remarkably difficult to locate reputable people from Mr. Obama’s past who claim to know him. This includes his college and law school years. That a future president of the United States would have remained as anonymous as he seems to have been throughout his adult years is extraordinarily odd – indeed, unprecedented. Aspiring politicians above all make contacts, press the flesh, give the glad hand, go to great lengths to establish themselves for career purposes.

Yet only a handful of professors and students seem to remember Mr. Obama. He doesn’t seem to have made any friends. If he did, they have chosen to remain silent.

I believe it is fair to say that Americans know less that is certain about Mr. Obama than has ever been known about any American president. This is quite remarkable. Even more remarkable is the taboo in place that tries to keep anyone from asking questions and seeking factual data about him. Our once proud media spend their time and energy investigating and ridiculing Americans who ask reasonable questions and would like to see some evidence of Mr. Obama’s background instead of investigating and reporting the facts about Mr. Obama to Americans. The media have forfeited their watchdog role in favor of propaganda for their chosen leader.

Many people seem to believe that making fun of skeptics, calling them names, sneering and slandering people who are asking for the facts somehow substitutes for the facts or relieves the need for the facts. The author of the present column implies that it is “crazy” for anyone not to believe what Mr. Obama and others have claimed without having seen proof that their claims are true.

There is of course nothing in the least “crazy” about suspending judgment until the facts are available. There are many facts, beginning but not ending with Mr. Obama’s original, long form birth certificate, that he has refused to disclose. He has given no explanation for such refusal to provide simple proof.

We do not know what the facts are about Mr. Obama until we have the facts about Mr. Obama. The facts are available but hidden. He refuses to allow Americans to see and judge for themselves. His defenders claim that it is “crazy” not to trust him and others and that asking to see the records is somehow absurd. What is absurd, however, is the willingness to believe something that one cannot possibly know to be true until the facts are made available to judge.

You people must be on the Soros payroll. Just keep pushing indies away from the crazy GOP. Nice work, George!

catfishjuggling said:
@ Teleologicus: I do like that you’ve not read it but you feel you should comment on it.

I see no need for futher discussion.

You either did not read or failed to understand what I wrote. There is no way to know from reading the book who wrote it. The way to learn who wrote it is to compare it with the published writings of William Ayers and Mr. Obama. This is what Cashill did in great detail. I am satisfied from his examples. If I were not I could take the trouble to read all of Ayers’ work and compare it line for line to ‘Dreams.’

I believe I can turn the tables on you by suggesting that in this case it is YOU, not I, who has not read what is required to form a judgment as to the authorship of “Dreams.” No matter how many times one might read “Dreams,” there is absolutely no way he could know from that alone who wrote it. It is necessary to compare it with other texts to make such judgments. Unless you have read “Deconstructing Obama” or have made your own study of the texts, you have no basis for an opinion on this matter.

Anyone who has not yet read “Deconstructing Obama” can easily do so and make up their own mind. Cashill provides an abundance of examples and similarities that in the end are utterly damning. William Ayers is the author of “Dreams of my Father,” not Barack Obama. There is a massive deceit here.

Read it.

Next.

catfishjuggling said:
@ Teleologicus: Controversies about facts are settled by facts

Unless one side refuses to accept the facts. Then it is a bunch of crazy people screaming about a birth certificate that has already been produced.

The original long form birth certificate has not been produced. The new governor of Hawaii said he was going to produce it to silence skeptics but then couldn’t find it – or something, If you do not understand what people are asking for you do not understand the problem. The original birth certificate has NOT been produced. It is not even clear at this point that it even exists.

There is of course much more in question besides the original birth certificate. Mr. Obama refuses to produce any of the documents pertaining to his education as well as much of his professional work before politics. The original birth certificate is simply one small piece of data that he is withholding from Americans for reasons he refuses to explain.

I have no idea where he was born or whether he is eligible to be president. Neither does anyone else until the facts are made available. It is alleged that all he has to do to make the facts available is to give his permission to the state of Hawaii. That he refuses to do so suggests he is hiding something – though what it is, nobody can know until we see it for ourselves.

Publius219 said:
You people must be on the Soros payroll. Just keep pushing indies away from the crazy GOP. Nice work, George!

There is nothing “crazy” about asking for facts and evidence.

If there is anything “crazy,” it is thinking that one knows something that one has no possible way of knowing.

Alz said:
Actually, as people see more and more of how bad Obama is as President, they are starting to wonder about him. He should have nipped this years ago by producing it.

Your problem is that you do not understand what a birth certificate is. When it says: certificate of live birth, that is a birth certificate. Obama has produced that, long ago, and the State of Hawaii has confirmed it represents proof of Hawaiian birth. But for partisan reasons, you want to force Obama to compromise his privacy, and give you personal information about his family, doctor and so forth, that is on the so called “long form” birth certificate, which is private under Hawaiian law. Why should he? And he won’t as a matter of principle.

I used to buy into one conspiracy theory. I have heard that all you birthers were somehow an Obama plant. Maybe it was an attempt to make the Republicans look crazy.

But it turns out you people are real and you really believe this crap.

Fascinating.

catfishjuggling said:
I used to buy into one conspiracy theory. I have heard that all you birthers were somehow an Obama plant. Maybe it was an attempt to make the Republicans look crazy.

But it turns out you people are real and you really believe this crap.

Fascinating.

Actually, though, it is YOU, i.e. those who think they know something they cannot possibly know, who “believe all that crap,” i.e. what they have been assured is the truth by others. You are willing to take it all on faith.

Skeptical Americans would like to see and decide for themselves on the basis of the facts, not what someone else tells them is the case.

It is perfectly obvious by now that Mr. Obama is hiding something. The only question is, what is he hiding?

The president of the United States has absolutely no business hiding anything, not one single thing, from Americans – not one single American who wants to know. All that should be required is for one American to ask for the facts about the president and they should be promptly forthcoming. The very idea that an American president is somehow above such concerns, that the people do not have the right to know anything and everything they desire to know about him, is profoundly un-American and anti-democratic. The president is neither royalty nor Caesar but a servant of the people. If the people want to know something about him, he should provide it, no questions asked. That so many Americans are prepared to wave their right to know the facts about their president is an ominous sign for the future of the republic. Such people have the mentality of slaves, not free Americans.

valkyrie101 said:
Not so. Otherwise, why are medical records still private? Obama complied with Hawaii law which issues a certificate of live birth as definitive proof of Hawaii birth. Here it is here: http://static.politifact.com.s3.amazonaws.com/graphics/birthCertObama.jpg

If you are going to argue privacy rights you should learn about them. When someone runs for the office of President of the United States, which requires “No person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty-five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States.”, then that person gives up a reasonable expectation of privacy with respect to thos requirements.

catfishjuggling said:
I used to buy into one conspiracy theory. I have heard that all you birthers were somehow an Obama plant. Maybe it was an attempt to make the Republicans look crazy.

But it turns out you people are real and you really believe this crap.

Fascinating.

This coming from a 9/11 waqcko…?

How am I a 9/11 wacko?

Oh, you mean that whole stupid “Did Bush Know” poll?

Let me clear it up. Bush was not behind 9/11. It was not an inside job. 19 horrible people did it.

We were debating a poll that asked if Bush was aware before the attacks. I pointed out it was a poorly worded poll question.

But nice ad hominem.

Teleologicus said:
Anyone who has not yet read “Deconstructing Obama” can easily do so and make up their own mind. Cashill provides an abundance of examples and similarities that in the end are utterly damning. William Ayers is the author of “Dreams of my Father,” not Barack Obama. There is a massive deceit here.

HHAHAAHAHAHAHAAHAHAH!!!!

You’re making a judgement on a book that you didn’t read from another book?

You suggest others read this book about another book to decide who wrote the other book without reading the other book that is being judged?

Your whole premise is CRAP on the face of it.

You’re a typical WACK JOB who has an absurd conclusion or idea and then finds whatever facts to support it. You even laughingly (I really did laugh!) bring up scientific method.

You are a merely a verbose CLOWN and NOTHING MORE!!!

BushClintonCrimeFamily said:
46% approval. Hmmm. Maybe you’re wrong. It’s only right-wing-nuts who are ’starting to wonder about him.’

His approval was much higher. Duh.

valkyrie101 said:
Your problem is that you do not understand what a birth certificate is. When it says: certificate of live birth, that is a birth certificate. Obama has produced that, long ago, and the State of Hawaii has confirmed it represents proof of Hawaiian birth. But for partisan reasons, you want to force Obama to compromise his privacy, and give you personal information about his family, doctor and so forth, that is on the so called “long form” birth certificate, which is private under Hawaiian law. Why should he? And he won’t as a matter of principle.

No. States give out Certificates of Live Birth all the time. It’s not the same as the real Birth Certificate. If you move to Hawaii, you can get a Certificate of Live Birth for your kids. As you can see, it’s NOT the same as a Birth Certificate.

As I said, this issue would have died YEARS ago if Obama had produced it. Proving eligibility for the HIGHEST elected office in the land is part of principle too.

No.

http://archives.starbulletin.com/content/20090606_kokua_line

The state Department of Health no longer issues copies of paper birth certificates as was done in the past, said spokeswoman Janice Okubo.

The department only issues “certifications” of live births, and that is the “official birth certificate” issued by the state of Hawaii, she said.

And, it’s only available in electronic form.

Okubo explained that the Health Department went paperless in 2001.

“At that time, all information for births from 1908 (on) was put into electronic files for consistent reporting,” she said.

Information about births is transferred electronically from hospitals to the department.

“The electronic record of the birth is what (the Health Department) now keeps on file in order to provide same-day certified copies at our help window for most requests,” Okubo said.

Asked for more information about the short-form versus long-form birth documents, Okubo said the Health Department “does not have a short-form or long-form certificate.”

“The birth certificate form has been modified over the years and decades to conform to national standards and models,” she said.

Okubo also emphasized the certification form “contains all the information needed by all federal government agencies for transactions requiring a birth certificate.”

She added that the U.S. Supreme Court has recognized the state’s current certification of live birth “as an official birth certificate meeting all federal and other requirements.”

The issue of what constitutes an official Hawaii birth certificate received national attention during last year’s presidential campaign. Those who doubted Barack Obama’s American citizenship called the copy of the Hawaii birth document posted on his campaign Web site a fake.

Asked about that document, Okubo said, “This is the same certified copy everyone receives when they request a birth certificate.”

You don’t get your own facts.

Teleologicus said:
After reading Cashill’s “Deconstructing Obama” I am confident that William Ayers wrote “Dreams of my Father.” The circumstantial evidence is overwhelming. There is no smoking gun, just a relentless accumulation of similarities of style, language, background, metaphors, adjectives, sentence structure, etc. that will persuade anyone attentive to such things. Obama did not write that book. Ayers wrote it.

OK, you know what? I’m willing to believe you. You’re absolutely convinced that Bill Ayers wrote “Dreams of My Father” based on the accumulated evidence of one man. Fine. On the other hand, I and many others are convinced that Barack Obama was perfectly capable of writing his autobiography, “Dreams FROM my Father”.
Wake me when you find the “smoking gun” on THAT one.

If that idiot actually runs for president as a republican, he’ll cause sensible republicans to vote democrat instead. Yeah, Trump, get out of the race, birther idiot.

I’m no Birther, but it’s always struck me as odd the angle said to be “crazy” by the defensive media is the inquiry in the least as to the citizenship of the son of a foreign national and internationalist mother who, by all accounts, spent only enough time in country the first 10 years of his life to be born. But hey. If anyone were going to raise the issue enough for it to stick, by all rights they ought to have done it when Obama had presidential aspirations written all over him as he was voting ‘present’ in the Illinois statehouse.

Birthers and *cough* ‘truthers’ are equally whacko. Yes I believe the birther movement was a plant, started by truthers to try and discredit republicans, and all too typically, a bunch of republicans were fool enough to buy right into it.

TRUMP GOT YOUR ATTENTION GOT TO LAUGH AT THE FOOLISHNESS OF IT ALL OUR PRESIDENT DOES NOT HAVE TO HOLD A BIRTH CERTIFICATE OR SHOW PICTURES OF HIM BEFORE 3 MONTHS OLD–MAN THIS IS REALLY BAD WHEN THE RICH COME OUT AND SHOW THEMSELVES VERY SCARY NO WONDER THE WORLD SITUATION IS PITY AND MISERABLE

Martel seems to be putting forth a strategy of painting Trump as the “Birhter Candidate” before the start. The next step is to cloud everything Trump says with “and the Birther Candidate Trump says” which is another way of saying “we all know Trump is crazy”. These are typical hate tactics.

But then, the political discussion has gotten so heated that it is very much in danger of comming out of cyberspace…

Mediaite:

Please quit hijacking my computer with the Showtime: Nurse Jackie adds that will not close. That annoys me to no end.

TheEagle said:
No you’re the one who is lying. I got my passport using a certificate of live birth.

The HELL you did

How are you going to know what the original birth certificate says without subpoenaing it? How can you know whether he is really the child in the birth certificate without DNA analysis?

How do you determine whether Barry acquired Indonesian citizenship without extensuve official investigations by agencies able to compel sworn testimony and the production of documents and things?

Investigations into these matters, and many others, such as crooked deals to conceal evidence of Barry’s Indonesian citizenship, could be swept into the impeachment hearings called for by Kucinich and Biden.

RichS said:
If you are going to argue privacy rights you should learn about them. When someone runs for the office of President of the United States, which requires “No person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty-five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States.”, then that person gives up a reasonable expectation of privacy with respect to thos requirements.

A determination was made by Hawaii that Obama was born there, and they certified it. Thus, Obama is a natural born citizen, even if that is expanded to include people born in far flung U.S. territories like Panama.

Alz said:
No. States give out Certificates of Live Birth all the time. It’s not the same as the real Birth Certificate. If you move to Hawaii, you can get a Certificate of Live Birth for your kids. As you can see, it’s NOT the same as a Birth Certificate

So a “certification of live birth” does not mean “birth certificate”? OK. That sounds very logical. You want Obama to produce something more than certification of birth, you want him to also provide information that the State of Hawaii has deemed, by law, to be private. And that is the bottom line.

valkyrie101 said:
So a “certification of live birth” does not mean “birth certificate”? OK. That sounds very logical. You want Obama to produce something more than certification of birth, you want him to also provide information that the State of Hawaii has deemed, by law, to be private. And that is the bottom line.

The Guppies I purchased at PetSmart on Sunday came with a ” certification of live birth “. All that proves is they were born, and they were alive at the time.

grafxmail7 said:
HHAHAAHAHAHAHAAHAHAH!!!!

You’re making a judgement on a book that you didn’t read from another book?

You suggest others read this book about another book to decide who wrote the other book without reading the other book that is being judged?

Your whole premise is CRAP on the face of it.

You’re a typical WACK JOB who has an absurd conclusion or idea and then finds whatever facts to support it. You even laughingly (I really did laugh!) bring up scientific method.

You are a merely a verbose CLOWN and NOTHING MORE!!!

Neither you nor I nor anyone else can possibly tell who wrote ‘Dreams’ by reading it.

That is not the way such matters are determined. One must not merely read but STUDY the text and then compare it to OTHER texts that one has also read and studied. This takes a good deal of time and effort. It is what Cashill has done in ‘Deconstructing Obama.’ He has read, studied, and compared everything Obama and Ayers wrote and published. He gives examples, quotes, cites, sources, and spells out his reasoning. In the academic world this is called scholarship.Such work permits others who lack the time, interest, or skill to perform detailed textual analysis and comparison to profit from those who have done so.

You can no more tell by merely reading ‘Dreams’ who wrote it than you could have determined merely by reading The Donation of Constantine whether or not it was a forgery.

The similarities between Ayers’ other writings, his background, and ‘Dreams’ are documented by Cashill in great detail. They include style, language, tropes, adjectives, grammar, idiosyncrasies and much else. All of this is available for you and others to review if you care to do so.

‘Dreams’ was written by William Ayers. In itself, this is not terribly important. It is simply another clue that Mr. Obama has not told Americans the truth about himself. It is another reason Americans need to see all of his documented records, including his original birth certificate.

Insulting me and calling me names does not and cannot change the facts. Such behavior discloses much about those who engage in it but nothing whatever about the facts themselves. Facts cannot be reviled or ridiculed away. Shooting the messenger does not destroy the message nor change the facts.

Fear in the Left is running wild. Do any of you remember that story you read as a kid about the Emperor’s New Clothes? It took a little boy to state the obvious that the Emperor had no clothes. For those of you who are still having problems with my analogy: Emperor=Obama, Clothes=Birth Certificate, “birthers”= little boy.

I have no idea if he was born in Hawaii or on Mars for that matter. Yes, the odds are greatly in favor of Hawaii. But something is wrong when a man goes so far out of his way to keep from showing is actual long form birth certificate. And something is definitely wrong with the blind adherence of the Far Left on giving him a pass.

Why is it that the Left, that used to question the legitimacy of practically everything the government did, now is violently attacking anyone who questions Obama’s place of birth? Why is it that there were hearings in Congress concerning John McCain’s birth certificate, and not Obama’s?

IF at sometime in the future it is found that Obama is not constitutionally qualified to be President, because of circumstances surrounding his birth, then that should be considered one of the most serious frauds of all time. And IF such a case arises, he should be thrown in prison along with those officials who certified is credentials.

Just release the damn document, so we can get on with governing the country. AND STOP DEMONIZING ANYONE WHO QUESTIONS THE RELEVANCE OF HIS BIRTH CERTIFICATE.

American League said:
Fear in the Left is running wild. Do any of you remember that story you read as a kid about the Emperor’s New Clothes? It took a little boy to state the obvious that the Emperor had no clothes. For those of you who are still having problems with my analogy: Emperor=Obama, Clothes=Birth Certificate, “birthers”= little boy.

I have no idea if he was born in Hawaii or on Mars for that matter. Yes, the odds are greatly in favor of Hawaii. But something is wrong when a man goes so far out of his way to keep from showing is actual long form birth certificate. And something is definitely wrong with the blind adherence of the Far Left on giving him a pass.

Why is it that the Left, that used to question the legitimacy of practically everything the government did, now is violently attacking anyone who questions Obama’s place of birth? Why is it that there were hearings in Congress concerning John McCain’s birth certificate, and not Obama’s?

IF at sometime in the future it is found that Obama is not constitutionally qualified to be President, because of circumstances surrounding his birth, then that should be considered one of the most serious frauds of all time. And IF such a case arises, he should be thrown in prison along with those officials who certified is credentials.

Just release the damn document, so we can get on with governing the country. AND STOP DEMONIZING ANYONE WHO QUESTIONS THE RELEVANCE OF HIS BIRTH CERTIFICATE.

This post says it all and I love that it outlines that even though the LEFT has no idea where he was born, they will defend him fervently. Why anyone would believe him is beyond logic. 99% of what comes out of the WH and Obomb-a is spin or fiction.

Lulany said:
OK, you know what? I’m willing to believe you. You’re absolutely convinced that Bill Ayers wrote “Dreams of My Father” based on the accumulated evidence of one man. Fine. On the other hand, I and many others are convinced that Barack Obama was perfectly capable of writing his autobiography, “Dreams FROM my Father”.
Wake me when you find the “smoking gun” on THAT one.

Whether Mr. Obama was capable of writing ‘Dreams’ is not the question. The question is, did he write it? One way of trying to determine this is by close textual comparison with other works, his own and those of the person widely suspected of writing the book, William Ayers. It is by such tedious work and line by line comparisons that similarities in style, syntax, sentence, structure, figures of speech, common phrases and other things become apparent.

Why does it matter that William Ayers, not Barack Obama, wrote ‘Dreams’? Don’t politicians routinely use ghostwriters for their books and speeches? Just because Mr. Obama did not himself personally write the book that bears his name as author does not mean its contents are false. It merely means he has not told us the truth about its authorship.

But in this case it also means something else. It means that he has been dishonest about his relationship with his ghost writer, William Ayers, an anti-American unrepentant domestic terrorist.. And it also casts considerable doubt upon the claim that he is uniquely gifted and intelligent. Most people who have read ‘Dreams’ think it reflects an intelligent and talented mind. Nothing else allegedly written by Mr. Obama comes close to the standard of ‘Dreams.’

Thus it is possible to derive three probable conclusions from Ayers’ authorship of ‘Dreams:’

1. Mr. Obama did not tell the truth about the authorship;
2. Mr. Obama did not tell the truth about his close relationship with William Ayers; and
3. Mr. Obama is not as smart and verbally facile as people thought he was.

All speculation, of course. But anyone who bothers to read ‘Deconstructing Obama’ will realize that claims of Ayers’ authorship are by no means wild fantasies nor are they unfounded. There is ample reason to believe that William Ayers, not Barack Obama, is the author of ‘Dreams.’

@Teleologicus: Kind of hard to talk about comparing the texts when you haven’t even read the book in the first place. Just saying.

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Barack Must Go said:
The Guppies I purchased at PetSmart on Sunday came with a ” certification of live birth “. All that proves is they were born, and they were alive at the time.

That’s dumb, since the Hawaii certification of live birth also indicates that he was born in Hawaii. By rejecting the Hawaii birth certificate, by saying that is not enough, you reject full faith and credit of Hawaiian law, and the 10th Amendment. And that is how it is with this issue, where conservatives are so confused that they fight against State rights.

American League said:
I have no idea if he was born in Hawaii or on Mars for that matter

Only because you do not believe the State of Hawaii, respect its laws, or otherwise have a thread of common sense.

catfishjuggling said:
@Teleologicus: Kind of hard to talk about comparing the texts when you haven’t even read the book in the first place. Just saying.

You still do not seem to understand how comparative textual analysis works.

It works like this:

1. You read, study, parse and compare all of the available works by the authors in question, compare them line by line, and form your conclusions; or
2. You read the work of someone who has taken the time and gone to the trouble to do the above and see what they came up with.

Cashill builds his case carefully and slowly. He provides many examples and direct quotes. He cites numerous similarities in style, syntax, grammar, metaphors, favorite phrases, adjectives, phrasing – even, as I recall, punctuation. They are all laid out right in front of you so that you can see and decide for yourself.

You can read and re-read ‘Dreams’ every day of your life from now until your ticket expires and you will never be one jot wiser as to the authorship. Reading the book will tell you what is in the book. It will not, and cannot, tell you who wrote the book.

If you read ‘Deconstructing Obama’ you may not agree with me that Ayers wrote ‘Dreams.’ Plenty of people who have read Cashill are not 100% convinced like I am. But if you read ‘Deconstructing Obama’ you will certainly understand that there are legitimate and strong grounds for suspecting that Ayers, not Obama, is the author of ‘Dreams.’

Defenders of Mr. Obama like to insult skeptics and call them crazy for wanting proof. They never tire of slandering skeptics as ignorant and gullible conspiracy theorists who are led around by the nose by others. Yet it is the defenders of Mr. Obama who refuse to acquaint themselves with the facts – and to the lack of the facts necessary to support their beliefs. Defenders of Mr. Obama insist that they know what is on the original birth certificate and in all of Mr. Obama’s sealed records even though there is no possible way they could know. Defenders of Mr. Obama insist that they are certain he and he alone wrote ‘Dreams,’ even though there is no possible way they could know this. They refuse to consider and examine other possibilities or, as in the case of ‘Deconstructing Obama,’ to acquaint themselves with evidence that strongly suggests Mr. Obama did not write ‘Dreams.’ Really, they do nothing but insult, ridicule, smear, slander, mock and abuse Americans who are simply raising questions of fact for which the only possible answers are the facts themselves.

Teleologicus said:
the only possible answers are the facts themselves.

Obama will never change his stance on this issue because as an Hawaiian, matters of privacy are important.

valkyrie101 said:
Obama will never change his stance on this issue because as an Hawaiian, matters of privacy are important.

If you know what his stance on the matter is you know more than me. What is his stance? He has refused to make documents available. Indeed, it is reported that he, or someone, has actually spent millions of dollars in legal fees to keep them from being released. From all that one can deduce that he does not want them released. His theoretical stance, on the other hand, is not clear.

Has he asserted a right to privacy? I have not heard this if he has. As far as I know Mr. Obama has said nothing whatever as to why he refuses to make documents about his birth and life available to Americans. He has just pretended not to know there were such requests. When that became impossible because of the publicity, he began to make jokes about it, as though he could laugh it away. William Ayers has also begun to make jokes about his authorship of ‘Dreams’ – as though he could laugh the subject away! The media has tried for years to laugh such questions away. Some people actually seem to believe that by insulting and ridiculing Americans who would like to see the facts they are addressing the controversy.

I once read in his court pleadings for secrecy that disclosure could cause him irreparable harm, or something like that. This was during his candidacy. I have lost the link to the pleadings and cannot locate them on the web. Presumably they are part of the public record. If anyone has the link to the briefs submitted by Mr. Obama’s attorneys in their successful petition to suppress his records, I wish they would post it. It would also be good to have a summary of just what those millions in legal fees went to pay for. That is an awful lot of money for what would seem to be a fairly simple proceeding, the suppression of documents.

What, exactly, IS Mr. Obama’s stance? If he claims the right of privacy, why not come out and say so? As far as I am aware he has given Americans no explanation whatever of his strange, secretive, and increasingly self-incriminating behavior in regard to records of his past.

Teleologicus said:
Has he asserted a right to privacy? I have not heard this if he has. As far as I know Mr. Obama has said nothing whatever as to why he refuses to make documents about his birth and life available to Americans.

Of course he has mentioned privacy. And that is the essential issue. Hawaii law provides that birth information beyond that contained in the certificate of live birth is private. You may not like Obama exercising his right to privacy, but then, since you are not Hawaiian, you would not understand.

valkyrie101 said:
Of course he has mentioned privacy. And that is the essential issue. Hawaii law provides that birth information beyond that contained in the certificate of live birth is private. You may not like Obama exercising his right to privacy, but then, since you are not Hawaiian, you would not understand.

The essential issue, however, is whether he is legally eligible to be president.

Do you have a source for the claim that Mr. Obama has invoked his right to privacy as the justification for not releasing his records? Where is it documented that he did this?

To be precise, it is a question, not of invoking his right of privacy, but of the inexplicable refusal to waive it. No one seems to deny that the law protects his privacy. The question is, why has he not waived the right in order to put to rest the growing doubts about his presidency? If he has nothing to hide, why does he insist upon hiding something? What is the problem here?

The only reasonable explanation for Mr. Obama’s stubborn refusal to waive his right to privacy is that there is something he very much desires to keep hidden from the American people.

What is he hiding? No one can possibly know until we have the facts. The president of the United States of America should neither attempt nor be permitted to hide personal information from the American people. How would we know whether it is important or not unless we had the facts?

People for whom privacy and the right to privacy is paramount should not run for office – above all, not for the presidency of the United States. Nor should they write, or have written for them, autobiographies. They should not tell and re-tell what they claim is their personal life history in public. They should not make public statements about themselves and their past that they present as the truth unless they are prepared to provide documentation of such claims.

It is a truism that in politics it is the cover-up more than whatever is being covered up that finally brings down the house. That is what is happening in the case of Mr. Obama. We don’t know what he and others are covering up, but we know that they are certainly covering up SOMETHING. That only whets the appetite and makes people more curious. The more they try to cover up, the more curious and suspicious people become. What in the world can he be hiding from Americans? What is so bad that he stubbornly refuses to let the public know about? This stimulates speculation, theories, more suspicions. . .

Under these circumstances alleging his right of privacy, or rather refusing to waive such a right, simply becomes part of the problem, more reason to think that there is something truly important that he wants to keep hidden from his employer, the American people. Mr. Obama is not a king nor even a prince. He is a public servant who is answerable and accountable to the public. He has no business, none whatsoever, hiding anything from the public. And a public that would permit their president to get away with such outrageous insolence is unlikely long to enjoy the benefits of liberty. A public that would allow Mr. Obama to hide information from it would be a public of potential serfs and slaves.

Teleologicus said:
The essential issue, however, is whether he is legally eligible to be president

Well yes, and Hawaii has determined and certified that he was born in Hawaii. Thus, under U.S. law, as a naturally born citizen, Obama is qualified to be President. Yep, the issue is that simple.

As for Obama’s right to “privacy” that he is entitled to according to Hawaiian law, are you aware of any laws that require Presidents to waive that?

valkyrie101 said:
Well yes, and Hawaii has determined and certified that he was born in Hawaii. Thus, under U.S. law, as a naturally born citizen, Obama is qualified to be President. Yep, the issue is that simple.

As for Obama’s right to “privacy” that he is entitled to according to Hawaiian law, are you aware of any laws that require Presidents to waive that?

The issue is not simple, because lots of Americans still want to see for themselves. You are entitled to disagree with them about the necessity for this verification. You are not entitled to be correct as to whether such a step it necessary. It may be necessary or it may not be necessary. There is no way to know in advance, before it is taken. The fact that it is proving so immensely difficult to obtain public documentation is beyond strange. The fact that Mr. Obama refuses to waive his right to privacy to settle this controversy is only explicable by presuming that he is hiding something that he regards as highly damaging were it to become known.

I am not invested in the citizenship issue. I am invested in the cover-up. I and many other Americans want to know just what it is that he has tried so hard to keep us from knowing about him. I am as much if not more interested in his later life records than his original birth certificate. Apparently almost everything documented about this man contains potentially damaging information that he doesn’t want us to know.

The issue is not going away. It is growing. It cannot be argued away, sneered away, insulted or ridiculed away. Mr. Obama is hiding something and Americans want to know what it is. The truth will eventually come out, probably sooner rather than later now that Trump has gotten involved. He is clearly not somebody to be intimidated by the usual kinds of juvenile insults and personal abuse heaped upon Americans who are simply asking for some evidence and proof to decide for themselves.

The behavior and downright complicity of the mainstream media in this cover-up, whatever turns out to have been covered up, has been beyond disgraceful. One wonders how journalists are able to live with themselves these days. Rather than act the role of watchdog of the public trust and investigate Mr. Obama, they actually investigate and try to destroy those who are trying to learn the facts about him!

Teleologicus said:
The issue is not simple, because lots of Americans still want to see for themselves

Here, let me help them, here is Obama’s birth certificate: http://factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html

Teleologicus said:
I am not invested in the citizenship issue. I am invested in the cover-up

So, this whole thing sounds like an effort to obtain information about Obama, deemed private by Hawaiian law, rather than prooving anything about Obama’s status as a natural born citizen. Your banking on the private information containing some dirt on Obama unrelated to his citizenship. Right?

valkyrie101 said:
So a “certification of live birth” does not mean “birth certificate”? OK. That sounds very logical. You want Obama to produce something more than certification of birth, you want him to also provide information that the State of Hawaii has deemed, by law, to be private. And that is the bottom line.

It’s kind of a “Who’s On First” routine with you liberals when you are determined to not understand something.

valkyrie101 said:
So, this whole thing sounds like an effort to obtain information about Obama, deemed private by Hawaiian law, rather than prooving anything about Obama’s status as a natural born citizen. Your banking on the private information containing some dirt on Obama unrelated to his citizenship. Right?

I don’t have any idea what he is hiding. It is perfectly possible that he is not hiding anything, or that if he is hiding something, it is of no consequence to the country. We have no way of knowing what it is until we know what it is. Permitting Mr. Obama or any other elected official to hide something from the voters that the voters want to know is absurd and dangerous to liberty and good government. Permitting elected officials to hide behind a right to privacy to keep potentially important information about them and their past from citizens is a perfect formula for corruption and malfeasance.

Americans have every right and in fact a grave responsibility to find out what Mr. Obama is so determined to hide from them. The situation is akin to that frequently encountered by police officers in a patrol car who spot someone running from them as soon as he sees them. The presumption is that running from the police signifies consciousness of guilt. Innocent people do not run from the police. People with nothing to hide do not hide something.

Attempts to confine the scope of the inquiry into Mr. Obama’s past to his secret birth certificate -if one actually exists- fail to recognize the scope of the information blackout surrounding this very strange individual.

It is understood that you and others do not agree with these inquiries. No one is asking you to agree. You may turn out to be right after all when the withheld information is finally obtained. It may all have been a false alarm, much ado about nothing. Skeptics like me may have egg on our faces. There is no way to know what Mr. Obama has been hiding until Americans know what he has been hiding.

He is hiding something. Whatever he is hiding he obviously considers highly damaging to his political stature. The president of the United States is a public employee who works for the people of the United States. He has no business hiding anything from them for any reason whatsoever. If he wishes to lead a private and unexamined life he should not write books about his life and campaign for the presidency. He should not promote public narratives about his personal background and experiences that he is unwilling to verify by making existing documentation available to those who wish to review it.

It is time for him to come clean. The longer he keeps trying to hide whatever he is hiding from Americans, the worse it will be for him. This issue is not going away. Indeed, it is only now just beginning. It can no longer be ignored. Sneering and slandering and ridiculing Americans who would like to see the proof of Mr. Obama’s claims and to have some documented information about his past is not going to make them and their demands for such information go away. All such tactics do is make defenders of Mr. Obama look as guilty as he himself now looks – for if there were nothing to hide, there would be no reason to hide anything.

Oy.
Someone once said that the biggest mistake that Obama made was putting his COLB online, because it gave people the opportunity to claim it was fake.
Obama wrote “Dreams from my Father”, period. Cashill could write that the moon is made of green cheese, and give pages of “evidence” to support it for all I care. Barack Obama did not need anyone to write his autobiography for him. He could, and did, write it himself. There is no “smoking gun” proof otherwise, and until there is, Cashill and his ilk are just spewing nonsense IMO.
It’s quite apparent that Barack Obama has met all the LEGAL requirements to assume the Office of President. If he doesn’t feel the need to answer every question and show every document, that is his right as a citizen. The great thing about this country is that people have the right – some would say the duty – to ask questions of others. The other great thing is that those others also have the right to tell those people asking the questions to mind their own damn business.

Lulany said:
Oy.
Someone once said that the biggest mistake that Obama made was putting his COLB online, because it gave people the opportunity to claim it was fake.
Obama wrote “Dreams from my Father”, period. Cashill could write that the moon is made of green cheese, and give pages of “evidence” to support it for all I care. Barack Obama did not need anyone to write his autobiography for him. He could, and did, write it himself. There is no “smoking gun” proof otherwise, and until there is, Cashill and his ilk are just spewing nonsense IMO.
It’s quite apparent that Barack Obama has met all the LEGAL requirements to assume the Office of President. If he doesn’t feel the need to answer every question and show every document, that is his right as a citizen. The great thing about this country is that people have the right – some would say the duty – to ask questions of others. The other great thing is that those others also have the right to tell those people asking the questions to mind their own damn business.

I’ve read a lot of Cashill’s stuff. Plus, i casually know the blogger than Ayers admitted to that he wrote the book.

One of the points about Obama is that he hasn’t done much writing. Very little. Supposedly ONE paper (on abortion) was found at Harvard.

He apparently was put on the Harvard Law Review because of affirmative action. (The Wikipedia entry for the requirements to get on the Harvard Law Review has been edited to downplay the affirmative action policy. If you want to look, the change was made around the election. Find the Wikipedia entry and review the history. You’ll see what I mean. I can look it up if you want.)

Regardless, the book is supposedly very good. The other books were hacked up for the election, but everyone knows this – it was expected. But “Dreams” was supposedly written by him. Cashill makes a good case that Ayers wrote it.

Alz said:
It’s kind of a “Who’s On First” routine with you liberals when you are determined to not understand something.

Face it, no rational person can deny that Obama was born in Hawaii. Beyond that, the extra information that you want from the so called “long form”, which is private pursuant to Hawaii law, is beside the point, something you seek besides proof of birth. The birth certificate issue is just a smokescreen.

Teleologicus said:
I don’t have any idea what he is hiding. It is perfectly possible that he is not hiding anything, or that if he is hiding something, it is of no consequence to the country. We have no way of knowing what it is until we know what it is

So there you have it. This has nothing to do with his birth certificate, or whether he was born in the U.S. (which is not disputable), but rather, a fishing expedition for some other unknown information, which is protected as private by Hawaiian law. Just the old bait and switch.

Lulany said:

It’s quite apparent that Barack Obama has met all the LEGAL requirements to assume the Office of President. If he doesn’t feel the need to answer every question and show every document, that is his right as a citizen. The great thing about this country is that people have the right – some would say the duty – to ask questions of others. The other great thing is that those others also have the right to tell those people asking the questions to mind their own damn business.

No one is questioning Mr. Obama’s right not to answer questions about his past. The concern has to do with why he refuses to make documents available that he and others claim prove his citizenship and eligibility. Beyond that, why has just about everything about him been kept secret from Americans?

Refusal to produce the original birth certificate is just the tip of the iceberg. Other quarantined records include his kindergarten records, his Punahou school records, his Occidental College records, his Columbia University records, his Columbia thesis, his Harvard Law School records, his Harvard Law Review articles, his scholarly articles from the University of Chicago, his passport, his medical records, his files from his years as an Illinois state senator, his Illinois State Bar Association records, any baptism records and his adoption records.

The president of the United States is not a king, a prince, or some special person who is above other Americans. He is a public employee and a public servant. He works for the public. He has absolutely no business keeping anything about himself secret from Americans who want the facts about him. There is no way for anyone to know whether the facts he is keeping secret are important and pertain to the national interest until we know what they are.

This man is hiding something from Americans. He would not be hiding so much if he did not believe it would be damaging to him if people knew what it was. His own actions and consciousness of guilt show that there is something of significance in his records that Americans need to know about. It may or may not have anything to do with his citizenship and eligibility for public office – but it is important enough for him to hide from us. We need to know what he is hiding.

valkyrie101 said:
Face it, no rational person can deny that Obama was born in Hawaii.

Nothing is “rational” simply because a Liberal claims it is. “Rational” is an objective state from which Hussein refuses to participate. You Dims are just parroting what you’re taught by your “thinkers”…………the ones you let do your thinking for you. And there’s NOTHING “rational” about that.

Where’s the PROOF?

valkyrie101 said:
So there you have it. This has nothing to do with his birth certificate, or whether he was born in the U.S. (which is not disputable), but rather, a fishing expedition for some other unknown information, which is protected as private by Hawaiian law. Just the old bait and switch.

This is a misunderstanding. It certainly IS a matter of dispute as to whether Mr. Obama is legally eligible to be president. That you and others regard this dispute as frivolous or absurd does not make it any less of a dispute. A growing number of Americans are beginning to doubt Mr. Obama’s bona fides. That is how the whole business began in the first place. His inexplicable refusal to provide the documentation that is said to exist, that some people claim to have seen, and that proves beyond any doubt that he is a citizen of the United States and thus eligible for the presidency, is the reason the dispute has not gone away but continues to grow and has now reached potentially ruinous proportions.

Apparently you were confused by my remarks about the larger cover-up of his public records. I am indeed interested in such records, for I am convinced that he is hiding something important from Americans. I do not know what he is hiding, only that he is hiding something and that he thinks it worth hiding. But neither I nor many other Americans regard the birth certificate and eligibility question as settled. It cannot be settled until be does the only thing can settle it, release the necessary documentation so people can see for themselves.

Davo said:
Nothing is “rational” simply because a Liberal claims it is. “Rational” is an objective state from which Hussein refuses to participate. You Dims are just parroting what you’re taught by your “thinkers”…………the ones you let do your thinking for you. And there’s NOTHING “rational” about that. Where’s the PROOF?

By law, the fact of Obama’s birth in Hawaii is established by this birth certificate: http://factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html As for any additional information, Hawaii deems that information private.

Teleologicus said:
It cannot be settled until be does the only thing can settle it, release the necessary documentation so people can see for themselves.

As a matter of law, the matter has been settled by this document: http://factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html If you reject that, then you reject Hawaiian law.

Teleologicus said:
That is how the whole business began in the first place. His inexplicable refusal to provide the documentation that is said to exist, that some people claim to have seen, and that proves beyond any doubt that he is a citizen of the United States and thus eligible for the presidency

Why would the additional information contained on the long form birth certificate settle anything since the matter is settled, already, as a matter of law? Hawaii deems the long form information to be private to protect its citizens but, to be sure, the short form certification is a bona fide birth certificate. Apparently the birthers believe that there is something in the long form that can be used to attack Obama, but it has nothing to do with prooving that he was born in Hawaii or not. That is a smokescreen.

valkyrie101 said:
Why would the additional information contained on the long form birth certificate settle anything since the matter is settled, already, as a matter of law? Hawaii deems the long form information to be private to protect its citizens but, to be sure, the short form certification is a bona fide birth certificate. Apparently the birthers believe that there is something in the long form that can be used to attack Obama, but it has nothing to do with prooving that he was born in Hawaii or not. That is a smokescreen.

There is a rainbow of diverse and sometimes contradictory opinions as to what Mr. Obama is trying to hide from Americans by refusing to release his original birth certificate. Many Americans are convinced that it will prove he is not a citizen and is ineligible for the office he holds. They do no accept the story provided by spokespersons for the state of Hawaii. You may think they should, but they do not. They want to see for themselves. No matter how many times you and others claim that the matter is settled, the fact is that it is NOT settled. That is why we are having this discussion. Lots of Americans do not trust Mr. Obama. Lots of Americans do not trust people who speak for or in defense of Mr. Obama. Some Americans believe there is an organized conspiracy. Others simply find it strange and alarming that Mr. Obama refuses to respond to simple requests for documentation. They presume, rightly I think, that he is trying to hide something from them.

I am an agnostic on the citizenship question. I would like to see the proof with my own eyes. I do not trust the representatives of the state of Hawaii to tell or even to know the truth about this matter. The fiasco of Governor Abercrombie’s promise to release the document and his failure to do so makes me more suspicious than ever. At this point I am not even sure there IS such a document, much less what is or is not on it.

The solution is simple. Mr. Obama should provide all the requested documents about his life, including but not limited to the birth certificate There is absolutely no reason for him not to do so unless he had something to hide from the American people. Insulting the character, the motives, the sanity and the ethics of Americans who would like the facts about Mr. Obama does not and cannot substitute for the facts themselves.

valkyrie101 said:
Why would the additional information contained on the long form birth certificate settle anything since the matter is settled, already, as a matter of law? Hawaii deems the long form information to be private to protect its citizens but, to be sure, the short form certification is a bona fide birth certificate. Apparently the birthers believe that there is something in the long form that can be used to attack Obama, but it has nothing to do with prooving that he was born in Hawaii or not. That is a smokescreen.

Teleologicus said:
There is a rainbow of diverse and sometimes contradictory opinions as to what Mr. Obama is trying to hide from Americans by refusing to release his original birth certificate. Many Americans are convinced that it will prove he is not a citizen and is ineligible for the office he holds. They do no accept the story provided by spokespersons for the state of Hawaii. You may think they should, but they do not. They want to see for themselves. No matter how many times you and others claim that the matter is settled, the fact is that it is NOT settled. That is why we are having this discussion. Lots of Americans do not trust Mr. Obama. Lots of Americans do not trust people who speak for or in defense of Mr. Obama. Some Americans believe there is an organized conspiracy. Others simply find it strange and alarming that Mr. Obama refuses to respond to simple requests for documentation. They presume, rightly I think, that he is trying to hide something from them. I am an agnostic on the citizenship question. I would like to see the proof with my own eyes. I do not trust the representatives of the state of Hawaii to tell or even to know the truth about this matter. The fiasco of Governor Abercrombie’s promise to release the document and his failure to do so makes me more suspicious than ever. At this point I am not even sure there IS such a document, much less what is or is not on it. The solution is simple. Mr. Obama should provide all the requested documents about his life, including but not limited to the birth certificate There is absolutely no reason for him not to do so unless he had something to hide from the American people. Insulting the character, the motives, the sanity and the ethics of Americans who would like the facts about Mr. Obama does not and cannot substitute for the facts themselves.

Again, Obama has a right to his privacy under Hawaiian law. Would you also demand the opening of someone’s adoption file, or sealed divorce matter? I mean, there are all kinds of things that must be submitted with those kind of cases, tons of private material. Why not demand that too? Because the law keeps some things private, even if you think a politician has no privacy rights.

valkyrie101 said:
Again, Obama has a right to his privacy under Hawaiian law. Would you also demand the opening of someone’s adoption file, or sealed divorce matter? I mean, there are all kinds of things that must be submitted with those kind of cases, tons of private material. Why not demand that too? Because the law keeps some things private, even if you think a politician has no privacy rights.

Well, you walked into this one. That’s EXACTLY what Obama did to one of his opponents, Jack Ryan in 2004. Obama and the Axelrod of Evil were behind the work to get Ryan’s divorce papers released.

Obama used the divorce papers to his own advantage (despite warning about the Ryan’s child).

As for the Birth Certificate, with all that we know about Obama, it’s the least he can do to produce it.

Telesomething
This is a misunderstanding. It certainly IS a matter of dispute as to whether Mr. Obama is legally eligible to be president.
*Tedderman says:
Every thing you say aftyer this sentence in a moot point. When you begin with this as your premise you’ve already lost.

Oh and Alz, Ryan lost because his wife actress (Seven of nine/Star Trek)Jerry Ryan made it known that he tried to get her to go to swingers clubs with him. He was just another “Family values retuglican” who couldn’t keep it in his pants.