I didn’t like what Obama said.
I won’t know why until I listen to Mark Levin and watch Fox News.

Proof he is way out of his league internationally. This could be dangerous.

This administration doesn’t know world history and is setting the stage for the Muslim Brotherhood to take over the Egyptian Army. He is going to make Jimmy Carter look good.

“President Barack Obama addressed the situation in Egypt right now, speaking from the White House State dining room, and revealed that he spoke with Hosni Mubarak shortly after the embattled Egyptian president’s recent speech, claiming that he told Mubarak that “he has a responsibly to give meaning” to the words he delivered earlier. ”

Translation , have staff develop pithy , platitudinous three word slogan.

Wow. I voted for Obama, and I regret it more and more every single day.

This is a very delicate situation. Egypt has been one of our allies for a while so on the one hand you piss them off and the current government comes out as the winner then you have a problem. On the other hand if you piss off the protesters and they come out as the winners then you have a problem. Contrary to what people may believe he has to tip toe around this.

Could one of you Righty’s please give me an example of exactly what you think Obama should have said?

Keep it short. Thank you.

BO is gonna be so in trouble with his “Brotherhood!”

ifpff said:
Wow. I voted for Obama, and I regret it more and more every single day.

Good for you.

How’s that Ban On Drilling looking now Barry?

In 2012, get rid of this BUM and his Discredited ENVIRONMENTALIST TYRANNY!

BFD said:
Could one of you Righty’s please give me an example of exactly what you think Obama should have said?

Yes we can . ; )

But I thought Obama would heal the world?!?

What does he mean by give meaning to your words. He’s been there for 30yrs.

Did Obama have to “clear” his speech with his masters at Goldman-Sachs before he SAID NOTHING?

NORBIT Jr. said:
How’s that Ban On Drilling looking now Barry?

In 2012, get rid of this BUM and his Discredited ENVIRONMENTALIST TYRANNY!

This is madness! what has environmentalism has to do with the riot in Egypt?

he said we stand with everyone, so who ever wins so do we,,…. its perfect….if you dont take a stand for or against we win

NORBIT Jr. said:
Did Obama have to “clear” his speech with his masters at Goldman-Sachs before he SAID NOTHING?

Before he said Nothing? ok, so air came out of his mouth.

What kind of logic is that?

Before he said nothing.

Accusing him of saying something that he didn’t day. ahhh what the hell?

tws258 said:
Yes we can . ; )

Wattsa matta? You can’t do it?
Obama has to walk a tightrope while this is a fluid situation.
I want to know how he could have said it better.

Typical GOPbaggers…tear down without any clear ideas how to do better.

waiting…

Hey Gibbs . Print up 80 million ” Remember My Cairo Speech ” t -shirts , quick !

redleaf said:
I didn’t like what Obama said.
I won’t know why until I listen to Mark Levin and watch Fox News.

LOL!! your observations crack me up

Me, I’m going to read Brietbart’s site to find out why he’s so very wrong.

do we stand with our dictator or not? tick..tock

BO said “supressing ideas never succeeds in making them go away!” @ about 2:20!

Can you lefties remind BO of his words in the future…cause he and his people sure try their best to Supress ideas they don’t like.

Oh well, those are just his words and his words means nothing anymore.

Do as I say, not as I do.

Barack Obama

BFD said:
I want to know how he could have said it better.

“Don’t stop thinking about tomorrow “

Liberal Tormentor (formerly Seeing 2012 From My Window) said:
Do as I say, not as I do.

Barack Obama

You mean like you blind follow Beck day in Day out, just because he is a Mormon just like yourself.

tws258 said:
“Don’t stop thinking about tomorrow ”

You guys have a lotta jokes but no ideas.

Dude you are obsessed with hating Mormons. Get over it, we don’t hate you.

Liberal Tormentor (formerly Seeing 2012 From My Window) said:
Dude you are obsessed with hating Mormons. Get over it, we don’t hate you.

lol, no you hate yourself, that’s why you come here to take your frustration out on others.

BFD said:
You guys have a lotta jokes but no ideas.

SarahP. said:
Here’s another translation. I, Barack Obama , have pissed my pants and there’s nothing anyone can do about it.

Democracy and real liberty is all well and good over there, but not if our gas prices go up too much. Let’s be reasonable.

C’mon all you brilliant speechwriters.
I’m still waiting.

Keep it pithy.

SarahP. said:
Hey nobody hates your religion.

Actually, I do.

Brainstem says:

Hey nobody hates your religion. We are, however, acutely aware of what a liar and total dumb shit you are.

Um brainstem, I prove you wrong on a daily basis and you STILL stick to your lies. I’m not sure who the 1 person is that gives you a thumbs up, but I’d love to meet them!

NM, it’s probably BFD that gives you the thumbs up and I have no desire to meet him.

CosmosDan said:
Democracy and real liberty is all well and good over there, but not if our gas prices go up too much. Let’s be reasonable.

and that is it. and our government will not take a stand

Liberal Tormentor (formerly Seeing 2012 From My Window) said:
Brainstem says:

Hey nobody hates your religion. We are, however, acutely aware of what a liar and total dumb shit you are.

Um brainstem, I prove you wrong on a daily basis and you STILL stick to your lies. I’m not sure who the 1 person is that gives you a thumbs up, but I’d love to meet them!

You don’t prove anything, you just parrot the dumb crap you heard you Brother Beck says. No original idea or knowledge comes from you, just the same tired crap that you spew day in day out. Don’t think for a moment that by playing the Mormon card would keep you cover it, far from it.

skyfet said:
This is madness! what has environmentalism has to do with the riot in Egypt?

Uh, is that a rhetorical question?

If not, then the answer can be found in the fact that Egypt is the largest oil-producing country in the world; and this administration is at WAR with the development of in-country fossil fuels!

Can we count on your vote now in 2012 to unseat the Obama and his tyrannical cabal?

Sky, I’ve proved you wrong on several occasions also. It’s really becoming a full time job to educate you libs.

Mr . Mubarak , Tear down your Twitter wall !

Liberal Tormentor (formerly Seeing 2012 From My Window) said:
Sky, I’ve proved you wrong on several occasions also. It’s really becoming a full time job to educate you libs.

lol, now you are repeating my lines. That’s what I use for notsosmart, see you are copying stuff without referencing it. You should be ashame of yourself. I’ve never heard you contribute any substantial idea of yourself, just the same tired talk radio ignoramus rubbish. You know it’s easy to tell apart, they always lack substance..

HAHA, I’m seriously concerned about your state of mind, Brainstem. How much internet time do they allow at the asylum?

SKy, you and brainstem should get together. A match made in ignorant bliss. Just please, for the love of everything that is good and holy do NOT procreate.

NORBIT Jr. said:
Uh, is that a rhetorical question?

If not, then the answer can be found in the fact that Egypt is the largest oil-producing country in the world; and this administration is at WAR with the development of in-country fossil fuels!

Can we count on your vote now in 2012 to unseat the Obama and his tyrannical cabal?

I’m right, it’s madness coming out of your mouth. Stay away from talk radio and right wing blogs, not good for your state of mind.

chris matthews is trying soo hard, this show is funny

Sky, you say the same ignorant things to anyone who disagrees with you. You need some new lines dude.

msnbc cheerleding is on, you guys have to watch this

Brainstem, what exactly did I lie about?

cjd, I seriously don’t know if I have the stomach for it!

Liberal Tormentor (formerly Seeing 2012 From My Window) said:
SKy, you and brainstem should get together. A match made in ignorant bliss. Just please, for the love of everything that is good and holy do NOT procreate.

Do you have plan to procreate with Glenn?

Nope, he’s married and so am I. That’s sacred to me.

Liberal Tormentor (formerly Seeing 2012 From My Window) said:
Sky, you say the same ignorant things to anyone who disagrees with you. You need some new lines dude.

So why steal them from me, I respect the fact that you admitted that you stole the line from me (after I called you out on it).

Liberal Tormentor (formerly Seeing 2012 From My Window) said:
cjd, I seriously don’t know if I have the stomach for it!

its funny, chris matthew just tries so hard…….and the guy in cairo just slapped him down

Liberal Tormentor (formerly Seeing 2012 From My Window) said:
Nope, he’s married and so am I. That’s sacred to me.

Right! If his wife leaves him, I bet you are readily available to keep him company.

Sky, which line did I steal from you?

And brainstem, I know you are there, why can’t you post a lie of mine if I’m constantly lying? I’ll bet my lies are hiding with Palin’s violent rhetoric somewhere.

Ok, cjd I’m doing it for you, but I’ve got my pepto handy!

Liberal Tormentor (formerly Seeing 2012 From My Window) said:
Brainstem, what exactly did I lie about?

I’d call it ignorant instead of lie. Because I truly think you don’t know what you are talking about. It’s a form of willful ignorance, you don’t know, but you don’t want to educate yourself.

skyfet said:
So why steal them from me, I respect the fact that you admitted that you stole the line from me (after I called you out on it).

Seriously, skyfet and liberal tormentor, what is wrong with the two of you? This is sad. The topic is the President’s statement on Egypt. There are too many strange commentors on this thing. I thought the two of you were better than that.

Oh boy, Tingles just called BO two-faced!! HAHA. It’s about time he figured that out!

Brainstem, I honestly do NOT know how to respond to you anymore, so I guess I just won’t.

Courteous Commentary, thank you for your critique of my posts, whether I asked for it or not.

Courteous Commentary said:
Seriously, skyfet and liberal tormentor, what is wrong with the two of you? This is sad. The topic is the President’s statement on Egypt. There are too many strange commentors on this thing. I thought the two of you were better than that.

Am sorry if I upset you, but it’s hard to let her get away with her silly attitude, especially when she intentionally divert from the topic at hand and spew the talk radio crap.

Hey GOP – while Obama is busy screwing up our response to the Egyptian crisis, DEFUND OBAMACARE!

NORBIT Jr. said:
Hey GOP – while Obama is busy screwing up our response to the Egyptian crisis, DEFUND OBAMACARE!

That would affect the availability of your drugs.

It’s hilarious that all you teabloggers can do is criticize Obama but not one of you can come up with something better.

still waiting….

SarahP. said:
Brainstem- You said you didn’t accept welfare. LIE!! You said you were educated. Another LIE! You said that as an adult you have not shit your pants. Yet another LIE!! You claim that you are not a brainstem. Another LIE!! You claim to be a good parent. A laughable LIE!!!

I think that might more than your itty-bittybrain can handle at one time. Go slow and don’t hurt yourself brainstem. No time limit on this asshole.

What the hell is wrong with you? There is far too much vulgar ignorant crap posted on this site but do you have to contend for the #1` spot? Please take a break.

skyfet said:
That would affect the availability of your drugs.

They already did that by banning the K-2!
lol

SarahP. said:
Brainstem- You said you didn’t accept welfare. LIE!! You said you were educated. Another LIE! You said that as an adult you have not shit your pants. Yet another LIE!! You claim that you are not a brainstem. Another LIE!! You claim to be a good parent. A laughable LIE!!!
I think that might more than your itty-bittybrain can handle at one time. Go slow and don’t hurt yourself brainstem. No time limit on this asshole.

I don’t care .

Hope and Change .

cjd ohio 1 said:
and that is it. and our government will not take a stand

It’s our history for what 30 , 40 50 years? We love liberty except when those with that liberty choose not to cooperate with us.

BFD said:
It’s hilarious that all you teabloggers can do is criticize Obama but not one of you can come up with something better.

still waiting….

You’re all chickenshit, just like the GOP who realize they have to actually put forth concrete ideas now instead if just tearing down Obama.

What a pathetic bunch. I thought at least on of you would give it a shot.

BFD said:
It’s hilarious that all you teabloggers can do is criticize Obama but not one of you can come up with something better.

still waiting….

Did you come up with the Teabloggers thing? It’s pretty funny.

CosmosDan said:
It’s our history for what 30 , 40 50 years? We love liberty except when those with that liberty choose not to cooperate with us.

its not right, but it is so true cosmos

Here’s an idea you Progressives might like – seeing as we haven’t heard much outrage from you on the subject:

What if the President just uses some of HIS drones that are slaughtering innocent Afghani’s, and borrows them to kill off the Democratic protestors?

Would the Left stay as QUIET as they have been about the Afghan carnage?

CosmosDan said:
Did you come up with the Teabloggers thing? It’s pretty funny.

Yup. :)

I’m waiting for it to go viral. Help a brotha out.
I just googled “teablogger” and I guess there already is one site, but it’s an actual tea drinking connoisseurs site. lol

BFD said:
You’re all chickenshit, just like the GOP who realize they have to actually put forth concrete ideas now instead if just tearing down Obama.

I actually think they have in some cases and our horrible media outlets don’t stress it enough. Tom Coburn made the rounds with some serious alternatives and suggestions for the health Care Reform, and he and another GOP Dr did a series of web shows about it. Sadly it wasn’t given enough coverage. They’d rather cover the superficial contrived controversy.

BFD said:
Yup. :)

I’m waiting for it to go viral. Help a brotha out.
I just googled “teablogger” and I guess there already is one site, but it’s an actual tea drinking connoisseurs site. lol

I’ll do what I can. It’s cool because there’s nothing offensive about it really, ………but it’s only a couple of letters off. You sly devil.

BFD said:
Yup. :) I’m waiting for it to go viral. Help a brotha out.I just googled “teablogger” and I guess there already is one site, but it’s an actual tea drinking connoisseurs site. lol

BFD, you’re just so clever!

Maybe you can tell us why Goldman, Morgan, Citi, etc. are still handing out billion-dollar bonuses – while borrowing from the Treasury at 0% rate for company takeovers and overseas investments – while millions remain unemployed.

Tell us why a President who CLAIMS to be for the people allows that to continue unabated.

Remember this people, and tell everyone you know what a PHONY this guy in the White House is!

Where was the support for the uprising against Iran 2 years ago?
Now he comes out and supports the uprising in Egypt.
The Iranian regime is an enemy to the U.S., the citizens aren’t, though
The Egyptian regime, although not the greatest of allies, is an ally none the less
What will replace the Egyptian regime if it falls? What are the alternatives?
“Gaza”- Hamas
Lebanon- Hezbollah
Egypt- The Muslim Brotherhood (?)

Rather than shoot at each other on this site, let’s TRY to discuss the issues. Who’s with me?

NORBIT Jr. said:
Here’s an idea you Progressives might like – seeing as we haven’t heard much outrage from you on the subject:

What if the President just uses some of HIS drones that are slaughtering innocent Afghani’s, and borrows them to kill off the Democratic protestors?

Would the Left stay as QUIET as they have been about the Afghan carnage?

FTR; I completely agree that it’s a disgrace that we are still in Afghanistan AND, that the media pretty much ignores it, AND, that the general public , including me, is allowing it to be ignored.

That said, keep in mind that the GOP is at least, just as guilty. There were plenty of people, world wide protesting Bushes wars and were ridiculed for it. We’ve been temporarily placated by a new president who claims he wants to end it , but ,..it’s complicated. It’s time to get pissed off again, but let’s not pretend it’s a failure for the Dems alone.

SarahP. said:
no one gives a shit what you think.

I do. That poster is at least humorous, rather than constantly venomous.

CosmosDan said:
FTR; I completely agree that it’s a disgrace that we are still in Afghanistan AND, that the media pretty much ignores it, AND, that the general public , including me, is allowing it to be ignored. That said, keep in mind that the GOP is at least, just as guilty. There were plenty of people, world wide protesting Bushes wars and were ridiculed for it. We’ve been temporarily placated by a new president who claims he wants to end it , but ,..it’s complicated. It’s time to get pissed off again, but let’s not pretend it’s a failure for the Dems alone.

I totally agree with you on this statement

I believe it was Buchanan would said something like “the left wing and the right wing are BOTH attached to the same bird of prey”

Dsiscokid said:
Where was the support for the uprising against Iran 2 years ago?Now he comes out and supports the uprising in Egypt.The Iranian regime is an enemy to the U.S., the citizens aren’t, thoughThe Egyptian regime, although not the greatest of allies, is an ally none the lessWhat will replace the Egyptian regime if it falls? What are the alternatives?“Gaza”- HamasLebanon- HezbollahEgypt- The Muslim Brotherhood (?) Rather than shoot at each other on this site, let’s TRY to discuss the issues. Who’s with me?

Dsisco,
I don’t think John King is going to like your using the word “shoot”! lol

Also, recall that Obama sided with the despot in Honduras that wanted to ignore their constitution and pull a Hugo (another BFF of Barry’s), so we don’t know where he stands on the Brotherhood now, either.

Dsiscokid said:
Now he comes out and supports the uprising in Egypt.

I think he was pretty supportive of Mubarik as well, while still trying to quell more violence and press for more freedoms for the Egyptian citizenry.

He played it the only way he could and I can’t imagine Bush playing it any differently.

NORBIT Jr. said:
Dsisco,I don’t think John King is going to like your using the word “shoot”! lol Also, recall that Obama sided with the despot in Honduras that wanted to ignore their constitution and pull a Hugo (another BFF of Barry’s), so we don’t know where he stands on the Brotherhood now, either.

I was going to bring Honduras up, but you “beat me to the punch” (sorry for the hateful rhetoric)

Dsiscokid said:
Where was the support for the uprising against Iran 2 years ago?
Now he comes out and supports the uprising in Egypt.
The Iranian regime is an enemy to the U.S., the citizens aren’t, though
The Egyptian regime, although not the greatest of allies, is an ally none the less
What will replace the Egyptian regime if it falls? What are the alternatives?
“Gaza”- Hamas
Lebanon- Hezbollah
Egypt- The Muslim Brotherhood (?)

Rather than shoot at each other on this site, let’s TRY to discuss the issues. Who’s with me?

Sounds good to me.
I honestly don’t know much about it.
Historically I think we’ve favored governments that cooperated with our interests fist, and put democracy and human rights below that. However, we still have to maintain at least the impression that what we truly value is liberty and human rights , so balancing the two is pretty dam tricky.
I also think that there’s a real danger of more radical Islam dominating those countries if there’s a power vacuum, but the catch 22 is, our continued interference and military presence there only exacerbates the problem by breeding mistrust and resentment and helping the radicals recruit, while total withdrawal also poses its on risks.

CosmosDan said:
FTR; I completely agree that it’s a disgrace that we are still in Afghanistan AND, that the media pretty much ignores it, AND, that the general public , including me, is allowing it to be ignored. That said, keep in mind that the GOP is at least, just as guilty. There were plenty of people, world wide protesting Bushes wars and were ridiculed for it. We’ve been temporarily placated by a new president who claims he wants to end it , but ,..it’s complicated. It’s time to get pissed off again, but let’s not pretend it’s a failure for the Dems alone.

Agreed Cosmos, we should be pulling back from just about ALL of our overseas follies.
I expected just that from this President, but like his incestuous relationship with Wall Street, we get more Deception & Status Quo than Hope & Change!

…hence my appelation, the Carnival Barker!!

BFD said:
I think he was pretty supportive of Mubarik as well, while still trying to quell more violence and press for more freedoms for the Egyptian citizenry. He played it the only way he could and I can’t imagine Bush playing it any differently.

True, it’s a tough situation for any Prez to be in. All things being equal, if the Egyptian Govt. falls, and they have “democratic elections”, I’m afraid we may see what happened in “Gaza” with Hamas happen in Egypt with the Muslim Brotherhood gain political ground there. Even worse, they border “Gaza” and Israel

Dsiscokid said:
I believe it was Buchanan would said something like “the left wing and the right wing are BOTH attached to the same bird of prey”

Good phrase. Ron Paul has called out our foreign policy several times as not really serving our national security

Here’s his What if talk that I very much appreciate.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4fHfdSi-GDo

In foreign policy, every nation on the face of the planet has always looked out for its own self-interests, as it should be. We need to be self-sufficient. We have believed the lie from the “One Worlders” in BOTH parties that we have to be in a “Global Economy” (for something to that effect). The first national leader here that mentions this is immediately labeled as a “Isolationist”. It’s sickening…..

NORBIT Jr. said:
Agreed Cosmos, we should be pulling back from just about ALL of our overseas follies.
I expected just that from this President, but like his incestuous relationship with Wall Street, we get more Deception & Status Quo than Hope & Change!

…hence my appelation, the Carnival Barker!!

Yep, it was incredibly disappointing to me to see him and our elected officials continue and justify horrible policies that continue to cost lives.
I’m convinced that both parties are so corrupt that we will never make real progress and will continue to be distracted with superficial bullshit unless middle America stop the partisan bickering and find some common causes and take to the streets if necessary.

I think we have some honest hard working public servants in DC but they are minimized and discouraged by the corruption of those with more influence and a failed media. I think the public is too easily distracted and manipulated and doesn’t prioritize honesty , but instead embraces superficial rhetoric .

I’ll stop before I lose control of the rant.

CosmosDan said:
Good phrase. Ron Paul has called out our foreign policy several times as not really serving our national security Here’s his What if talk that I very much appreciate. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4fHfdSi-GDo

Paul will also be the driving force to curtail – or abolish! – the corrupt, destructive Fed!

The integrity of our national government has been vitiated over the past 20 years, particularly with regulation changes enacted during the Carpetbagging Clinton Administration.
(btw, the MEDIA propagandized the causal relation between the Clinton years and a thriving economy – NOTHING ELSE!)

Principle espoused by the Tea Party, despite the juvenile barbs you’ll hear from the Liberal Media today, is what’ll clean the system.

NORBIT Jr. said:
BFD, you’re just so clever!

Damn dude, take a chill pill.

Shouldn’t you be out threatening Frances Piven?

BFD said:
Damn dude, take a chill pill. Shouldn’t you be out threatening Frances Piven?

BFD, you do come up with some funny retorts!

CosmosDan said:
I think the public is too easily distracted and manipulated and doesn’t prioritize honesty , but instead embraces superficial rhetoric .
I’ll stop before I lose control of the rant.

One thing I did hear Beck bring up months ago was the poor voter turnout in this nation. I’ll also add to that that most of the folks that do vote aren’t self-educated on the issues. They listen to their particular “brand” and vote in lock-step.

“Pepsi” will spook their voters into voting for them to stop the evil “Coke” racists and Christians
“Coke” will spook their voters into voting for them to stop the evil “Pepsi” radicals and Communists
Duopoly – Mastered by the “One Worlders” into leading folks into the false assumption of having a real, clear choice

But sadly, most Americans know more about sports and Hollywood than the things that really effect their lives.

Dsiscokid said:
In foreign policy, every nation on the face of the planet has always looked out for its own self-interests, as it should be. We need to be self-sufficient. We have believed the lie from the “One Worlders” in BOTH parties that we have to be in a “Global Economy” (for something to that effect). The first national leader here that mentions this is immediately labeled as a “Isolationist”. It’s sickening…..

Looking out for self interest is perfectly okay within certain limits. “We need what you have and we’re strong enough to take it” is looking out for our own interests, but violates our principles.

I think a world economy is unavoidable but I may be wrong. That said, how we get there is a huge issue. I think we need to make the change gradually while providing adequate work and for American citizens and incentives for business. That requires some compromises from big business and big labor.

NORBIT Jr. said:
(btw, the MEDIA propagandized the causal relation between the Clinton years and a thriving economy – NOTHING ELSE!)

And they conveniently leave out how it was all done on credit, which the Fed Reserve will happily extend to the Federal Govt.

btw, Kudos to the Chipster (Chip Read) for asking Gibbs where the President wasn’t addressing the Press Corps as the stage is set for WWIII.

Looks like there’s some major fracturing afoot in the press’ adulation of “The One”! – or as Chris Matthews might sing, “The Chill Is Gone!”

CosmosDan said:
Looking out for self interest is perfectly okay within certain limits. “We need what you have and we’re strong enough to take it” is looking out for our own interests, but violates our principles.

Agreed. This nation, with our own vast resources, needs basically nothing from other nations. We should have a totally self-sustaining economy

NORBIT Jr. said:
Principle espoused by the Tea Party, despite the juvenile barbs you’ll hear from the Liberal Media today, is what’ll clean the system.

Agreed. But what is even more potentially treacherous is the NeoCon factor, which want the Tea Party vote, but want to keep “business as usual”

Dsiscokid said:
One thing I did hear Beck bring up months ago was the poor voter turnout in this nation. I’ll also add to that that most of the folks that do vote aren’t self-educated on the issues. They listen to their particular “brand” and vote in lock-step.

“Pepsi” will spook their voters into voting for them to stop the evil “Coke” racists and Christians
“Coke” will spook their voters into voting for them to stop the evil “Pepsi” radicals and Communists
Duopoly – Mastered by the “One Worlders” into leading folks into the false assumption of having a real, clear choice

But sadly, most Americans know more about sports and Hollywood than the things that really effect their lives.

I agree. I had a friend who told me years ago that I was like most voters who only paid attention for a few months before an election and really didn’t know much. During the invasion of Iraq discussion I realized how ignorant I was and have tried to make an effort since. Obama has convinced me that no person or party will make the necessary changes unless the public changes their level of involvement. We need to spend less time entertaining ourselves and a little more time educating ourselves and staying aware of what the hell those DC assholes are up to. Each Party needs to do a better job of policing their own party and stop justifying the unacceptable because they’re on our team. If you’re conservative then great. Find an honest conservative voice that is not beholding to outside financial interests. If you’re a liberal , fine, do the same and don’t excuse corruption because of party loyalty.

Dsiscokid said:
And they conveniently leave out how it was all done on credit,

You mean like they do about the 2 wars Bush started?

If more self-admitted Liberals would attend Tea Party rallies and talk to some of the people, rather than take the media’s word about them, I’d believe that some would be surprised at how much they have in common.

If more self-admitted Conservative would listen to NPR and Democracy Now! and read some liberal blogs, rather than take the Right’s word about them, I’d believe that some would be surprised at how much they have in common

NORBIT Jr. said:
Principle espoused by the Tea Party, despite the juvenile barbs you’ll hear from the Liberal Media today, is what’ll clean the system.

Not convinced of that but I do agree the Tea Party has some very valid arguments and input to offer.

Dsiscokid said:
Agreed. This nation, with our own vast resources, needs basically nothing from other nations. We should have a totally self-sustaining economy

In my rural country boy view I’d like to see more small businesses that don’t have the power to crush us or manipulate the market. I’m not sure we could be totally self sustaining but far less dependent would be a great idea.

Dsiscokid said:
Agreed. This nation, with our own vast resources, needs basically nothing from other nations. We should have a totally self-sustaining economy

We did, for decades!
The disparity between top-tier earners and the average working class family for the longest time hovered around a 30-40 x ratio. Now it’s into the stratosphere.

The problem is that it’s taken the country 20-plus years now to realize that what’s good for Goldman-Sachs IS NOT good for the country…but apparently it does remain very good for this President!

Dsiscokid said:
Agreed. But what is even more potentially treacherous is the NeoCon factor, which want the Tea Party vote, but want to keep “business as usual”

I agree. I think the Tea Party has been corrupted by those who saw the opportunity and bought it, and too few people realize it.

the real john t said:
You mean like they do about the 2 wars Bush started?

Daddy Bush -Persian Gulf War and “New World Order”
Clinton- Somalia, Bosnia, Kosovo, and US Embassy bombings, followed by our retaliation on an aspirin factory in Sudan
W- Afghanistan (to route al-qaida and the Taliban, not stay and occupy), Iraq (based on “intelligence” from Daddy and Clinton, not to nation-build)
Obama- Keeping the status quo, doing his part to usher in a “New World Order”

There is enough garbage to go around for all

Dsiscokid said:
If more self-admitted Liberals would attend Tea Party rallies and talk to some of the people, rather than take the media’s word about them, I’d believe that some would be surprised at how much they have in common.

If more self-admitted Conservative would listen to NPR and Democracy Now! and read some liberal blogs, rather than take the Right’s word about them, I’d believe that some would be surprised at how much they have in common

Exactly. The desire to at least try and understand the position of out fellow Americans is a good thing. Let’s begin by giving each other the benefit of the doubt that we start from a place of wanting what’s best for our shared nation but disagree on the details. I have several friends that are pretty conservative , one very libertarian leaning and we get together every so often to hash things over. It’s very enlightening.

NORBIT Jr. said:
We did, for decades!
The disparity between top-tier earners and the average working class family for the longest time hovered around a 30-40 x ratio. Now it’s into the stratosphere.

The problem is that it’s taken the country 20-plus years now to realize that what’s good for Goldman-Sachs IS NOT good for the country…but apparently it does remain very good for this President!

And then our Supreme Court decides that corporations are just like people and ought to able to openly spend their billions buying elections.

Dsiscokid said:
Daddy Bush -Persian Gulf War and “New World Order”
Clinton- Somalia, Bosnia, Kosovo, and US Embassy bombings, followed by our retaliation on an aspirin factory in Sudan
W- Afghanistan (to route al-qaida and the Taliban, not stay and occupy), Iraq (based on “intelligence” from Daddy and Clinton, not to nation-build)
Obama- Keeping the status quo, doing his part to usher in a “New World Order”

There is enough garbage to go around for all

That’s true.

Dsiscokid said:
If more self-admitted Liberals would attend Tea Party rallies and talk to some of the people, rather than take the media’s word about them, I’d believe that some would be surprised at how much they have in common. If more self-admitted Conservative would listen to NPR and Democracy Now! and read some liberal blogs, rather than take the Right’s word about them, I’d believe that some would be surprised at how much they have in common

I’d also add that all from both sides at least attend a Bible-believing church and attempt to read the Bible, it would help also. Spiritually enlightening, indeed!

CosmosDan said:
That’s true.

Did you have a chance to watch the Six-part series on Fox about Conservatism? It was very educational. Not much love for Nixon or Daddy Bush. It was even-handed and covered at least the past 100 years

Here’s a couple of querries I’ve yet to hear posed:

1) If AIG was issuing Credit Default Swaps as insurance for what turned out to be toxic mortgages, but didn’t have the financial backing to cover those CDS’s, why weren’t those responsible for this charged with FRAUD?

2) As the CEO of Goldman-Sachs, Henry Paulson spearheaded the aggressive creation and sale of toxic mortgages, then as Treasury Secretary, duped an ignorant Congress and President into providing $700 billion of borrowed taxpayer monies to reimburse (at 100%) both Goldman, and their counter-party investors.

He did this by inserting a clause into the TARP that allowed him to re-direct the funds in this way, instead of buying up the toxic assets, which was the original authorization.
(This is what happens when an ignorant Congress votes on bills they don’t read!)
Why isn’t Henry Paulson IN JAIL?

CosmosDan said:
I agree. I had a friend who told me years ago that I was like most voters who only paid attention for a few months before an election and really didn’t know much. During the invasion of Iraq discussion I realized how ignorant I was and have tried to make an effort since. Obama has convinced me that no person or party will make the necessary changes unless the public changes their level of involvement. We need to spend less time entertaining ourselves and a little more time educating ourselves and staying aware of what the hell those DC assholes are up to. Each Party needs to do a better job of policing their own party and stop justifying the unacceptable because they’re on our team. If you’re conservative then great. Find an honest conservative voice that is not beholding to outside financial interests. If you’re a liberal , fine, do the same and don’t excuse corruption because of party loyalty.

I totally agree. We work together not with “bi-partisianship” (I loathe that term), but with principled compromise.

NORBIT Jr. said:
Here’s a couple of querries I’ve yet to hear posed: 1) If AIG was issuing Credit Default Swaps as insurance for what turned out to be toxic mortgages, but didn’t have the financial backing to cover those CDS’s, why weren’t those responsible for this charged with FRAUD? 2) As the CEO of Goldman-Sachs, Henry Paulson spearheaded the aggressive creation and sale of toxic mortgages, then as Treasury Secretary, duped an ignorant Congress and President into providing $700 billion of borrowed taxpayer monies to reimburse (at 100%) both Goldman, and their counter-party investors. He did this by inserting a clause into the TARP that allowed him to re-direct the funds in this way, instead of buying up the toxic assets, which was the original authorization.(This is what happens when an ignorant Congress votes on bills they don’t read!)Why isn’t Henry Paulson IN JAIL?

One reason perhaps is that “We the People” rely too heavily on slanted soundbites and the remote control. Michael Moore’s “Capitalism” movie touched on some of these details. Am I the only one who thought it was fishy that on TARP that W, Obama, McCain, et. took Paulson’s word for it and voted for it, no questions asked?!?! That is what we vote for public servant to do, SERVE THE PUBLIC!!

Dsiscokid said:
I totally agree. We work together not with “bi-partisianship” (I loathe that term), but with principled compromise.

But not compromised principles, which is usually the sticking point.

I’m of the firm belief that most of the world’s problems derive from the simple mis-behavior of IRRESPONSIBLE CHILDBEARING.

Unless a woman/man/couple has the wherewithall – financially, emotionally, maturity-wise, and commitment-wise – to bring a child into this world, they have no inherent “Right” to do so, and impose the result of their reckless decision on another innocent, independent, individual being.

Dsiscokid said:
One reason perhaps is that “We the People” rely too heavily on slanted soundbites and the remote control. Michael Moore’s “Capitalism” movie touched on some of these details. Am I the only one who thought it was fishy that on TARP that W, Obama, McCain, et. took Paulson’s word for it and voted for it, no questions asked?!?! That is what we vote for public servant to do, SERVE THE PUBLIC!!

McCain was a DISGRACE! – Remember when he made the big show about stopping his campaign to go back and straighten out the mess in Washington?

For what? – They said “Johnny-boy, just SHUT UP & sign the bill!”
Not a Peep from John McCain!

Dsiscokid said:
Did you have a chance to watch the Six-part series on Fox about Conservatism? It was very educational. Not much love for Nixon or Daddy Bush. It was even-handed and covered at least the past 100 years

I didn’t . I don’t have a lot of faith in Fox after watching some of their late night shows, On your recommendation I’ll take a look if I can find it.

One thing I’ve noticed and appreciated. More conservatives who focus on fiscal and personal responsibility are separating themselves from the religious right’s moral agenda. That’s a good call IMO. I think moderate Dems and independents will be far more likely to find common ground

Dsiscokid said:
We work together not with “bi-partisianship” (I loathe that term), but with principled compromise.

Exactly.

NORBIT Jr. said:
But not compromised principles, which is usually the sticking point. I’m of the firm belief that most of the world’s problems derive from the simple mis-behavior of IRRESPONSIBLE CHILDBEARING. Unless a woman/man/couple has the wherewithall – financially, emotionally, maturity-wise, and commitment-wise – to bring a child into this world, they have no inherent “Right” to do so, and impose the result of their reckless decision on another innocent, independent, individual being.

Whereas I believe in the sanctity of Life, and that abortion is abhorant, satanic evil, and an insult to the God of the Universe. God gives and creates life.

I like your phrasing “Principled compromise, not compromised principles”

Dsiscokid said:
One reason perhaps is that “We the People” rely too heavily on slanted soundbites and the remote control.

It’s difficult because a lot of people really don’t have the background to comprehend the complexities, but
a government of the people , for the people and by the people, also requires more participation and places more responsibility on the people.

I can’t take in all the complexities but having people move freely from a giant cooperation to a key influential role in government smells really bad.

CosmosDan said:
More conservatives who focus on fiscal and personal responsibility are separating themselves from the religious right’s moral agenda.

Herein lies a problem – Fiscal conservatives want the religious conservative vote, but then not address their concerns. When a legitimate religious conservative runs for office, a lot (not all) of fiscal conservatives won’t support him/her, IMHO.

Although there is a need for more religious conservatives to articulate their points more effectively without compromising their principles, IMHO

CosmosDan said:
but
a government of the people , for the people and by the people, also requires more participation and places more responsibility on the people.

So, so true. Responsibility. We all, as Americans, need to pay more attention to what is done in our name

NORBIT Jr. said:
But not compromised principles, which is usually the sticking point.

How is that done exactly. I often think that a too stubborn adherence to principle can also block progress.

We don’t have to change what we ultimately believe to compromise with those who believe differently.

NORBIT Jr. said:
Unless a woman/man/couple has the wherewithall – financially, emotionally, maturity-wise, and commitment-wise – to bring a child into this world, they have no inherent “Right” to do so, and impose the result of their reckless decision on another innocent, independent, individual being.

Here’s an example. I think in principle you are ideally correct. The issue is we have to deal with this in real world terms with real world policies, so what do we do? Sometimes , one ideal principle comes into conflict with another. Can we grant liberty, and somehow force people to behave in the responsible manner we think they should?

CosmosDan said:
Can we grant liberty, and somehow force people to behave in the responsible manner we think they should?

Pennsylvania Supreme Court

No free government now exists in the world, unless where Christianity is acknowledged, and is the religion of the country.
(Source: Pennsylvania Supreme Court, 1824. Updegraph v. Cmmonwealth; 11 Serg. & R. 393, 406 (Sup.Ct. Penn. 1824).)

We cannot force anybody to do to anything against their own will (nor should we), but we can, and should, have a moral, positive influence in our society, whenever we can! Thoughts?

NORBIT Jr. said:
McCain was a DISGRACE! – Remember when he made the big show about stopping his campaign to go back and straighten out the mess in Washington? For what? – They said “Johnny-boy, just SHUT UP & sign the bill!”Not a Peep from John McCain!

I respect John McCain , the war hero. John McCain, the Establishment Senator, is a whole other matter. The worst choice for the “Pepsi” party in ’08

Dsiscokid said:
Whereas I believe in the sanctity of Life,

I can respect this view, although not from a particular religious point, but again, ultimately we have to deal with this concept in real real world policies.

If we decide our own religious and moral views must be the law of the land, and make abortion illegal, we have to deal with the question of how aggressively we pursue and punish those who break that law. We also have to deal with the question of a growing population and the needs of children we insisted be born.

I don’t really like reducing the abortion issue to pro choice and pro life because I consider myself to be both. I do think those titles indicate the two ideals that collide in the abortion issue. Yes I am pro choice in that I try to respect and honor the free will of others to determine their own path. Yes I’m pro life in that I feel all life is worthy of consideration compassion and respect, even potential life. What do we do when those two principles collide?

CosmosDan said:
How is that done exactly. I often think that a too stubborn adherence to principle can also block progress. We don’t have to change what we ultimately believe to compromise with those who believe differently. Here’s an example. I think in principle you are ideally correct. The issue is we have to deal with this in real world terms with real world policies, so what do we do? Sometimes , one ideal principle comes into conflict with another. Can we grant liberty, and somehow force people to behave in the responsible manner we think they should?

Tough points, and I do have perspectives on them, but alas, the Mrs. is here now and we’re readying to watch a new Sherlock Holmes I have taped.

CosmosDan said:
Yes I’m pro life in that I feel all life is worthy of consideration compassion and respect, even potential life. What do we do when those two principles collide?

Deuteronomy 30:19
I call heaven and earth to record this day against you, that I have set before you life and death, blessing and cursing: therefore choose life, that both thou and thy seed may live:

When in life or death situations, choose life!

NORBIT Jr. said:
NORBIT Jr

CosmosDan said:
CosmosDan

I gotta run myself. Great conversation! Have a great evening and God Bless!

Dsiscokid said:
One reason perhaps is that “We the People” rely too heavily on slanted soundbites and the remote control. Michael Moore’s “Capitalism” movie touched on some of these details. Am I the only one who thought it was fishy that on TARP that W, Obama, McCain, et. took Paulson’s word for it and voted for it, no questions asked?!?! That is what we vote for public servant to do, SERVE THE PUBLIC!!

W, Obama and McCain are all too liberal. That’s the problem. We bailed out the banks, GM, etc. and it was all a big mistake. The country grew because we didn’t interfere when people screwed up – failure means failure, not bailouts.

And the beauty of failure is the best parts get resused. By bailing out what fails, we short-circuit one of the best mechanisms available to help make things better,

Dsiscokid said:
Pennsylvania Supreme Court

No free government now exists in the world, unless where Christianity is acknowledged, and is the religion of the country.
(Source: Pennsylvania Supreme Court, 1824. Updegraph v. Cmmonwealth; 11 Serg. & R. 393, 406 (Sup.Ct. Penn. 1824).)

I completely disagree with this and find it self contradicting as well as historically inaccurate.

Dsiscokid said:
We cannot force anybody to do to anything against their own will (nor should we), but we can, and should, have a moral, positive influence in our society, whenever we can! Thoughts?

This OTOH, I tend to agree with. I think in a culture as diverse as ours we are compelled to confront and contemplate differences in religion , culture and philosophies. In order to communicate across those lines we need to agree on certain principles common to us as humans rather than put them in terms of doctrine.
I hear the term Christian principles now and then. I ask what principles are uniquely Christian because I honestly don’t think there are any.
I think we need to respect each others right to follow our own path , and communicate in terms like love, brotherhood, compassion, justice, equality, that can reach across the boundaries of religion and philosophy and help us find common ground. Most importantly , we strive to live these principles and learn to appreciate others who strive to do the same, regardless of superficial labels.

NORBIT Jr. said:
Tough points, and I do have perspectives on them, but alas, the Mrs. is here now and we’re readying to watch a new Sherlock Holmes I have taped.

Thanks for the thoughtful input. How very refreshing.

Dsiscokid said:
When in life or death situations, choose life!

A simple principle that is far more complicated in real life situations.

Do we kill others to defend ourselves? Inevitably our own choices run into the choices of others Earlier you said , we cannot force anybody to do anything against their will {nor should we}. How does that apply in this case?

I really enjoyed the 3 way exchange. what a nice change of pace from what usually happens on this board. Thanks

Dsiscokid said:
Dsiscokid says:
January 28, 2011 at 10:35 pm Dsiscokid(Quote)
Thumb up 0 Thumb down 1

NORBIT Jr. said:
NORBIT Jr

CosmosDan said:
CosmosDan

When is the wedding and am I invited? :)

I was going to make a comment about the situation in Egypt to the effect that maybe people should realize that Obama was awarded the Nobel Peace Prize because a ‘handful’ of decadent Scandinavians thought he might be a good peacemaker. From what he’s doing with Mubarek maybe the reality is that Obama is a peacemaker. If McCain and Palin had won we’d probably be in even deeper shit in the Middle East including a war with Iran. However, with all the lovvy-dovvy stuff going on with the previous exchanges, I’d like to add that it would be great if there could be a left/right truce. Judging from many of the extreme, and they are extreme, comments made on this blog, most of us are set in our ways. I only ask that commonsense and civility reign. Some of the regulars on Mediaite are funny, vain and some are very informative. Unfortunately, some of the commentators are rude, ignorant, boring, deranged and even threatening. Why don’t we try to set a standard for what has to occasionally be fierce debate with good manners and respect. Let’s make fun of our differences.

ganymede said:
I was going to make a comment about the situation in Egypt to the effect that maybe people should realize that Obama was awarded the Nobel Peace Prize because a ‘handful’ of decadent Scandinavians thought he might be a good peacemaker. From what he’s doing with Mubarek maybe the reality is that Obama is a peacemaker. If McCain and Palin had won we’d probably be in even deeper shit in the Middle East including a war with Iran. However, with all the lovvy-dovvy stuff going on with the previous exchanges, I’d like to add that it would be great if there could be a left/right truce. Judging from many of the extreme, and they are extreme, comments made on this blog, most of us are set in our ways. I only ask that commonsense and civility reign. Some of the regulars on Mediaite are funny, vain and some are very informative. Unfortunately, some of the commentators are rude, ignorant, boring, deranged and even threatening. Why don’t we try to set a standard for what has to occasionally be fierce debate with good manners and respect. Let’s make fun of our differences.

It doesn’t work like you think. The problem is deep and it’s that both sides have different belief systems. Normal people measure success as when things are better ot can get better.

Modern Liberals/Progressives don’t work like this. They measure success as when things are “equal”. So most people work to make things better and the Left can’t stand it! They have to tear down success and behaviors that lead to success (while elevating failure) so everything is forced to be “equal.”

On the Modern Liberal/Progressive mind, if everything was “equal”, all of our societal problems would go away. No arguing. No fighting. No war. No Poverty/ No injustices. It’s Utopian.

It’s Utopian, but it can never work. It can never work because in order to force everything to be “equal”, they have to treat people unequally! So right out of the gate, the liberal system creates tension.

This is why they need to control everything. To them, if they could only control everything and tell everyone what to do, then they could get us to their goofy Utopia.

Circling back to what you said, the reality is the two sides can’t get along because they are soooo different. This is why the two sides can’t agree on much.

When you think about the liberal system, you realizing that not only can it not ever work, but it always ends up hurting people over time. …just think about the places with the most liberalism: the inner cities. The liberals have controlled these places for over 50 years and the results are terrible.

They never adapt because their only path is to force everything to be “equal” – so the suffering continues.

Liberal Tormentor (formerly Seeing 2012 From My Window) said:
Do as I say, not as I do.

Barack Obama

It’d be much easier to take anything you say as insightful if you didn’t blindly post biased comments like a robot. I realize you’re conservative and don’t like anything remotely liberal and that’s fine, I have no issue with that. But please at least pretend to post things that feel genuinely thought out and not just blanketed right sayings.

You are asking Seeing 2012 From My Sty for an original thought? She’s a serial liar and all she does is copy and pastes OTHER people’s thoughts and opinions.

stephenpyle said:
It’d be much easier to take anything you say as insightful if you didn’t blindly post biased comments like a robot. I realize you’re conservative and don’t like anything remotely liberal and that’s fine, I have no issue with that. But please at least pretend to post things that feel genuinely thought out and not just blanketed right sayings.

She doesn’t have those letters on her keyboard.

NORBIT Jr. said:
Here’s a couple of querries I’ve yet to hear posed:

1) If AIG was issuing Credit Default Swaps as insurance for what turned out to be toxic mortgages, but didn’t have the financial backing to cover those CDS’s, why weren’t those responsible for this charged with FRAUD?

2) As the CEO of Goldman-Sachs, Henry Paulson spearheaded the aggressive creation and sale of toxic mortgages, then as Treasury Secretary, duped an ignorant Congress and President into providing $700 billion of borrowed taxpayer monies to reimburse (at 100%) both Goldman, and their counter-party investors.

He did this by inserting a clause into the TARP that allowed him to re-direct the funds in this way, instead of buying up the toxic assets, which was the original authorization.
(This is what happens when an ignorant Congress votes on bills they don’t read!)
Why isn’t Henry Paulson IN JAIL?

The United States Supreme Court has even made it harder to put such people in prison in the future.

CosmosDan said:
I agree. I think the Tea Party has been corrupted by those who saw the opportunity and bought it, and too few people realize it.

Thinking it has been corrupted or co-opted is the wrong word. The people in the Tea Party movement are a diverse group, with a common theme: anger at abusive, liberty-stealing, overreaching, financially ruinous big government.

Like any movement, the establishment party hacks want to claim THEY speak for it. They don’t. And a lot of people in the movement are at an immature stage: they know what they are against, but they haven’t thought through all the implications of what they need to be FOR. And it’s hard to know what new pols wiithout track records will do. People know they want to throw the bums out, but it’s harder to figure out who shoutl get in.

The biggest failing among those who support the Tea Party movement is blindness on the endless, undeclared wars and how criminal it is to subject the brave men and women of our military to this. It is a corrupt big business. The core of the Tea Party movement is libertarian, and DOES understand this. But plenty of the later-comers are oblivious or worse. It will take continual pushes to show the true dynamics of the warfare state to change this. Good chance it won’t work anyway, and our foreign entanglements will have to be contained by being broke rather than by becoming more principled. As it almost always goes.

Sorry Dan, I got off on a side topic and didn’t finsh the thought. I think you will find that a large part of the Tea Party movement will stay rightfully prickly and fickle, NOT cutting the GOP a lot of slack as they sell out the movement. I do agree that there is confusion over who has stepped in with funding to try to take it over, but a LOT of that is probably not what it appears. A lot of it is simply that the usual party hacks and establishment ORGANIZED rally dates and times. The natural reality is that whoever does that will see a lot of the grassroots people simply google the protest places/times and show up for the rallies. But the illusion that this means the angry people who showed up actually support the hacks who picked the places and times is just that: an illusion.

Watch as the protests start soon, where the Tea Party starts protesting the GOP establishment’s trial-balloon sellouts.

Last thought on that: it wiil start with very black and white fiscal issues, like the debt ceiling. When the GOP party hacks in the House don’t stop the debt, you’ll see the first grassroots Tea Party protests against the GOP hacks, and the true limited government people in office will get a lot more sway, and the fence-sitters will start to move toward fiscal responsibility.

tws258 said:
“Don’t stop thinking about tomorrow ”

LMAO!

sarainitaly said:
LMAO!

Your laughter seems strangely familiar.

LOL!

By “meaning to your words”, is the President referring to “transparency”, “no more lobbyists”, “2009 Stimulus for infrastructure”, etc.

Sorry Mr. President, your words ring hollow with much of the public these days after all the LIES we’ve been told about who you are, and what you stand for.

You can fool your less astute supporters, but not the majority here in the ole’ U. S. of A.!
Want proof? – 11-02-10!!

Gasket said:
She’s a serial liar and all she does is copy and pastes OTHER people’s thoughts and opinions.

SHE is a liar? No, child, you lie shamelessly.

Just_MC said:
Thinking it has been corrupted or co-opted is the wrong word. The people in the Tea Party movement are a diverse group, with a common theme: anger at abusive, liberty-stealing, overreaching, financially ruinous big government.

I realize it’s diverse. I’m basing that on several things. There was an interview on this site with one of the Tea Party original founders who was complaining that once people starting realizing the movement was real and not fading away too quickly outside interests wanted a piece and started diluting the basic message that you just described. He was pretty pissed about it.

The 2nd thing is the source of the money. There’s an article about the Koch brothers
http://www.mediaite.com/online/the-new-yorker-reveals-whos-paying-for-the-tea-party-you-may-be-surprised/
and during the last election there were a lot of questions about money coming in from unnamed sources to certain elections.
Then there’s the recent article in which Rachel Maddow takes a look at the Tea Party express, which is somehow not the same as the Tea Party.
I don’t say this to slam the Tea Party. I do believe there are plenty of very sincere Americans in it.

NORBIT Jr. said:
LOL!

By “meaning to your words”, is the President referring to “transparency”, “no more lobbyists”, “2009 Stimulus for infrastructure”, etc.

Sorry Mr. President, your words ring hollow with much of the public these days after all the LIES we’ve been told about who you are, and what you stand for.

You can fool your less astute supporters, but not the majority here in the ole’ U. S. of A.!
Want proof? – 11-02-10!!

I can’t quite decide if Obama was serious during the campaign and then got to Washington to discover his own party wouldn’t cooperate with everything he wanted to do, or he was always just another political bullshitter. Considering the results I’m not sure it matters.

Just_MC said:
Last thought on that: it wiil start with very black and white fiscal issues, like the debt ceiling. When the GOP party hacks in the House don’t stop the debt, you’ll see the first grassroots Tea Party protests against the GOP hacks, and the true limited government people in office will get a lot more sway, and the fence-sitters will start to move toward fiscal responsibility.

Do you believe any of the stuff being pedaled that not raising the debt ceiling will make us default on our outstanding national debt. It’s all over my head.

http://massmirage.tumblr.com/post/2992384881

ganymede said:
I was going to make a comment about the situation in Egypt to the effect that maybe people should realize that Obama was awarded the Nobel Peace Prize because a ‘handful’ of decadent Scandinavians thought he might be a good peacemaker. From what he’s doing with Mubarek maybe the reality is that Obama is a peacemaker. If McCain and Palin had won we’d probably be in even deeper shit in the Middle East including a war with Iran. However, with all the lovvy-dovvy stuff going on with the previous exchanges, I’d like to add that it would be great if there could be a left/right truce. Judging from many of the extreme, and they are extreme, comments made on this blog, most of us are set in our ways. I only ask that commonsense and civility reign. Some of the regulars on Mediaite are funny, vain and some are very informative. Unfortunately, some of the commentators are rude, ignorant, boring, deranged and even threatening. Why don’t we try to set a standard for what has to occasionally be fierce debate with good manners and respect. Let’s make fun of our differences.

So you ask for civility and respect as you moch Mcain and Bush? Funny how the same people who call for civility are the same ones that mock Palin and who mocked Bush for 8 years. Wny should we be civil now? Because the left is getting whooped and Obama is a not a smart and presidentisl as the left and the media would like us to believe? For years the right stood by and held their tongue when Bush was mocked and threatened. Civility will come when the left relizes that they and they alone dont have all the answers. In fact, most of the liberal countries in Europe are a mess ( Egypt also)..Maybe when the left can stop hating poeople because of their beliefs we can be civil..Or mabe the left just needs to go the way of the doodoo bird

BREAKING NEWS!

The war in Afghanistan is over! Celebration!

http://www.thebigfeedblog.com/2011/01/breaking-war-in-afghanistan-is-over.html

It was about time that Obama showed up. He tells Mubarak to give meaning to his words. Obama might want to follow his own advice.

“Obama’s words are sure to be dissected in great detail in the coming days, but in short, the U.S. President insisted that there must be political, social and economic reforms in Egypt.”

Obama should have “insisted” this long ago. Coming at the11th hour his words mean very little.

libra blue said:
It was about time that Obama showed up. He tells Mubarak to give meaning to his words. Obama might want to follow his own advice.

“Obama’s words are sure to be dissected in great detail in the coming days, but in short, the U.S. President insisted that there must be political, social and economic reforms in Egypt.”

Obama should have “insisted” this long ago. Coming at the11th hour his words mean very little.

I’m sure Obama’s Community Organizing skills come in handy.

Strange advice coming from one who should be giving meaning (truth) to HIS words…

CosmosDan said:
Do you believe any of the stuff being pedaled that not raising the debt ceiling will make us default on our outstanding national debt. It’s all over my head.

I don’t believe the debt ceiling will make us default on debt, unless there is a particular cash flow issue. (Something in business that would require a bridge loan. Say, you have a good, sound business that should be profitable, but a particular cash crunch is in the way of making payroll this month. You get a short term loan to cover that dip, pay it off, and go forward profitably.)

Here’s why: Even if you accept the notion of what is “discretionary” income versus “mandatory”, which I don’t, we still have more money coming in in tax receipts than we have going out in “mandatory” Per the link below, we have 2.2 trillion coming in from taxes, and 2 billion in mandatory spending. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2010_United_States_federal_budget

As such, that leaves 200 billion to spend to run the government above and beyond the mandatory spending. Now, while that would require DRASTIC cuts to the federal government, we need drastic cuts. Further, I think the “mandatory” spending is a convenient protection that has been built for those who want entrenched social programs that are unsustainable pyramid schemes.

As recently as the year 2000, Federal spending was only 1.8 Trillion. This past year was 3.7 trillion. ( http://www.usgovernmentspending.com/federal_spending#usgs302a ) Clearly government expansion is completely out of control.

So, with our current tax receipt estimate of 2.2 trillion, cuts that returned us only to the bloated government of 2000 would see a surplus of 400 billion.

We really should eliminate whole departments. What happens if the Dept of Ed. goes away? So WHAT? They don’t TEACH anyone. Did we have schools before the Carter Administration? Sure, and they did better than our public schools do today. Likewise, “defense” needs huge cuts. It’s more than doubled since 2000. And all we’re doing is pi$$ing off the world, going broke, getting our own kids killed and maimed, killing and maiming others, and making warlords rich.

But the biggest hits are big entitlements. Obamacare needs to be ended first. SS and Medicare need to see benefits cut and a full grandfathering out, etc.

But I digress. The real point, per your note, is that our tax receipts EXCEED “mandatory” spending. By that, we COULD run pay all mandatory obligations (and thus NOT DEFAULT) without incurring any further debt. While that would mean drastic cuts and elimination of most of the federal government, WITHOUT RAISING THE DEBT CEILING, WE *CAN* AVOID DEFAULTING ON ANYTHING. ANY DEFAULT WOULD BE A CHOICE BECAUSE PEOPLE DECIDED TO USE THE MONEY WE HAD FOR SOMETHING DISCRETIONARY.

Do you follow my reasoning there?

More practically, we need to address the details of what is really mandatory, and start dismantling that debt bomb. But the point is that in the here and now, any DEFAULT on a mandatory obligation, like paying off treasury bills that mature, would be because we OPTED spent this year’s income on something else.

libra blue said:
It was about time that Obama showed up. He tells Mubarak to give meaning to his words. Obama might want to follow his own advice. “Obama’s words are sure to be dissected in great detail in the coming days, but in short, the U.S. President insisted that there must be political, social and economic reforms in Egypt.” Obama should have “insisted” this long ago. Coming at the11th hour his words mean very little.

Egypt is a sovereign country. Obama should leave them the he11 alone. How do you like it when Egypt and other countries on the UN Human “Rights” Commission come in and tell the USA how to run its internal affairs. Countries need to get out of each other’s $hit and focus on dismantling their own abusive governments.

And we should get rid of foreign aid. Most of it winds up in the hands of the jackbooted thugs and warlords, and more important, there is NO Constitutional justification for taking that money from the American people and handing it out elsewhere. None. You want to give YOUR OWN money to someone, have a goddamned field day. But stay the he11 away from other people’s money.

Talk about chutzpah! While behind the scenes, as per WikiLeaks, this administration has been encouraging the protesters to go into the streets (perhaps Piven has been giving instructions?), he thinks he can give advise to Mubarak? Has Obama listened to his own speeches in the past three weeks?

Just_MC said:
Do you follow my reasoning there?

More practically, we need to address the details of what is really mandatory, and start dismantling that debt bomb. But the point is that in the here and now, any DEFAULT on a mandatory obligation, like paying off treasury bills that mature, would be because we OPTED spent this year’s income on something else.

I think I do and I appreciate you explaining it.

Yes They Can!

Or not. Mubarak is pretty cute, isn’t he?

Just_MC said:
The people in the Tea Party movement are a diverse group, with a common theme: anger at abusive, liberty-stealing, overreaching, financially ruinous big government.

Not trying to blow smoke here but in reading the above excerpt and the two following, you make more sense to me than a lot of others I read here.

From where I sit, I can see the inflitration of the hacks into the Tea Party. This may offend some, but I view Michelle Bachmann as one of those hacks. As I’ve said before, she’s a decent person, but she most definitely has an agenda, and her agenda is advancing Michelle Bachmann’s political career. Case in point: I used to get her newsletter but every damned month she was PLEADING for donations. That is NOT service to one’s country, it is service to one’s SELF!

But the Tea Party Patriots are not exculbable, either. I get their newsletters and THEY are following suit in the begging for money area. They’re holding some shindig in Arizona, soon, and there’s a hefty registration fee for attending. It’s as if they don’t want the hustings in their midst. Damned if I am going to travel somewhere to pay to see someone perform. If I want that, I’ll go to the Met and see Rigoletto. Come to think of it, it would be great to see Diana Damrau, Joseph Calleja, Giuseppe Filianoti, and Zeljko Lucic perform. But, alas, I digress…

What I see happening with the Tea Party is their selling out to special interests before they even become an official political party. I guess that’s why I’m an Independent. NO BODY OWNS ME.

*exculpable.

X-3 said:
What I see happening with the Tea Party is their selling out to special interests before they even become an official political party. I guess that’s why I’m an Independent. NO BODY OWNS ME.

Thanks for the kind words. I;m with you. I see one thing a hair differently. though similarly I always try to remember to be clear that the Tea Party movement is VERY diverse. The would-be coopters will get away with some things, but get called on others. The real tests will come as the GOP hacks and TeaPartyPretenders start their sellouts in the House. It is up to good people to go straight out and PROTEST THESE THINGS as they happen. We are going to need to fire some shots across their bows, threaten primary challenges, and continue to oust the fiscally irresponsible sellouts in the 2012 primaries.

The KEY is to follow people’s VOTING. What the nonstop cable news parade cycles is rhetoric, not action. It can be useful to follow the rhetoric, and when they can’t even get the rhetoric right you CAN write them off. But plenty of them are snake oil salesmen who are very good at playing the right rhetoric du jour.

Voting records are far more interesting and telling. Which is why with all the Johnny-come-latelys, we will need to be ALL OVER their votes and in their faces in a hurry when they start selling out.

I am still trying to figure Bachmann out, but in the vote checks I have done I am not pleased. I fear she may be just as you say.

There’s only one guy I trust in Congress, and that’s Ron Paul. His voting record is PRISTINE.

X-3 said:
From where I sit, I can see the inflitration of the hacks into the Tea Party. This may offend some, but I view Michelle Bachmann as one of those hacks. As I’ve said before, she’s a decent person, but she most definitely has an agenda, and her agenda is advancing Michelle Bachmann’s political career. Case in point: I used to get her newsletter but every damned month she was PLEADING for donations. That is NOT service to one’s country, it is service to one’s SELF!

It’s been said before that being in DC either discourages or corrupts sincere public servants. Individuals have to make a judgement call on where the line is drawn between serving the public and serving themselves. That effects honesty , who they take money from and make deals with etc. I find Bachman to be to be blatantly dishonest too often while wearing the Christian mantle. That’s a huge turn off to me and doesn’t indicate a public servant IMO.

Just_MC said:
Voting records are far more interesting and telling. Which is why with all the Johnny-come-latelys, we will need to be ALL OVER their votes and in their faces in a hurry when they start selling out.

I think this is true and we get being doing a better service as citizens if we keep track of our congress person’s and Senator’s voting record and let them know where we stand. I can respect someone who disagree with me if they’re willing to honestly and openly defend their views and be more concerned about facts than political spin.

What Barry meant was Lie, Plagiarize, Misrepresent, Falsify & Blow Smoke UP their Arses.

CosmosDan said:
I think this is true and we get being doing a better service as citizens if we keep track of our congress person’s and Senator’s voting record and let them know where we stand. I can respect someone who disagree with me if they’re willing to honestly and openly defend their views and be more concerned about facts than political spin.

Just_MC said:
Voting records are far more interesting and telling. Which is why with all the Johnny-come-latelys, we will need to be ALL OVER their votes and in their faces in a hurry when they start selling out.

OK, so we’ve got two seemingly politically diverse people saying pretty much the same thing. That’s GREAT! So, it appears that, as responsible citizens, our mission is twofold:

1. Read the bills and monitor the votes.

2. When we see some of our elected servants straying from their promises, write to those errant representatives and broadcast the news of their errant ways far and wide in hopes we can wake a few numbskulls up to the fact.

Does that about cover it?

X-3 said:
OK, so we’ve got two seemingly politically diverse people saying pretty much the same thing. That’s GREAT! So, it appears that, as responsible citizens, our mission is twofold:

1. Read the bills and monitor the votes.

2. When we see some of our elected servants straying from their promises, write to those errant representatives and broadcast the news of their errant ways far and wide in hopes we can wake a few numbskulls up to the fact.

Does that about cover it?

I think so.

I’d add that I’d love to see semi regular gatherings with both parties to allow speakers to discuss the issues and answer questions in an effort to encourage communication and understanding.

CosmosDan said:
I’d add that I’d love to see semi regular gatherings with both parties to allow speakers to discuss the issues and answer questions in an effort to encourage communication and understanding.

That might be a good idea if properly marketed and if substantive issues were discussed evenly and pragmatically. My question would be about venue: Would you suggest CSPAN? How about a segment on FOX? If it were done, I’m thinking it would have to be on a weekend, but as we both know, our elected servants aren’t too keen on working weekends–except during campaigns.